Assist the refs: swap cards for a transparent points system

[baldmosher]

I think one solution to the debate over refs and cards would be to have an open grading & points system for fouls -- we have the technology, it's called pen and paper -- ref openly informs his decision as to whether it's:
grade 1 = 1pt - accidental and innocuous foul
grade 2 = 2pts - accidental but in a dangerous position, or a little bit reckless; mild dissent
grade 3 = 3pts - take out the man forcefully along with the ball, i.e. in an overzealous challenge -- Scholes and Cattermole do these all the time
grade 4 = 4pts - take out the man with some semblance of winning the ball; dissent with foul language
grade 5 = 5pts - take out the man with a reckless challenge, perhaps even a strong suspicion that you deliberately took out the man
grade 6 = 6pts - any DOGSO inside the box = penalty
grade 7 = 7pts - accidental DOGSO outside the box; threatening conduct (facing off with or pushing an opponent, vitriolic dissent, leading with an arm, going in for a challenge with studs up)
grade 8 = 8pts - reckless DOGSO outside the box
grade 9 = 9pts - deliberate DOGSO where there's no attempt whatsoever to play the ball; extreme foul and abusive dissent or anything that would qualify as common assault on an official; extreme violent conduct (head butt, kick, punch, swung arm, leading with elbow for a header, etc.)

Not all of the above need result in a free kick, the ref can play advantage in all cases, and go back at the next stoppage to issue a warning of points issued. If he's getting pissed off with constant fouling from Stoke, he can try to note down as many as he can possibly remember but he's human so he can then give a free kick and warn a few of their players at a time not to be so naughty.

If we can't transfer the accumulated points per player to the crowd via the scoreboard, then:
Accumulate 5 or more points = yellow card as a visual warning
Accumulate 10 or more points = second yellow (i.e. red) card and you're off pal

You'll notice I've removed the straight red card with this grading system, but it would instead leave a defender walking the DOGSO tightrope as soon as he commits just one innocuous foul, and would effectively reduce the competitiveness of any player who commits a reckless DOGSO in the first 5 minutes with his first foul. I suppose the straight red card could be reserved for extreme cases, such as plain old fist fighting, stamping on an opponent, deliberate or reckless attempts to seriously injure an opponent in a "tackle" (e.g. Taylorvs Eduardo, Balotelli vs Kiev, Keane vs Haaland).

Basically this system is what we're already using now, except with no transparency. Tim Cahill gets away with ten grade 1 fouls in a match without a yellow card, and Evans gets away without a red card just because the ref doesn't have this helpful points system in place to quite clearly justify his red card decision to Taggart afterwards.

I can see the reasons behind having a straight red card in place but it's overused as it spoils the game.

Recent examples I can think of:

Balotelli vs Song - grade 7, yellow and a warning
Song vs Yaya - grade 7, yellow and a warning
Balotelli vs ?? (red card) - grade 5, send him off (he'd be off already in this match)

Derry vs Young (ignoring the offside and dive) - grade 6, so penalty and yellow card

Kompany vs Nani - somewhere between 2 and 5, at worst 7
Giggs vs Aguero - probably 5 or 7

 

[markbmcfc]

Couldn't be arsed to read it all but DOGSO stood out. I think Dogs could be better at reffing too.

 

[baldmosher]

Couldn't be arsed to read it all but DOGSO stood out. I think Dogs could be better at reffing too.

SHOULD I HAVE WRITTEN THE WHOLE POST IN CAPITALS?

 

[es1]

that system far too compliated for an official to assess and track in play

you appear to have descibed songs tackle on yaya as denial of an obvious goal scoring opportunity, is that what you believe or was that a mistake??

going off your system I'd class it as 'grade 1' as it was not in a dangerous position

 

[kenzie115]

Sounds like a decent system, I'd probably tweak a few things and need to know what DOGSO meant but it looks good.

However, there's no chance of getting it introduced, half the people who watch (and play for that matter) football are dullards and would have serious difficulty understanding or remembering that system.

 

[es1]

Sounds like a decent system, I'd probably tweak a few things and need to know what DOGSO meant but it looks good.

However, there's no chance of getting it introduced, half the people who watch (and play for that matter) football are dullards and would have serious difficulty understanding or remembering that system.

denial of an obvious goal scoring opportunity

 

[the-ecstacy-of-eight]

If the refs have difficulties giving cards now, imagine how much difficulty they'd have implementing this system. They can't even decide if something's a foul or a dive with the system we've got now, imagine them attempting to decide if it was a grade three foul or a grade 163 foul (or whatever it went up to in your list), so sorry, it's a no from me mate, I'M OUT! It's far too complicated a system, but that's just my opinion.......and by the way, I'm no dullard, I've got three university degrees (no not media studies) and I had difficulty following what you were on about if I'm honest. :)

 

[Quinny851]

The problem we're having is that everything is down to opinion. Things that might been seen as a foul to me may not be seen as a foul to someone else.

Refs appear to be bent and have appeared that way for years but unfortunately that will never change regardless of the system we have in place.

 

[danebanksheik]

to me it would be easier to have a row of judges sat at pitch side with a series of cards giving marks out of 6 like they do in ice skating or . . . . . diving and then they can knock of the highest and lowest and then calculate the average of the square root of the reminder to find the appropriate hue of card between yellow and red to issue.

 

[baldmosher]

Sounds like a decent system, I'd probably tweak a few things

Of course. I'm not the FA. I'm just making a start

that system far too compliated for an official to assess and track in play

you appear to have descibed songs tackle on yaya as denial of an obvious goal scoring opportunity, is that what you believe or was that a mistake??

going off your system I'd class it as 'grade 1' as it was not in a dangerous position

OK, depending on the ref's view and opinion, 4 or 7. At worst, going in for a tackle leading with your knee is flipping dangerous and therefore "threatening conduct" (7) the way I saw it. Or at best, a very clumsy challenge (4).


The crux of the matter is that refs will still see what they want to see, but they now can't send off Boyata for a mistimed tackle in the first 10 minutes, Derry for stroking Young's arm, and can't send off Kompany for a messy but ultimately clean tackle, no matter how many feet he used (one, for the record) or how politely Rooney shouts at the ref (2, mild dissent).

I think some are overcomplicating the complexity of this.

It's already too complicated for a ref to keep track of how many innocuous fouls Cahill has committed, or how many of utd's players have taken it in turns to kick SWP really hard so that eventually he's injured. Not sure you could stop that happening, but we'd see the number who had committed grade 3/4/5 offences against him and one or two might also be "on a 9" and so treading carefully. You could then accumulate points, not cards, over a season, which would see Cahill banned every so often for being a dirty little twat who somehow never gets booked, and Cattermole banned every few games, which he does anyway.

Is it really that more complicated than remembering all the laws of the game, or understanding offside, or prescribing a list of mandatory yellow card card that some refs don't give if the player is on a second yellow and wearing an AON logo on his shirt?

If you need to simplify the system, just grade every incident from 1 to 8 by yourself and make sure you let us know what you decided afterwards. If we have a problem with that decision we have to decide whether we scream at your for it and pick up another 4pts or just take it on the chin and get on with the game.

I might at some point get really bored and apply these rules over a match for one player and see what I come out with.