What a waste if your time, and everyone else's. I'm more right wing than you are mate, and no apologist for regimes like that in China.
But right now I really could not give one nano toss of all this he said she said bollocks. Sorry but it's a total yawn.
I mean so what if you win your argument? Who the fuck cares?
We have a whale of a bigger fish to fry right now.
It’s several European countries that are sending dodgy masks back, Spain and Holland have done recently.
I can’t respond to everyone and there’s a number of posts coming my way.
But just because the West are shifting blame for their own shortcomings, it doesn’t make what they’re saying false.
My wife knows the area, I gather it's a fairly common sight in Llandudnoto see these goats wander in for a midnight chomp, but with people isolating and so few cars about they're wandering in by day.
You make some persuasive points, but your post conspicuously fails to address the root cause of this pandemic, namely China’s apparent absence of satisfactory, or even rudimentary hygiene standards within its livestock industry - and specifically its wet markets. This is a discernibly common occurrence within this debate, but it avoids discussion around the cause of the pandemic and a therefore a significant degree of responsibility thereto.Taiwan said they thought there was a high risk of it, not that it definitely was
On the cover up, the genome was shared the day the first patient died. That’s not exactly indicative of a cover up nor is it that long into a lifecycle of a new virus. As soon as China did confirm H2H transmission they went into lockdown three days later, far earlier in their cycle than a lot of subsequent countries have done.
They absolutely could have been more transparent at the beginning (although hindsight is a wonderful thing to an extent with that) and the shunning of Taiwan in general, although a separate point, is always a depressing story.
The reason you’ll get some defending China to an extent though is a pushback against the narrative being set in some western countries (ourselves and the States in particular) to pin even more blame on them to distract from their own failings and to also sow the first seeds in the next battle, which will be the economic one to come after this.
China aren’t accountable for the guidance that the WHO sets. It was them that said to continue with international travel post China’s lockdown and took so long to call a pandemic, both of which caused far more damage than how long it took for the confirmation of H2H transmission. It was some of the western governments that dragged their heels to react whilst not just Taiwan but South Korea and Singapore in particular got their act together.
Ultimately though, right now none of that matters. How we get through this and how we recover from it is down to ourselves as a society and our own government. So far they’ve done some things badly (only sorting out the testing of front line workers late last week as a prime example) and some things very well. The blame game right now means nothing apart from dealing with the present as that’s all that matters, the full post mortem needs to come a long way down the line yet.
You make some persuasive points, but your post conspicuously fails to address the root cause of this pandemic, namely China’s apparent absence of satisfactory, or even rudimentary hygiene standards within its livestock industry - and specifically its wet markets. This is a discernibly common occurrence within this debate, but it avoids discussion around the cause of the pandemic and a therefore a significant degree of responsibility thereto.
For me, the Chinese governments wider response since the story broke has been ok. I think they’ve been reasonably collaborative with the outside world and covering up and massaging figures isn’t the exclusive preserve of the Chinese government, that's for sure. In any event, it should have been apparent to western governments what they were contending some time ago, within the world we inhabit today,
This pandemic was entirely avoidable if adequate constraints were in place preventing, or at least significantly mitigating the risk of viruses jumping from species to species. It was avoidable principally because it has happened before and associated warnings were provided. The risk had been clearly identified and wholly inadequate steps were taken to tackle the threat. This is a government that has manifestly proved adept at setting rules and enforcing them rigorously in relation to other problems that have presented themselves, so they have no excuses for failing to act.
it seems to question this apparent lack of care and foresight, to raise this concern, as something that needs to be robustly tackled if we are to avoid repeating this again, leaves one open to accusations of latent racism from some quarters, which is simply absurd.
China, and much the rest of south east Asia needs to get a grip in this issue, and sharpish, and pointing this out is a perfectly reasonable and reasoned thing to do.
Yes but it’s still nothing to do with the Chinese government on the masks. A lot of it is false or at best disingenuous, it doesn’t take much to find some of it out. It’s modern politics in general for you though. All sides of the political spectrum and all big countries do it.
You make some persuasive points, but your post conspicuously fails to address the root cause of this pandemic, namely China’s apparent absence of satisfactory, or even rudimentary hygiene standards within its livestock industry - and specifically its wet markets. This is a discernibly common occurrence within this debate, but it avoids discussion around the cause of the pandemic and a therefore a significant degree of responsibility thereto.
For me, the Chinese government’s wider response since the story broke has been ok. I think they’ve been reasonably collaborative with the outside world and covering up and massaging figures isn’t the exclusive preserve of the Chinese government, that's for sure. In any event, it should have been apparent to western governments what they were contending with some time ago, within the world we inhabit today,
This pandemic was entirely avoidable if adequate constraints were in place preventing, or at least significantly mitigating the risk of viruses jumping from species to species. It was avoidable principally because it has happened before and associated warnings were provided. The risk had been clearly identified and wholly inadequate steps were taken to tackle the threat. This is a government that has manifestly proved adept at setting rules and enforcing them rigorously in relation to other problems that have presented themselves, so they have no excuse for failing to act.
it seems to question this apparent lack of care and foresight, to raise this concern, as something that needs to be robustly tackled going forward, if we are to avoid repeating this again, leaves one open to accusations of latent racism from some quarters, which is simply absurd.
China, and much the rest of south east Asia needs to get a grip in this issue, and sharpish, and pointing this out is a perfectly reasonable and reasoned thing to do.
A sensible post, and of course it’s perfectly reasonable to question the actions of the Chinese government. There’s nothing remotely racist about that.You make some persuasive points, but your post conspicuously fails to address the root cause of this pandemic, namely China’s apparent absence of satisfactory, or even rudimentary hygiene standards within its livestock industry - and specifically its wet markets. This is a discernibly common occurrence within this debate, but it avoids discussion around the cause of the pandemic and a therefore a significant degree of responsibility thereto.
For me, the Chinese government’s wider response since the story broke has been ok. I think they’ve been reasonably collaborative with the outside world and covering up and massaging figures isn’t the exclusive preserve of the Chinese government, that's for sure. In any event, it should have been apparent to western governments what they were contending with some time ago, within the world we inhabit today,
This pandemic was entirely avoidable if adequate constraints were in place preventing, or at least significantly mitigating the risk of viruses jumping from species to species. It was avoidable principally because it has happened before and associated warnings were provided. The risk had been clearly identified and wholly inadequate steps were taken to tackle the threat. This is a government that has manifestly proved adept at setting rules and enforcing them rigorously in relation to other problems that have presented themselves, so they have no excuse for failing to act.
it seems to question this apparent lack of care and foresight, to raise this concern, as something that needs to be robustly tackled going forward, if we are to avoid repeating this again, leaves one open to accusations of latent racism from some quarters, which is simply absurd.
China, and much the rest of south east Asia needs to get a grip in this issue, and sharpish, and pointing this out is a perfectly reasonable and reasoned thing to do.
Is it not? Why were they involved in distributing them then as a token of good will? Skeptics online, not just the right by the way, are suggesting it’s a PR strategy that lacks substance.