BBC Sport article on UEFA coefficient scoring

[Mr Partridge]

If I understand the system correctly(which I may not do!) then it seems the whole thing is geared towards making it easier for the teams who have been in the CL for a number of years. So basically the longer you've been in it, the easier draws you get. It seems they don't like new teams coming along and it takes a long time to be accepted into it as far as UEFA are concerned. Basically the logic is you have to spend a good few years in the Champions League before you give yourself a better chance of winning the thing, looking at how long it took Chelsea and the Rags for example would back this up. Yet how come everybody is expecting us to go and win it in only our first couple of years when the whole competition is geared towards making it harder for us? We got so much stick for our record in it and yet logic would tell you that if we won it this year or next, it would be a huge overachievement.

That's if I've understood correctly how it works of course, if I haven't then just ignore this post!

 

[Citizen_Ando]

Actual champions (regardless of country) should really get some additional recognition/points or whatever. Would love it to return to a true cup knockout tournament but obviously that will never happen. It's still a fantastic tournament no doubt, but to call it the 'Champions League' is like calling Michael Owen a decent co-commentator.

 

[stonerblue]

There's absolutely nowt wrong with it. There are ranking systems in loads of sports that work in exactly the same way. In recent years we've finished in the top 3 three times (about eight times in our entire history), won the league once, played 12 CL games, fucked up in the Europa league when we could have got more points, didn't even get third place last season to get into the EL; Arsenal have played in the competition since the 90s and have finished in the qualifying places for it more times than we have.

This competition isn't for the Champions of a domestic league. It shouldn't be called the Champions Lg. for a start it's as much a knock-out comp as it is a league and there are as many none champions playing in it than champions, if not more. It's not about being a champion, it's about qualifying in qualifying places and Arsenal have done that for a long period of time. They've also reached far further in the comp than we have.

You won't find many people who hate Arsenal as much as me on here, but I think they deserve the higher ranking points and pot places than we do.

but Arsenal have done rock-all recently. The system should be more up to date, say the preceding 2 seasons.
The present system maintains the status quo for an entrenched minority.

 

[1.618034]

Whether you think it is fair probably depends on which club you support and which country you come from.

It's fair.

QED

 

[edgecroft]

Listen, if you are from a country with at least one automatic berth in the group stages and you have to get in via a qualifying playoff, then you shouldn't be in the top two pots. Easy rule to make.

 

[ManCitizens.]

There's absolutely nowt wrong with it. There are ranking systems in loads of sports that work in exactly the same way. In recent years we've finished in the top 3 three times (about eight times in our entire history), won the league once, played 12 CL games, fucked up in the Europa league when we could have got more points, didn't even get third place last season to get into the EL; Arsenal have played in the competition since the 90s and have finished in the qualifying places for it more times than we have.

This competition isn't for the Champions of a domestic league. It shouldn't be called the Champions Lg. for a start it's as much a knock-out comp as it is a league and there are as many none champions playing in it than champions, if not more. It's not about being a champion, it's about qualifying in qualifying places and Arsenal have done that for a long period of time. They've also reached far further in the comp than we have.

You won't find many people who hate Arsenal as much as me on here, but I think they deserve the higher ranking points and pot places than we do.

but Arsenal have done rock-all recently. The system should be more up to date, say the preceding 2 seasons.
The present system maintains the status quo for an entrenched minority.

The system is based on a six year cycle. In the past 6 years, Arsenal have been the 6th best team (points wise). Simple as that.

Or we could do it your way and base it only on last years performance. That way we'd be in pot 4.

 

[mike channon´s windmill]

How the fook did Spuds get such a relatively easy draw then a few years back?

 

[East Level 2]

The present system maintains the status quo for an entrenched minority.

Correct, but that is what it was intended to do. The clubs running UEFA were pulling Platini by his todger and he agreed to all their demands.
But this discussion will go on every year even though nobody at "the top clubs" wants a fair system.
Just as every year we get the bollocks about FA Cup semi finals being at Wembley even though that has been set in stone in order to pay for the place.
When the top clubs threatened to form a breakaway league UEFA should have let them go but ensured they couldn't play in their national leagues and couldn't return without starting at the bottom if the European league went tits up. However once UEFA saw the potential TV money and realised they could get a share they spread their cheeks for the G14 and we got a system that ensure the rich get richer and maintain their positions at the top.
That select few was threatened by City and a couple of others so FFP was introduced.

 

[rossonero]

Whether you think it is fair probably depends on which club you support and which country you come from.

It's fair.

QED

I like Champions League more than European Cup, it's ten time more interesting and exciting.
That said, let's talk about Atletico.
In the last 4 years they were in Europa League, they won EL twice and now they are in pot 2. I don't think that this is maintains the status quo. PSV have one good year and they are pot 2. Dortmund is pot 3 but they are unlucky (they have the higher rank in pot 3), next year they are pot 2 for sure, maybe even pot 1.
Arsenal is in pot 1 because they always qualifying and always pass the group stage.
This year they can get a really really bad group or an easy one, you can't say they shouldn't be in pot 1 because they are always lucky with the draw.
Finally you were crap every years in Europe (thanks to Mancini in my opinion) so you really can't talk.

 

[1.618034]

It's fair.

QED

I like Champions League more than European Cup, it's ten time more interesting and exciting.
That said, let's talk about Atletico.
In the last 4 years they were in Europa League, they won EL twice and now they are in pot 2. I don't think that this is maintains the status quo. PSV have one good year and they are pot 2. Dortmund is pot 3 but they are unlucky (they have the higher rank in pot 3), next year they are pot 2 for sure, maybe even pot 1.
Arsenal is in pot 1 because they always qualifying and always pass the group stage.
This year they can get a really really bad group or an easy one, you can't say they shouldn't be in pot 1 because they are always lucky with the draw.
Finally you were crap every years in Europe (thanks to Mancini in my opinion) so you really can't talk.

I know this might surprise you, but this isn't about our rating... We are where we deserve to be IMO as we haven't been good in the CL, yet. It's about fairness to the "smaller" clubs who have done well in the last season being drip fed co-efficient points...

To have the previous year's runners up ranked way below Arsenal, who manage to scrape in season after season is something of a joke that this particular historical system throws up.

I'd reduce the number of years that qualify to 1, 2 or 3 maximum, although I'd be happy if it was just scrapped tbh.

Also, for me, it's not about what teams we'd like to watch on the telly, it's about giving everyone a fighting/sporting chance. Why should the bigger/traditional clubs get preferential treatment? Arsenal had to play in a qualifying round, again, so how come they get seeded in pot 1, whilst Dortmund go into pot 3?

The reason the FA Cup is/was held in high esteem is because of the chance that "minnows" have by getting good results and not having to play "giants" in every round, which obviously reduces their chances of progression. We call it "The Romance of the Cup"...

But it's modern football's way (The PL, CL and FFPR) to preserve the status quo and keep the big clubs at the top... And for me and a lot of others that stinks!