City v Arsenal post match thread

[simon23]

I think, and hope, that one of the greatest outcomes of the Pep era at City will be, finally, the dawning realisation on our players that they no longer run the club, the manager does.

And not a day too soon.

I honestly believe Joe hart for example, yesterday, was trying it on, testing the water so to speak. A case of "listen you ****, I've been here for years, I've seen off Mancini, and Pellegrini, and if I want to see you off too then I will, and if I want to hoof the ball out of defense then I will do exactly that. I'm Joe hart. I make adverts for cheap shit shampoo. And I dye my eyelashes with permanent mascara. Come and have a go if you think you're hard enough"

Joe may turn out to be the first 'first name on the team sheet type player' to be shown the door. And if it is done soon enough the rewards will be reaped fast and hard when the rest of the squad realise that they are the tail, not the dog after all.

Honestly, if that is all Pep achieves (and it won't be of course) then he will be a success.

The one constant at city the last few years, that has caused me more anger and frustration than any other is the knowledge that some of our players still believe they are doing us a favour playing for us. Finally they have met their match. Bring it on and fuck some of them off. Whomever they may turn out to be.

And start with hart.

jeez so much vitriol aimed at hart..........

 

[TFC]

jeez so much vitriol aimed at hart..........

More upset at the pop at H&S, I've been flake free for years.

 

[Kazzydeyna]

More upset at the pop at H&S, I've been flake free for years.

Hahaha. Very good.

And you're not wrong either, it is very good shampoo.

 

[Terra Passenger]

The biggest take away I had from the game is that it's going to be a rough few weeks until our side learns to play the way Pep wants us to, primarily at the back. Now that Stones has signed we're in much better shape, but even with Stones I think that this will remain a work in progress.

 

[baggy]

The Arsenal game reminded me of when Brendan Rogers 1st took over at LOLerpool and their back line was all over the place trying to play it out from the back and they didnt have a clue what to do with the ball.

It's going to be a testing few months whilst the players adapt and i dont by any means think we are a shoe-in for the title this year but hopefully signing of Stones and getting the likes of Vinny back will stand us in good stead overall.

Very much looking forward to the new season but aprehensive (As always...) at the same time.

 

[BlueAnorak]

After watching the Arsenal game again I think this business of us playing the ball out from the back will fail and it will be quietly dropped after six or seven games.
It's quite apparent that Arsenal knew what to do when the ball was played back to Willy and then Joe, press up on the available players and close down the keeper. They did it several times and each time you could see that Joe and Willy wanted to clear the ball, but instead had to play it short to a player who in turn was quickly closed down till the ball was lost or Hart/Willy decided enough was enough and hoofed the ball upfield.
this will happen time and time again until, Pep will finally realise it isn't working and will change things.
I think Joe and Willy will be able to hack it, the issue judging by the Arsenal game is the inadequate passing ability of the the rest of the defence and midfield.
Players will have to quickly get into passing triangles to work the ball upfield and the Legacy players just aren't good enough or put in enough of a shift in to make it work.
Only Stones, Gundogan and Fernandinho will be anywhere near good enough at passing.
Zabaleta/Sagna on the right, Kolarov on the left Delph/Fernando in the middle certainly aren't good enough.
I'm not sure Kompany/Otamendi/Cliche are good enough either.

 

[mosssideblue]

Mostly every manager is eventually sacked. That or they eventually leave.

Is there another option?

 

[mosssideblue]

The biggest take away I had from the game is that it's going to be a rough few weeks until our side learns to play the way Pep wants us to, primarily at the back. Now that Stones has signed we're in much better shape, but even with Stones I think that this will remain a work in progress.

I agree and just hope we dont drop too many points during this period

 

[mosssideblue]

After watching the Arsenal game again I think this business of us playing the ball out from the back will fail and it will be quietly dropped after six or seven games.
It's quite apparent that Arsenal knew what to do when the ball was played back to Willy and then Joe, press up on the available players and close down the keeper. They did it several times and each time you could see that Joe and Willy wanted to clear the ball, but instead had to play it short to a player who in turn was quickly closed down till the ball was lost or Hart/Willy decided enough was enough and hoofed the ball upfield.
this will happen time and time again until, Pep will finally realise it isn't working and will change things.
I think Joe and Willy will be able to hack it, the issue judging by the Arsenal game is the inadequate passing ability of the the rest of the defence and midfield.
Players will have to quickly get into passing triangles to work the ball upfield and the Legacy players just aren't good enough or put in enough of a shift in to make it work.
Only Stones, Gundogan and Fernandinho will be anywhere near good enough at passing.
Zabaleta/Sagna on the right, Kolarov on the left Delph/Fernando in the middle certainly aren't good enough.
I'm not sure Kompany/Otamendi/Cliche are good enough either.

Interesting viewpoint and I'm sure some may agree. I personally think pep will persevere though

 

[BlueAnorak]

Interesting viewpoint and I'm sure some may agree. I personally think pep will persevere though

You may be right. Thinking about it though he is more likely to modify it to clear the ball upfield once sufficient opposition players are drawn upfield to press. A dangerous game to play though.

 

[mosssideblue]

You may be right. Thinking about it though he is more likely to modify it to clear the ball upfield once sufficient opposition players are drawn upfield to press. A dangerous game to play though.

whatever he decides, cannot wait to see it in action

 

[Shaelumstash]

Don't ask me, I genuinely don't understand the game anymore, it all seems to have got very complicated. My view was always that a good manager would bring in a few players to put his stamp on things at a new club but by and large would use tactics that would suit the players at his disposal and get the best out of them especially if the squad he was inheriting was reasonable. Seems that's all very passé now. All I know is that we have a squad that most of the outside world would say is probably in the top 2 or 3 in the country. Last year most people made us favourites due to the strength of our playing squad (it certainly wasn't due to having a good manager). But all I read on here is that Pep can't possibly get us functioning because the midfielders aren't athletic enough, the defenders aren't good enough footballers and the keeper who has played a huge part in almost everything we have won in the modern era is shit. Either Pep isn't as good a manager as people say he is or lots of people are talking bollocks. Just my opinion, obviously.

I think it's the latter, mate - people are talking bollocks.

It's quite clear from Pep Confidential that he tried to implement his Barca style on Bayern from the very start. He tried to convert Ribery in to playing the the "False 9" (sorry) position that Messi had been playing so well. Guardiola was convinced with Ribery's quality for taking people on in wide areas, he could adapt to do this centrally. He was wrong. It became clear from quite early on that RIbery didn't have the intelligence to adapt his game, he didn't really understand what Pep wanted from him.

Over time at Bayern he completely changed and adapted to his players, to the league to the opposition. Boeteng was playing direct 60 yard cross field balls, he sometimes played 2 up front, they would change systems for every game, sometimes 2 or 3 times a game. He's on record as saying the style of play, the shape that he choses is dictated by the players he has available, the opposition's strengths and weaknesses, basically the polar opposite of Pellegrini.

There are some people getting irate that we don't have the players to "play the Guardiola way". They are saying this before we have even playd a competitive game! We've played 3 pre-season games and there have been loads of positives. But pre-season is for getting players fit, getting them ready. The performances and results are secondary. If we lose the first 3 games league with Fernando and Kolarov at centre back and he carries on playing them there, then maybe it will be cause for concern. But I wouldn't get too worried about a 60 minute performance in pre season.

 

[Lancet Fluke]

I think it's the latter, mate - people are talking bollocks.

It's quite clear from Pep Confidential that he tried to implement his Barca style on Bayern from the very start. He tried to convert Ribery in to playing the the "False 9" (sorry) position that Messi had been playing so well. Guardiola was convinced with Ribery's quality for taking people on in wide areas, he could adapt to do this centrally. He was wrong. It became clear from quite early on that RIbery didn't have the intelligence to adapt his game, he didn't really understand what Pep wanted from him.

Over time at Bayern he completely changed and adapted to his players, to the league to the opposition. Boeteng was playing direct 60 yard cross field balls, he sometimes played 2 up front, they would change systems for every game, sometimes 2 or 3 times a game. He's on record as saying the style of play, the shape that he choses is dictated by the players he has available, the opposition's strengths and weaknesses, basically the polar opposite of Pellegrini.

There are some people getting irate that we don't have the players to "play the Guardiola way". They are saying this before we have even playd a competitive game! We've played 3 pre-season games and there have been loads of positives. But pre-season is for getting players fit, getting them ready. The performances and results are secondary. If we lose the first 3 games league with Fernando and Kolarov at centre back and he carries on playing them there, then maybe it will be cause for concern. But I wouldn't get too worried about a 60 minute performance in pre season.

I assume you are correct, he's clearly an exceptional manager. This idea people seem to have that such an intelligent and talented manager can only function if he has 11 outrageously athletic, skilful players on the pitch or that he will just relentlessly stick exactly to one way of playing even if it is proven that the players can't do it, just seems crazy to me. I have no doubt that a couple of years down the line he will want us to play in exactly his preferred way but given that he can't change the entire team in one, two (or maybe even three) windows, it wouldn't exactly be an indication of greatness if he wasn't remotely able or prepared to adapt to what he has at his disposal in the meantime. Plus the way people talk you'd think we have a bunch of pub players which also gets on my tits. I won't lie, it does put the fear of god into me that he's playing Kolarov at centre back 6 days before the season starts but as you say, it was just a friendly. The main positive that I took from that match was that at times in the first half it looked like our passing was coming back to what it used to be, more of it going forwards and a lot crisper and more decisive after a year or two of lacklustre, sideways shit that ended up with us losing our way as the attacking force we should have been.

 

[Maldeika]

Some need to define what they think the Guardiola way to play is.

I told you that too many people will read Pep Confidential (not just the people in the forum, I see that from press articles, too) without looking into the last two seasons of Bayern. And if they look onto all three years it is only about the semi final losses... Pep Confidential is about the year he tried to make Barcelona in a Baycelona - just that Bayern's players had other strengths.

Guardiola's way is not to play a 4-3-3 or a system - or special players used in a system. It is about keeping the ball away from the opposition through own possession play, about positional play and team cohesion, team oriented pressing, adaptability to the occasion...
I would add a high line to it, too - as it is important for his match - without it the distances between the own players get to big to successfully play - and I only have seen him play a low line in one match - the cup final against Dortmund 2 years ago. It was one of the only matches, too, in which Bayern has played with a real defensive sweeping midfielder.