FA's new homegrown proposals

[bluechampion7891]

Bayern is full of German players because they're good enough, not simply because they're German. Focus on developing good enough English players and they'll play, it really is that simple.

Bayern has 12 German players in the squad, which is the necessary minimum according to the rules. The Bundesliga introduced a quota, which says that 12 Germans have to be in every 25 man squad. Revamping the youth development was only the first step, it wouldn't have worked as well as it did if the German FA didn't come up with additional rules that force the clubs to further develop the talents and increase the chance of playing time in the first teams. And of course, the DFL (German football league, basically Bundesliga 1 & 2) was against it at first, just like many clubs.

One without the other doesn't make a lot of sense of course, but you need a quota like that or else clubs will always go the easy way of buying foreign talents instead and any work done at the grassroutes will just become meaningless. German clubs aren't smarter than English clubs, most of them would never have invested so much money and time into their academies if they weren't forced to do it through rules.

are you sure there are any quotas in germany at all? from what I know, they dont have any limitation to squad size or quotas at all

 

[JollyGood]

Bayern is full of German players because they're good enough, not simply because they're German. Focus on developing good enough English players and they'll play, it really is that simple.

Bayern has 12 German players in the squad, which is the necessary minimum according to the rules. The Bundesliga introduced a quota, which says that 12 Germans have to be in every 25 man squad. Revamping the youth development was only the first step, it wouldn't have worked as well as it did if the German FA didn't come up with additional rules that force the clubs to further develop the talents and increase the chance of playing time in the first teams. And of course, the DFL (German football league, basically Bundesliga 1 & 2) was against it at first, just like many clubs.

One without the other doesn't make a lot of sense of course, but you need a quota like that or else clubs will always go the easy way of buying foreign talents instead and any work done at the grassroutes will just become meaningless. German clubs aren't smarter than English clubs, most of them would never have invested so much money and time into their academies if they weren't forced to do it through rules.

are you sure there are any quotas in germany at all? from what I know, they dont have any limitation to squad size or quotas at all

Yes, I'm sure. There are 3 important ones:

1. 12 German players with professional contracts have to be in the 25man squad.
2. 8 players in the squad have to be local players according to the UEFA rules (played 3 full seasons between the age of 15 and 21 at a German club)
3. 4 of those 8 players have to come from the own academy.

All 3 were introduced in 2006, the latter two were introduced in steps though, 4 local players, 2 from your own club in 2006, then 6 - 3 in 2007 and finally 8-4 in 2008. It gave the club a chance to adjust to the new rules.

Of course players can count for more than one, e.g. in Bayern's case: Müller counts for all 3, Alaba for the latter 2, Neuer only for the first two.

What we don't have anymore in Germany is a restriction for non-EU players. In theory you can use the remaining 13 places in your squad for Southamerican, African and Asian players. That's restricted in the Premier League, which is really odd in my opinion. No idea why it should help English players if the teams buy Spanish, French, German players instead.

 

[BigOscar]

The thing that makes this all so stupid, is that our second division is something like the 6th or 7th most valuable and supported league in Europe. So if the english players can't get in premier league teams, they don't just give up and become plumbers, they become millionaire second division players, or even incredibly wealthy 3rd division players. Then if they show they are good enough, they move up the divisions. As usual, people are pretending that the premier league is the be all and end all, and that the other leagues don't matter. No talented english footballer is dropping out of the game completely because of lack of opportunity, it's just not the case at all. We have 4 fully professional leagues and a increasingly well paid 5th division. There are literally thousands of professional english footballers, there is no lack of opportunity whatsoever.

 

[peter.evans]

Bayern has 12 German players in the squad, which is the necessary minimum according to the rules. The Bundesliga introduced a quota, which says that 12 Germans have to be in every 25 man squad. Revamping the youth development was only the first step, it wouldn't have worked as well as it did if the German FA didn't come up with additional rules that force the clubs to further develop the talents and increase the chance of playing time in the first teams. And of course, the DFL (German football league, basically Bundesliga 1 & 2) was against it at first, just like many clubs.

One without the other doesn't make a lot of sense of course, but you need a quota like that or else clubs will always go the easy way of buying foreign talents instead and any work done at the grassroutes will just become meaningless. German clubs aren't smarter than English clubs, most of them would never have invested so much money and time into their academies if they weren't forced to do it through rules.

are you sure there are any quotas in germany at all? from what I know, they dont have any limitation to squad size or quotas at all

Yes, I'm sure. There are 3 important ones:

1. 12 German players with professional contracts have to be in the 25man squad.
2. 8 players in the squad have to be local players according to the UEFA rules (played 3 full seasons between the age of 15 and 21 at a German club)
3. 4 of those 8 players have to come from the own academy.

All 3 were introduced in 2006, the latter two were introduced in steps though, 4 local players, 2 from your own club in 2006, then 6 - 3 in 2007 and finally 8-4 in 2008. It gave the club a chance to adjust to the new rules.

Of course players can count for more than one, e.g. in Bayern's case: Müller counts for all 3, Alaba for the latter 2, Neuer only for the first two.

What we don't have anymore in Germany is a restriction for non-EU players. In theory you can use the remaining 13 places in your squad for Southamerican, African and Asian players. That's restricted in the Premier League, which is really odd in my opinion. No idea why it should help English players if the teams buy Spanish, French, German players instead.

That is a good post, but as has been said the key point is that we simply do not produce enough quality players to compete either at top club or international level. The Germans may have 'rebuilt' their structure 15 years ago or whatever, but their structure came from a solid base of success ( 6 or 7 ish major tournament wins and several other tournament final appearances, compared to England's paltry one !! We have a coaching system that is stuck in the dark ages and based around brawn and pace, rather than technique and skill. Our players are either physical types or the ones that are 'skilful' are headless chicken head down and run at the defence merchants ( Walcott, Sterling,etc ). The first instinct of any player should be to pass the ball, not boot it up the pitch or get your head down, beat a player and cross it. This is why we are easy to play against and easy to beat by all the first rank footballing nations. The problem is in the development, done mainly by poor quality coaches, who lack intelligence. You see it everywhere in junior football. Quotas have got nothing to do with it. Dyke is a waste of space. He has been banging on about too many foreign players, blah, blah, but, as others have said, has anyone asked him how we did in the 70's ,80's etc, when we had loads of English players ? As pointed out, there are loads of English players playing in professional football ,earning a great living, but not many make it to the top clubs because they simply are not good enough !

 

[blueinsa]

I see Sterling is being left out again to "protect" him?

Do they not see the fucking irony in all their bluster when they get a young English talent and he can never play because he is tired and needs to be protected pmsl.

 

[inchy14]

And now Phil fucking Neville joins in the debate, guess which clubs he's praising and who he's having a sly little dig at?

<a class="postlink" href="http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/32015909" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/32015909</a>

Fucker's a moron, if ever an English player didn't justify the amount of caps he managed it's this twat.

 

[-nibz-]

I can only think of Cleverly, Welbeck and Gibson who've had game time and they got shipped off filed under 'SHIT'.

 

[g180aj]

The biggest difference we have compared to Germany we have a maximum number of 17 foreign players then 4 none club trained, I the fa want to make a change then the rule should change to the first 4 players registered should be the club trained and the next 4 have to be home grown before we can register a foreign player.

I would add a rule that 2 of the 8 have to be under 21 so you can't just buy the 8 best homegrown players, you have to premote from the youth system.

There should be salary Capps staggered up to 23 and maximum transfer fee's staggered in the same way so English players aren't overpriced.

 

[LoveCity]

So players like Lopes, Denayer, Rekik, Celina, Ambrose, Pozo, Angelino and Maffeo would not count as homegrown under these rules because they joined after they were 15? If they're going to bring these rules in they should start from a clean slate, not impacting foreign HG players who have (Clichy, Boyata) or are coming through the system.

 

[g180aj]

So players like Lopes, Denayer, Rekik, Celina, Ambrose, Pozo, Angelino and Maffeo would not count as homegrown under these rules because they joined after they were 15? If they're going to bring these rules in they should start from a clean slate, not impacting foreign HG players who have (Clichy, Boyata) or are coming through the system.

They could do something like keeping the hg rule as it is I.e. 3 years Under 21 but change the club trained rule to 3 years under 18 so the mentioned players would be hg but only the likes of Barker, Tosin, Bryan, Manu Garcia, Brahim, Evans and glendon would all have to be given a chance.