Death

-dabz- said:
Are we talking nice smelling flowers during precipitation or flowers on horse furniture?...Or monarchs propensity for foul cream/milk substitutes? Give us a clue...
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"I see Moon reincarnations. They don't know they're reborn ….They're everywhere."

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This is from Rickson Gracie, the brazilian martial artist. Feels like it touches on cultural differences. Mexico has Dia de Muertos, and so perhaps would be more along these lines too. Raises the possibility of a relationship of hyper rationality and attitudes to death - and so what what one values in life.

“My spirituality is based on things that I cannot explain but nonetheless believe. Americans tend to be hyperrational: everything must fit into the right box, and all of the dots must connect. When I moved to the US, it was much harder for me to express myself spiritually and to capture the energy that transcends the rational. People here live according to what they can prove and explain. If they can’t explain something, they deem it unacceptable and unbelievable. However, rationality has its limits; not everything can be explained on paper. Just look into the sky on a clear night. Where does the universe begin? Where does it end? Are we the only form of life in it? Is there life after death? Simple questions without easy answers.”
 
arfurclue said:
This is from Rickson Gracie, the brazilian martial artist. Feels like it touches on cultural differences. Mexico has Dia de Muertos, and so perhaps would be more along these lines too. Raises the possibility of a relationship of hyper rationality and attitudes to death - and so what what one values in life.

“My spirituality is based on things that I cannot explain but nonetheless believe. Americans tend to be hyperrational: everything must fit into the right box, and all of the dots must connect. When I moved to the US, it was much harder for me to express myself spiritually and to capture the energy that transcends the rational. People here live according to what they can prove and explain. If they can’t explain something, they deem it unacceptable and unbelievable. However, rationality has its limits; not everything can be explained on paper. Just look into the sky on a clear night. Where does the universe begin? Where does it end? Are we the only form of life in it? Is there life after death? Simple questions without easy answers.”
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Rickson Gracie is evidently a moron.

Spiritual = "I'm special!"

"...transcends the rational." How the fuck do you 'transcend' rationality!? That's exactly the same horseshit espoused by the religious. Society absolutely should be based on science and rationality.

"If they can’t explain something, they deem it unacceptable and unbelievable." That's downright wrong! If we can't explain something, we accept that this is where science could now shift its focus to.

"Where does the universe begin? Where does it end? Are we the only form of life in it? Is there life after death? Simple questions without easy answers.” Just because the answers aren't easy, that doesn't mean that there aren't answers.

We are actually doing a pretty good job of finding these answers. As for "life after death" it's overwhelmingly obvious that this is a 'no'.

Sorry but I can't stand the 'spiritual' brigade. Just because humans haven't yet found the answer to absolutely everything, that doesn't give us licence to attribute it to magic or a special man who made everything or the non-term 'spirituality'.

Phew, I feel a bit better after that.
 
Stuuuuuu said:
Rickson Gracie is evidently a moron.

Spiritual = "I'm special!"

"...transcends the rational." How the fuck do you 'transcend' rationality!? That's exactly the same horseshit espoused by the religious. Society absolutely should be based on science and rationality.

"If they can’t explain something, they deem it unacceptable and unbelievable." That's downright wrong! If we can't explain something, we accept that this is where science could now shift its focus to.

"Where does the universe begin? Where does it end? Are we the only form of life in it? Is there life after death? Simple questions without easy answers.” Just because the answers aren't easy, that doesn't mean that there aren't answers.

We are actually doing a pretty good job of finding these answers. As for "life after death" it's overwhelmingly obvious that this is a 'no'.

Sorry but I can't stand the 'spiritual' brigade. Just because humans haven't yet found the answer to absolutely everything, that doesn't give us licence to attribute it to magic or a special man who made everything or the non-term 'spirituality'.

Phew, I feel a bit better after that.
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I take it that post unbalanced you a bit? And you are an example of what he speaks of. Your ego can’t deal with it so flips it lid. Your choice. Yes, you can open to an awareness of energy beyond the monkey mind. Ever heard of art? Ever known moments of beauty and connection? But those would be a threat to YOUR specialness. The drug of egoic specialness. What a high!! But then there’s the low. MORE OF THE HIGH!!! Then there’s the comedown. Light the crack pipe! Feel kind of shit now. And so it goes on. If only those spiritual types would change and join me in this rationality, then all my problems would be solved…
 
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"We are actually doing a pretty good job of finding these answers. As for "life after death" it's overwhelmingly obvious that this is a 'no'."

I'm not into religion, god, heaven and hell etc, but why do you say it is overwhelmingly obvious there is no life after death?

I don't know exactly for sure myself, but there have been many, many instances of 'something' beyond the point of death for me to simply discount the possibility.

​

 
Stuuuuuu said:
"As for "life after death" it's overwhelmingly obvious that this is a 'no'.
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In the Buddhist scriptures, there’s a rather amusing story [reckoned to date from about the 6th Century BC] in which at one point, the King of Videha mockingly tells the divine sage Narada: ‘If thou believest….that there is another world, a dwelling-place for the dead, then give me here five hundred [silver] pieces, and I will give thee a thousand in the next world.’

I wouldn’t say, though, that it is entirely ‘obvious’ that there is no life after death.

For example, Near Death Experiences are commonly cited as evidence that we survive death. And the literature on this phenomenon is highly controversial, and nowhere near as straightforward and decisive as one might expect (for those who assume that such experiences are nothing more than hallucinations in a dying brain).

Among the main contributors to this field , the most interesting are Susan Blackmore, who had an OOBE (an out-of-the-body experience) when she was a student at Oxford. Although initially, she believed her experience to have been authentic, eventually she became sceptical about it, and has ventured an explanation for the various stages of an NDE (considered as a near-relative of an OOBE) in purely neurological terms.

However, the psychiatrist Bruce Greyson has travelled in completely the opposite direction. Brought up in a non-religious household, after a lifetime spent studying how NDE’s affect people, he reckons that there might be something to them.

Although it is written for A Level students, the views of Blackmore and Greyson, as well as other prominent figures in this field are reviewed in this survey article.

BOOK REVIEW/SURVEY ARTICLE : Bruce Greyson – After: A Doctor Explores What Near-Death Experiences Reveal About Life and Beyond. – Course notes and revision materials for students of A Level Religious Studies/Philosophy.

philrsblog.com

Personally, I am agnostic about the whole thing.
 
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