FC United - Oral Hearing - judge rejects appeal (p 82)

[M18CTID]

Re: FC United - Judicial Review day 2 (pg 61)

Come on, I think we all know the real reason City fans can't stand FCUM. For a while in 2005 many City fans lapped FC up, thinking it was a great way to get at United, but then two things stopped this in its tracks.

First, it became apparent that FC fans hadn't stopped being United fans - they still sang United songs, in that their protest songs were against Glazer and the corporate control of football, rather than against MUFC per se. This was a disappointment to many City fans.

Secondly, City were becoming more and more a part of that corporate world that FC fans were against, and more tellingly, that City had for a long time said they were against. Now, the existence of FC is not just an embarrassment to United, but also to City, whose fans are trying to get on with reveling in their club's recent success, and don't like the idea of a football club on their doorstep that is based on values that fly in the face of the current reality of Manchester City.

So it's that hypocrisy, between what City fans say they are all about, and what the reality reveals to the world, that is the problem. Highlighting the perceived hypocrisy of FCUM, gleaned from individual fans' choice of phrasing on social networking sites, might provide a handy argument to hide behind, but City fans simply can't hide from the fact that their club is not what they like to believe it is, and for most objective observers, there's only one football club that represents the interests of the working class fan in Manchester, and it's about to get a home just down the road from 'The Etihad'.

I don't usually pay the remotest bit of attention to the comedy club which is FC united but that post is the most deluded thing I've ever seen on bluemoon. "Many city fans lapped FC up"? What planet do you live on? I don't think I've ever heard a city fan even mention FC united at a match or in the pub, because no one cares.

"There is only one club that represents the interests of the working class fan in Manchester" is frankly fucking funny. You have a head full of magic mate. The working class people of Manchester care nothing for your little united-lite outfit. No one is interested apart from a few hundred clowns who appear to like going to small towns and bullying the locals in the tradition of their tartan clad fathers in the 70s.

Just to add to the bolded bit, I know working-class United fans that can't stand FCUM so it isn't just City fans that don't quite get them. In fact, I'd say some United fans have far more of an axe to grind with FCUM than City fans do - the events that unfolded during the Salford City v FCUM game a few years back are testament to this.

 

[ancoats]

Re: FC United - Judicial Review day 2 (pg 61)

the 1 question i dont get is
if fcum go up the league's to the top league's like championship and premier league would you take sky money or just walk away from going up and stay in the lower league's

a couple of my mates are utd fans and go to fcum aswell i just dont get it

 

[luddite]

Re: FC United - Judicial Review day 2 (pg 61)

Mad Eyed Screamer, it's quite sad to see someone who for a long time stood up for the match-going fan using such weak arguments to try to undermine an independent supporter movement. Your 'middle class' vs 'working class' argument merely plays on a populist belief that only people working on the factory floor or down a mine can be considered working class, and that anyone else therefore can't represent working class interests. A weak and anti-intellectual argument that serves the neoliberal agenda of dividing working people - well done.

The ESPN point is a fair one to make, though does rest on a lack of understanding of what FC United was and was not set up to do. It is possible to be against Sky and its owners in particular, and against the sidelining of match-going fans interests in favour of the tv viewer, without necessarily being against having football on telly at all. The club and it's member-owners discuss and debate things like this, and decides - on an ongoing basis - what is right for the club's supporters and the other team involved. On that occasion it was decided that a game with Rochdale was very different than say a game with Portsmouth (FC told the FA it would refuse a rearranged for tv evening game had we gone through the subsequent round to play Portsmouth at home - in the interests of their traveling fans). So while a fair argument can be made that the wrong decision was made by FC in that case, it is in the end merely an example of football supporters organising themselves and trying to do what's best, and perhaps getting things wrong sometimes. What you are trying to do is claim that it was hypocritical, based purely on your own caricatured and deliberate misunderstanding of both the club and the issue of televised football.

Finally, if the issue is purely about a building being planned on a field in a residential area, and not about football, then why is this campaign being played out on a Manchester City fans' internet forum? What's it got to do with everyone on here? You're not deliberately playing on City fans' existing antipathy towards anything United-related are you, in this non-football issue?

Sorry, can you point me in the direction of a post where I said anything about working v middle class?
I'll answer the rest when I get back from work, just setting off now :)

You scoffed at the idea that FC might represent the interests of the working class fan because some people involved with the club don't have what you regard as working class jobs.

 

[luddite]

Re: FC United - Judicial Review day 2 (pg 61)

Yes, some 'working class' fans of United don't like FC, but that doesn't mean FC don't represent and stand up for their interests. It's about class consciousness - see the history of any workers' movement for more of the same.

ancoats - in answer to your question: I for one hope they would refuse to be a part of it. The idea is to work with other supporters to encourage, or force, change in the game, so that hopefully the higher leagues wouldn't be infested by the likes of Sky if or when FC ever got there. That'll only happen if the majority of fans take a stand together, but it seems unlikely at the moment. Maybe you could retrospectively ask yourself a similar question: If you were asked 10 years ago whether you would want to 'do a Chelsea' and get a rich owner to buy success, would you want it, or are there other things more important than winning trophies at any cost? Principles are easy to have, but not so easy to keep, as football fans seem very good at finding reasons to justify what previously would seem unjustifiable.

 

[fbloke]

Re: FC United - Judicial Review day 2 (pg 61)

Yes, some 'working class' fans of United don't like FC, but that doesn't mean FC don't represent and stand up for their interests. It's about class consciousness - see the history of any workers' movement for more of the same.

ancoats - in answer to your question: I for one hope they would refuse to be a part of it. The idea is to work with other supporters to encourage, or force, change in the game, so that hopefully the higher leagues wouldn't be infested by the likes of Sky if or when FC ever got there. That'll only happen if the majority of fans take a stand together, but it seems unlikely at the moment. Maybe you could retrospectively ask yourself a similar question: If you were asked 10 years ago whether you would want to 'do a Chelsea' and get a rich owner to buy success, would you want it, or are there other things more important than winning trophies at any cost? Principles are easy to have, but not so easy to keep, as football fans seem very good at finding reasons to justify what previously would seem unjustifiable.

Seeing as you brought class into the debate you do realise you dont have any, none, nil, you are devoid of class.

Anyone who tries to bully, con or force through something like the proposed stadium development in an area they have absolutely no link to what so ever cannot have any idea what class is.

If I were to call the FCUM board tonight and offer them free use of a facility such as Flixton's old ground and offer to sponsor them for £200k a year they would be there and signing the papers in a heartbeat.

They are bought and sold like so many other classless proles.

 

[Anonymous]

Re: FC United - Judicial Review day 2 (pg 61)

Exactly fbloke, they're simply a commodity like everything and everybody on this planet.

 

[Blue Mist]

Re: FC United - Judicial Review day 2 (pg 61)

fbloke "They are bought and sold like so many other classless proles."

Exactly fbloke, they're simply a commodity like everything and everybody on this planet.

A commodity you say, a prostitute say I.
They will sell themselves to anyone who will pay them money regardless of what they spout as their raison d'etre.

 

[CheethamHillBlue]

Re: FC United - Judicial Review day 2 (pg 61)

ancoats - in answer to your question: I for one hope they would refuse to be a part of it.

You already have been a part of it you fookin clown. What about Rochdale away in the FA Cup on a Friday night?
Unbelievable Jeff.

 

[Bluemoon115]

Re: FC United - Judicial Review day 2 (pg 61)

Yes, some 'working class' fans of United don't like FC, but that doesn't mean FC don't represent and stand up for their interests. It's about class consciousness - see the history of any workers' movement for more of the same.

ancoats - in answer to your question: I for one hope they would refuse to be a part of it. The idea is to work with other supporters to encourage, or force, change in the game, so that hopefully the higher leagues wouldn't be infested by the likes of Sky if or when FC ever got there. That'll only happen if the majority of fans take a stand together, but it seems unlikely at the moment. Maybe you could retrospectively ask yourself a similar question: If you were asked 10 years ago whether you would want to 'do a Chelsea' and get a rich owner to buy success, would you want it, or are there other things more important than winning trophies at any cost? Principles are easy to have, but not so easy to keep, as football fans seem very good at finding reasons to justify what previously would seem unjustifiable.

But we all know it's bollocks. First chance you got you took ESPN's money to play on a Friday night. Where were your core principles then?

Not the real thing, but full of just as much shite as the Stretford lot.

 

[Swales lives]

Re: FC United - Judicial Review day 2 (pg 61)

Hahaha , gotta laugh a Luddite, United fans hate their micro-Judas cousins, non-league fans of other clubs hate them for their shit behaviour and City fans couldn't give a fuck about them. The local residents don't want the fuckers in their back yard and would prefer junkies, prozzies and illegals as their neighbours. That's how popular FCUM are. They are a bunch of fuckin' cockwombles.