City & FFP | 2020/21 Accounts released | Revenues of £569.8m, £2.4m profit (p 2395)

[Anonymous]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

The depressing thing is that the dream we are living is no longer one fans of Sunderland and Villa and Everton and West Ham can even daydream about. With FFP in play what are the chances that Villa could be taken over by someone determined to propel them to the latter stages of the champions league? Those decent mackems we met at Wembley, those hammers who took the piss out of us at Upton Park when we were only 9-0 up, they have no chance whatever of making real waves in the Champions League. It is a completely closed shop to them. That is just wrong.

I can tell you now (and you could just as easily tell me) who 7 of the top 10 teams in Europe will be in ten years time and that is truly depressing.

Good post that mate. We've spent too much time pontificating on the minutiae of what particular aspect of the rules might mean specifically for one club (i.e. us) for one season.

The much bigger picture is that these rules are evil. They condemn 90+ % of clubs to never being able to compete at the top table, ever, no matter what they do. No matter how well run, how popular, how successful. Just barred, forever.

Sad and certainly to the detriment of football as a whole. I hope the Bosman guys legal challenge is successful and they are ripped up.

Both the way City are being treated (we have actually done nothing wrong) and the fact that the dream is killed for so many other clubs is so depressing. What's wrong with someone taking , say, Derby County and doing what Sheikh Mansour has done? We are not in any debt - we are viable. The people In charge of those clubs who voted for it in the Premier League have done their own clubs a great disservice. This so-called "Financial Fair Play" is totally immoral, unfair and yes, evil. I pray the Bosman guy wins too.

Again, we are confusing fans with owners. The owners of these clubs frankly couldn't give a fuck about it. It's a get out of jail free for them. Let's take Kenwright for example. Constantly bleating about needing investment and how he hasn't the money to compete. FFP absolves him of ever having to put his hand in his pocket to meet fans' expectations/dreams, keeps him in charge of a famous football club and the profile that goes with that and allows him to continue to cream off the top from EFC.

It's manna from heaven for those owners.

 

[BlueAnorak]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

Fascinating how only the Independent have run with the story. Even the half wit at the Telegraph hasn't run with it which us surprising as he'll publish any old crap that gets troll clicks.

 

[Bodicoteblue]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

Good post that mate. We've spent too much time pontificating on the minutiae of what particular aspect of the rules might mean specifically for one club (i.e. us) for one season.

The much bigger picture is that these rules are evil. They condemn 90+ % of clubs to never being able to compete at the top table, ever, no matter what they do. No matter how well run, how popular, how successful. Just barred, forever.

Sad and certainly to the detriment of football as a whole. I hope the Bosman guys legal challenge is successful and they are ripped up.

Both the way City are being treated (we have actually done nothing wrong) and the fact that the dream is killed for so many other clubs is so depressing. What's wrong with someone taking , say, Derby County and doing what Sheikh Mansour has done? We are not in any debt - we are viable. The people In charge of those clubs who voted for it in the Premier League have done their own clubs a great disservice. This so-called "Financial Fair Play" is totally immoral, unfair and yes, evil. I pray the Bosman guy wins too.

Again, we are confusing fans with owners. The owners of these clubs frankly couldn't give a fuck about it. It's a get out of jail free for them. Let's take Kenwright for example. Constantly bleating about needing investment and how he hasn't the money to compete. FFP absolves him of ever having to put his hand in his pocket to meet fans' expectations/dreams, keeps him in charge of a famous football club and the profile that goes with that and allows him to continue to cream off the top from EFC.

It's manna from heaven for those owners.

Yep , when the new TV money was announced I image it made up some minds which way to vote .

 

[paul1894]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

im no financial whizkid,but does ffp not encroach into the restriction of trade area,thus not allowing clubs to spend x amounts to compete with other larger clubs in the ucl,etc therefore restricting clubs ability to win the ucl

 

[Zabbasbeard]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

Good post that mate. We've spent too much time pontificating on the minutiae of what particular aspect of the rules might mean specifically for one club (i.e. us) for one season.

The much bigger picture is that these rules are evil. They condemn 90+ % of clubs to never being able to compete at the top table, ever, no matter what they do. No matter how well run, how popular, how successful. Just barred, forever.

Sad and certainly to the detriment of football as a whole. I hope the Bosman guys legal challenge is successful and they are ripped up.

Both the way City are being treated (we have actually done nothing wrong) and the fact that the dream is killed for so many other clubs is so depressing. What's wrong with someone taking , say, Derby County and doing what Sheikh Mansour has done? We are not in any debt - we are viable. The people In charge of those clubs who voted for it in the Premier League have done their own clubs a great disservice. This so-called "Financial Fair Play" is totally immoral, unfair and yes, evil. I pray the Bosman guy wins too.

Again, we are confusing fans with owners. The owners of these clubs frankly couldn't give a fuck about it. It's a get out of jail free for them. Let's take Kenwright for example. Constantly bleating about needing investment and how he hasn't the money to compete. FFP absolves him of ever having to put his hand in his pocket to meet fans' expectations/dreams, keeps him in charge of a famous football club and the profile that goes with that and allows him to continue to cream off the top from EFC.

It's manna from heaven for those owners.

No confusion here. I well understand this so-called FFP allows Kenwright to say "They aren't letting me invest" when he knows full well he can't or won't whilst pocketing a profit in some cases. The point is the Kenwrights, Ashleys and Lerners are still doing their clubs a disservice by locking them out of competing for the League etc. These are great clubs - one of them a European Champion no less, and Everton have won a few more pots than our dear old City - whose owners are effectively saying "We'll settle for 5th place and anything else is a bonus" whilst trousering the cash. Yes so-called FFP works very well for them too, but to the detriment of their clubs and football. And that surprise, surprise, is barely highlighted in the media

 

[Clevers]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

So what's the worst case scenario

Breaking...SSN taking us live to the City boardroom as the punishment is announced

lol

Why's Suarez in our boardroom.

 

[I'm no cynic but...]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

Both the way City are being treated (we have actually done nothing wrong) and the fact that the dream is killed for so many other clubs is so depressing. What's wrong with someone taking , say, Derby County and doing what Sheikh Mansour has done? We are not in any debt - we are viable. The people In charge of those clubs who voted for it in the Premier League have done their own clubs a great disservice. This so-called "Financial Fair Play" is totally immoral, unfair and yes, evil. I pray the Bosman guy wins too.

Again, we are confusing fans with owners. The owners of these clubs frankly couldn't give a fuck about it. It's a get out of jail free for them. Let's take Kenwright for example. Constantly bleating about needing investment and how he hasn't the money to compete. FFP absolves him of ever having to put his hand in his pocket to meet fans' expectations/dreams, keeps him in charge of a famous football club and the profile that goes with that and allows him to continue to cream off the top from EFC.

It's manna from heaven for those owners.

No confusion here. I well understand this so-called FFP allows Kenwright to say "They aren't letting me invest" when he knows full well he can't or won't whilst pocketing a profit in some cases. The point is the Kenwrights, Ashleys and Lerners are still doing their clubs a disservice by locking them out of competing for the League etc.

And to add to this, by never having access to funds that would help their clubs become a footballing force, they will each be owners of clubs that have no worldwide appeal which will result in poor merchandise sales and a complete lack of interest from TV viewers. I have enough trouble of my own watching these non-achievers on the box and I would think that global appeal is even lower. The result of this is that each of these clubs MAY achieve a small profit in most years, but it will be a struggle, and when the day comes when each owner tries to sell up his stake, there will be few takers and they will be looking at a loss in most cases. If this is what these people voted for, then good luck to them. I personally wouldn't want to a turkey as Xmas approaches, but obviously they find it appealing.

 

[dctid]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

im no financial whizkid,but does ffp not encroach into the restriction of trade area,thus not allowing clubs to spend x amounts to compete with other larger clubs in the ucl,etc therefore restricting clubs ability to win the ucl

No there are restrictions in many many aspects of life - in sport the most obvious one being a salary cap in rugby union which effectively means that many many of the bif French clubs which have no restrictions are able to attract players whom for example play in the English leagues

There have and always will be restirctions on trade - i work for a foreign national company which has embargoes on many many countries around the world

The whole champions league thing was and never will be about anything other than the ex G14

 

[Prestwich_Blue]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

Good post that mate. We've spent too much time pontificating on the minutiae of what particular aspect of the rules might mean specifically for one club (i.e. us) for one season.

The much bigger picture is that these rules are evil. They condemn 90+ % of clubs to never being able to compete at the top table, ever, no matter what they do. No matter how well run, how popular, how successful. Just barred, forever.

Sad and certainly to the detriment of football as a whole. I hope the Bosman guys legal challenge is successful and they are ripped up.

Both the way City are being treated (we have actually done nothing wrong) and the fact that the dream is killed for so many other clubs is so depressing. What's wrong with someone taking , say, Derby County and doing what Sheikh Mansour has done? We are not in any debt - we are viable. The people In charge of those clubs who voted for it in the Premier League have done their own clubs a great disservice. This so-called "Financial Fair Play" is totally immoral, unfair and yes, evil. I pray the Bosman guy wins too.

Again, we are confusing fans with owners. The owners of these clubs frankly couldn't give a fuck about it. It's a get out of jail free for them. Let's take Kenwright for example. Constantly bleating about needing investment and how he hasn't the money to compete. FFP absolves him of ever having to put his hand in his pocket to meet fans' expectations/dreams, keeps him in charge of a famous football club and the profile that goes with that and allows him to continue to cream off the top from EFC.

It's manna from heaven for those owners.

Abso-fucking-lutely.

Owners like Kenwright and Ashley would have been delighted, as they've now got a ready made excuse not to spend anymore than they have to and to keep money in the club.

 

[dobobobo]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

And the sheiks response is:

Love it!

 

[Zabbasbeard]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

Both the way City are being treated (we have actually done nothing wrong) and the fact that the dream is killed for so many other clubs is so depressing. What's wrong with someone taking , say, Derby County and doing what Sheikh Mansour has done? We are not in any debt - we are viable. The people In charge of those clubs who voted for it in the Premier League have done their own clubs a great disservice. This so-called "Financial Fair Play" is totally immoral, unfair and yes, evil. I pray the Bosman guy wins too.

Again, we are confusing fans with owners. The owners of these clubs frankly couldn't give a fuck about it. It's a get out of jail free for them. Let's take Kenwright for example. Constantly bleating about needing investment and how he hasn't the money to compete. FFP absolves him of ever having to put his hand in his pocket to meet fans' expectations/dreams, keeps him in charge of a famous football club and the profile that goes with that and allows him to continue to cream off the top from EFC.

It's manna from heaven for those owners.

Abso-fucking-lutely.

Owners like Kenwright and Ashley would have been delighted, as they've now got a ready made excuse not to spend anymore than they have to and to keep money in the club.

...and take a little bit more out of the club....or with the latest TV deal...quite a lot more!

 

[Chippy_boy]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

Both the way City are being treated (we have actually done nothing wrong) and the fact that the dream is killed for so many other clubs is so depressing. What's wrong with someone taking , say, Derby County and doing what Sheikh Mansour has done? We are not in any debt - we are viable. The people In charge of those clubs who voted for it in the Premier League have done their own clubs a great disservice. This so-called "Financial Fair Play" is totally immoral, unfair and yes, evil. I pray the Bosman guy wins too.

Again, we are confusing fans with owners. The owners of these clubs frankly couldn't give a fuck about it. It's a get out of jail free for them. Let's take Kenwright for example. Constantly bleating about needing investment and how he hasn't the money to compete. FFP absolves him of ever having to put his hand in his pocket to meet fans' expectations/dreams, keeps him in charge of a famous football club and the profile that goes with that and allows him to continue to cream off the top from EFC.

It's manna from heaven for those owners.

Abso-fucking-lutely.

Owners like Kenwright and Ashley would have been delighted, as they've now got a ready made excuse not to spend anymore than they have to and to keep money in the club.

It's blindingly obvious why these pricks voted in the PL equivalent FFP rules, blindingly obvious. The only thing that surprised me was that Scudamore was weak enough to allow it to happen. The success of the PL has been to the enormous benefit of all the clubs fortunate enough to be in it. And yet they have unilaterally brought in rules that will limit the PL's ability to attract the very top talent going forward. Stupid doesn't describe it. If in 20 years time La Liga or some other league is the one bringing in the biggest TV audiences and revenues, they only have themselves to blame.

 

[Anonymous]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

Both the way City are being treated (we have actually done nothing wrong) and the fact that the dream is killed for so many other clubs is so depressing. What's wrong with someone taking , say, Derby County and doing what Sheikh Mansour has done? We are not in any debt - we are viable. The people In charge of those clubs who voted for it in the Premier League have done their own clubs a great disservice. This so-called "Financial Fair Play" is totally immoral, unfair and yes, evil. I pray the Bosman guy wins too.

Again, we are confusing fans with owners. The owners of these clubs frankly couldn't give a fuck about it. It's a get out of jail free for them. Let's take Kenwright for example. Constantly bleating about needing investment and how he hasn't the money to compete. FFP absolves him of ever having to put his hand in his pocket to meet fans' expectations/dreams, keeps him in charge of a famous football club and the profile that goes with that and allows him to continue to cream off the top from EFC.

It's manna from heaven for those owners.

Abso-fucking-lutely.

Owners like Kenwright and Ashley would have been delighted, as they've now got a ready made excuse not to spend anymore than they have to and to keep money in the club.

Gonna be funny when the penny finally drops with fans of those clubs. It'll probably be when they uncover the next *insert overhyped English player name here* from their youth teams (should they still bother with them) and end up flogging them to one of the cartel for fucking peanuts as the cartel then will bleat how they are hamstrung by not being able to spend due to FFP.

It's off trotted out but West Ham had a phenomenal nucleus including Cole & Lampard way back. At least they got semi decent money for them back then (£6.5m and £11m respectively). No chance of getting near that with FFP I'd imagine!

"Here's our promising young side, help yourselves cartel clubs; only £10.50 and a packet of peanuts. Buy one, get one free."

The cartel clubs all knew this. The owners of the other clubs all knew this. UEFA knew this. The fans swallowed the propaganda and have had their dreams and expectations expunged in one fell swoop. Of course, there will be the occasional exception thrown up in the odd season and UEFA will point to it as being evidence of the success of FFP, but as Chris In London (I think) put it, we can safely name 7 of the top 10 clubs in Europe in 2024. I'll take it a small step further, I imagine we could name 16 of the top 20.

 

[Chippy_boy]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

I suppose the only "hope" for a Derby County say - would be that someone bought them and spent £300m (or whatever the number is) on training and youth development like we are doing and waited 20 years for the talent to develop. That could possibly work, but there's little chance of anyone being prepared to stump up the money required with no realistic prospect of any success coming from it for such a long time.

 

[Marvin]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

I am not sure how FFP benefits speculative "investors" like Mike Ashley

There was a wave of new owners a few years ago, but as owners are not allowed to invest in their football clubs now, the attracting of buying a club dwindles, and therefore clubs like Everton, Newcastle and Sunderland are worth a lot less now than they would have been before FFP. That's my theory anyway. I don't know if it's true as these clubs aren't quoted on a stock exchange, so how do you value them.

 

[dctid]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

Again, we are confusing fans with owners. The owners of these clubs frankly couldn't give a fuck about it. It's a get out of jail free for them. Let's take Kenwright for example. Constantly bleating about needing investment and how he hasn't the money to compete. FFP absolves him of ever having to put his hand in his pocket to meet fans' expectations/dreams, keeps him in charge of a famous football club and the profile that goes with that and allows him to continue to cream off the top from EFC.

It's manna from heaven for those owners.

Abso-fucking-lutely.

Owners like Kenwright and Ashley would have been delighted, as they've now got a ready made excuse not to spend anymore than they have to and to keep money in the club.

...and take a little bit more out of the club....or with the latest TV deal...quite a lot more!

its no co-incidence that the new TV deal came very close with the financial restrictions

It means that mid table clubs will be able to cream dosh from the top - personally i have no issues with limiting debt but if owners want to spend money and providing its not a loan to the club but is a gift then i fail to see how this benefits anybody other tan City, Rags, Le Arse, Pool, Chelski everybody else including Spuds would rely on one or more of these clubs cocking up ala rags this year to break the top 4

I was getting bored when the sky 4 had the cartel on the league with football and this will have exactly the same effect

 

[Chippy_boy]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

I am not sure how FFP benefits speculative "investors" like Mike Ashley

There was a wave of new owners a few years ago, but as owners are not allowed to invest in their football clubs now, the attracting of buying a club dwindles, and therefore clubs like Everton, Newcastle and Sunderland are worth a lot less now than they would have been before FFP. That's my theory anyway. I don't know if it's true as these clubs aren't quoted on a stock exchange, so how do you value them.

I see your point and I guess you are right that the potential value of the club may be diminished. That said, the running costs will be reduced as well, so it depends whether they want to hold on to it for as long as possible (with lower running costs) or sell the business and make a return on their investment. I think they are all in it for the former, not the latter.

 

[Oooh Curley Wurley]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

With my limited knowledge, I understood that the viability of a business is shown on its balance sheet and not the profit and loss account?

 

[bluemoon27]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

Did anyone hear niall Quinn on talksport this morning talking about it,he said that he doesn't think we have been punished enough,just wtf have we done to this lanky streak of piss as to why he hates us so much

 

[Prestwich_Blue]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

I am not sure how FFP benefits speculative "investors" like Mike Ashley

There was a wave of new owners a few years ago, but as owners are not allowed to invest in their football clubs now, the attracting of buying a club dwindles, and therefore clubs like Everton, Newcastle and Sunderland are worth a lot less now than they would have been before FFP. That's my theory anyway. I don't know if it's true as these clubs aren't quoted on a stock exchange, so how do you value them.

That's a fair point but how many clubs are actually going to attract people like Sheikh Mansour or Abramovich? Not one club in the PL in the last 6 years since us. So even before FFP, who was rushing to buy these clubs?

Ashley doesn't want to invest in Newcastle. He just wants them to stay in the PL, around mid-table, avoiding the complications of the Europa League and the near disaster that season in the EL brought them. Then the BT Sport money comes in and he doesn't have to do anything at all and can even take money out.