Oh ok. Who's currently starting at LB or LWB at the EDS level?
Tyreke Wilson, and he won't be 18 until December. I don't think he's anywhere near ready for first team football.
Oh ok. Who's currently starting at LB or LWB at the EDS level?
Where do we all stand on Sancho then? His loss or ours?
Personally, i think we dodged a bullet. If he isn't willing to wait for his chance when he is 17, and refuses to train, imagine how bad his attitude would be if he wasn't playing every week at Sterling/Sane's age. Always gonna get more of a chance at Dortmund, they are not on the same level as us and the Bundesliga is a lot more forgiving than the Prem IMO.
Even if he becomes a top player, which i doubt he will now, i wouldn't regret it. Can't be being held to ransom by 17 year olds, no matter how good they might be in the youth team. If you're good enough, you're old enough, but Sancho wasn't good enough just yet. He didn't even wait till january, even though he would be part of the squad.
Brahim and Foden have their heads screwed on and at least one of them, if not both, will make it big here. I'm certain. We don't need to worry about EDS progression, IMO. If we produce one player good enough for the side every few years, that's good enough for me. Right now, we have a couple, after just 3 years. Not bad.
Sorry, but the idea we dodged a bullet is stupid. Sancho didn't move because he wasn't willing to wait his chance, he moved because he knew he wasn't going to get one with Sterling, Sané, Jesus, Aguero & Sanchez ahead of him, and every game he plays for Dortmund while his former teammates line up for the EDS validates him further.
As for attitude, the German media with v. good contacts at Dortmund have said he didn't refuse to train and that he was simply absent because both clubs knew the deal was going to happen. I've never heard a single bad thing said about Sancho's attitude before or since so I'm inclined to believe it, but even if it were true, it's literally the same thing Sterling did to arrive here and he's been a model pro since.
If Sancho had stayed, and gotten opportunities which lead to him playing well enough to complain about game time, I suspect we'd have sold him for 40m, 50m+, or we'd have played him more.
He probably will, he's quite clearly talented enough, and his move has only made that more likely. Germany has a much more forgiving culture around footballers, Pep said he was granted much more personal privacy there than in Spain or England, and developing without the target on his back of being England's next big hope will only do him well. Dortmund are a fantastic side, with a proven track record of competing for major honours with young players, which is why young players flock there.
I don't see why he should have waited until January. He's already playing in Dortmund's first team, and as far as he knew Alexis Sanchez was about to rock up.
The Bundesliga is not more forgiving, that's just stereotypical english-centric fan's perspective, and I'm going to assume it's not based on years of watching German football. I don't remember Kevin De Bruyne being #exposed by the Premier League TM's superior game.
City's own research says that 85% of CL semi-finalists were playing league football at 17, and yet we haven't played a 17 year old in the league for over 10 years, Sturridge in 2007. What message does that send to our own players?
We're conducting & publicising research which is telling them to leave. Don't be angry if they follo
Hopefully Diaz & Brahim make it big here, they could easily not, I suspect they have simply been convinced to stay longer because Brahim is managed by Guardiola's brother and Phil is a lifelong blue.
Finally, before you get cocky about producing a couple of first team players "after 3 years", perhaps wait until either one has made a league debut, and remember that we've produced not a single first team regular in over a decade, and that talented players are leaving because of that record.
I said produce players good enough for the first team, not players ready for the first team at this minute. Brahim is in the squad for the spain under 21's at just turned 18. For a player based outside of spain, that's insane. And we all know how good foden is. He has been getting more media attention than sancho ever has, and the club will be under a lot of pressure to get this right.Sorry, but the idea we dodged a bullet is stupid. Sancho didn't move because he wasn't willing to wait his chance, he moved because he knew he wasn't going to get one with Sterling, Sané, Jesus, Aguero & Sanchez ahead of him, and every game he plays for Dortmund while his former teammates line up for the EDS validates him further.
As for attitude, the German media with v. good contacts at Dortmund have said he didn't refuse to train and that he was simply absent because both clubs knew the deal was going to happen. I've never heard a single bad thing said about Sancho's attitude before or since so I'm inclined to believe it, but even if it were true, it's literally the same thing Sterling did to arrive here and he's been a model pro since
If Sancho had stayed, and gotten opportunities which lead to him playing well enough to complain about game time, I suspect we'd have sold him for 40m, 50m+, or we'd have played him more.
He probably will, he's quite clearly talented enough, and his move has only made that more likely. Germany has a much more forgiving culture around footballers, Pep said he was granted much more personal privacy there than in Spain or England, and developing without the target on his back of being England's next big hope will only do him well. Dortmund are a fantastic side, with a proven track record of competing for major honours with young players, which is why young players flock there.
I don't see why he should have waited until January. He's already playing in Dortmund's first team, and as far as he knew Alexis Sanchez was about to rock up.
The Bundesliga is not more forgiving, that's just stereotypical english-centric fan's perspective, and I'm going to assume it's not based on years of watching German football. I don't remember Kevin De Bruyne being #exposed by the Premier League TM's superior game.
City's own research says that 85% of CL semi-finalists were playing league football at 17, and yet we haven't played a 17 year old in the league for over 10 years, Sturridge in 2007. What message does that send to our own players?
We're conducting & publicising research which is telling them to leave. Don't be angry if they follo
Hopefully Diaz & Brahim make it big here, they could easily not, I suspect they have simply been convinced to stay longer because Brahim is managed by Guardiola's brother and Phil is a lifelong blue.
Finally, before you get cocky about producing a couple of first team players "after 3 years", perhaps wait until either one has made a league debut, and remember that we've produced not a single first team regular in over a decade, and that talented players are leaving because of that record.
I said produce players good enough for the first team, not players ready for the first team at this minute. Brahim is in the squad for the spain under 21's at just turned 18. For a player based outside of spain, that's insane. And we all know how good foden is. He has been getting more media attention than sancho ever has, and the club will be under a lot of pressure to get this right.
Also, i do think the bundesliga is more forgiving for young players, mainly due to the tactics employed. Pace, work rate and stamina rather than power and experience, and often the forward players, especially at dortmund, thrive, due to the (imo) lack of defensive organisation of many teams. Look at RB leipzig, dortmund, hoffenheim etc. Takes a lot less intelligence to play in those teams imo. There has to be a reason why young players thrive in that league. I don't buy into the whole "young players just need chances" thing when it comes to 16/17 year olds.
I never said the tactics aren't clever or the manager's aren't quality. I said it doesn't take, in my opinion, as intelligent a player to play in those systems. I'm gonna guess that you watch far more german footy than me, so if you think i am wrong about that, i probably am. It is just the impression i get from watching teams like RB leipzig, where a lot of young, fit players play at breakneck speed, or klopp's gegenpressing, which doesn't work nearly as well over here as it did in germany. When i refer to it being easier to play in germany, i mean it's easier to play in the bundesliga than for city, although i happen to think any young player will struggle in the prem, which is why we don't see many.German football is far more tactically complex than English football, as exemplified by the rash of young German managers popping up all over the place and doing things like getting the poorest side in Championship into the Premier League like it's a piece of piss.
Just saying it doesn't require intelligence to play for teams like Leipzig is absolutely laughable, Ralph Hasenhuttl's coaching is about as close in complexity to Guardiola as possible, miles more complex than any premier league side we'll face this season.
It's pretty obvious your argument is based on no actual knowledge of the league you're dismissing.
I never said the tactics aren't clever or the manager's aren't quality. I said it doesn't take, in my opinion, as intelligent a player to play in those systems. I'm gonna guess that you watch far more german footy than me, so if you think i am wrong about that, i probably am. It is just the impression i get from watching teams like RB leipzig, where a lot of young, fit players play at breakneck speed, or klopp's gegenpressing, which doesn't work nearly as well over here as it did in germany. When i refer to it being easier to play in germany, i mean it's easier to play in the bundesliga than for city, although i happen to think any young player will struggle in the prem, which is why we don't see many.
Also not sure what part of my comments makes it obvious i know nothing about jadon sancho. No need to be so defensive, honestly. I didn't mean to come off as cocky or all-knowing, which is why i said in my 'opinion'.
Anyway, i didn't intend to get into an argument on german football, but i'll accept my comments could be seen as disparaging. I apologize for that.
Can't say i disagree with any of that. Just need foden to make it, would do wonders. Still, no use crossing fingers. Pep, foden and everyone inbetween need to work hard to make it happen, whilst still being successful on the pitch.I didn't want to get into a discussion on german football either so I'll sum up briefly the situation as I believe it is.
Sancho is one of the most talented players in the world in his age group, the best player at the u17 Euro's, probably would have gotten the same accolade at the World Cup if he stayed there.
There is no upside to him leaving, no bullet dodged, only a potentially world class player or big future transfer fee walking out the door for next to nothing.
On top of that loss, it is incredibly damaging to the academy as a whole that he so publicly left because of a perceived lack of opportunities at this club, and that a Champions League/Bundesliga challenging team with a worldwide reputation for taking promising youngsters and making them world class players decided he was good enough for first team football immediately.