Full Members Cup 1986

[macca-mcfc-flc]

one off my best weekends ever,on the sat got a ticket for a fiver at 5 to 3 for the scoreboard end,when arthur arthur equalized,there was a delayed reaction in the city end coz wasnt sure it went in,then chaos!then on the midnite to the smoke,was 14,magic,my life has been down hill ever since.

 

[Gary James]

How seriously did teams take this competition? Was it ever considered on a par with the League Cup or was it a bit of a joke cup?

We played more or less our full strength team throughout, as did other clubs. But when it was created it received a lot of flak (understandably so). With those 'European qualifiers' desperate to create the Screen Sport Super Cup to make sure they didn't lose revenue (everyone had conveniently ignored the reason why English teams were banned from Europe and the number of people who had died!) football just looked greedy. Then we jumped on the bandwagon to create this 3rd domestic cup (around the same time there had been more sensible calls for a British Cup).

Peter Swales and Ken Bates were 2 of the main men behind the FMC and they openly talked about the possibility of making money out of it. That's why we took the competition seriously.

Crowds for almost every game other than the final were pitiful - not just City but everywhere. It was nicknamed the Empty Members Cup because crowds were low and even after the initial draw/rounds were selected some teams pulled out - I think Sheff Wed were supposed to be in our group as well as Sheff Utd. Certainly a team we were supposed to play pulled out and they had to re-arrange things a little.

It was also nicknamed the Mickey Mouse Cup.

It was never viewed as a significant competition by neutrals and we only treated it significantly because of Swales' determination that it would work. As the final was a success (in terms of attendance, income for City & Chelsea and excitement) the Full Members of the League decided to keep it going. As a club we didn't take it as seriously in subsequent years, and even with sponsors covering costs I think it was only a matter of time before the plug was pulled. It lasted into the nineties and our last game in it was a 3-2 defeat by Sheff Wed in Oct 1991.

 

[tolmie's hairdoo]

Could of sworn the Full Members' semi was against Ipswich Town - North v Southern sections?

Did we even play them in the run, or is age finally catching up with me. Went to the game, first time at Wembley, left ten minutes before end and missed Mark Lillis fightback.

It stood me in good stead, experience told me to stick around in 99 for play-off final

 

[Gary James]

It was nicknamed the Empty Members Cup because crowds were low and even after the initial draw/rounds were selected some teams pulled out - I think Sheff Wed were supposed to be in our group as well as Sheff Utd. Certainly a team we were supposed to play pulled out and they had to re-arrange things a little.

I seem to think the South Yorkshire, West Yorkshire and Greater Manchester groups had too few members once they were announced and we were put into a remodelled Yorkshire group because apart from us and I guess Oldham there weren't any other sides near us wanting to play. But I'd have to look into it again (maybe when Chelsea are doing a 25 year anniversary celebration!).

 

[Gary James]

Could of sworn the Full Members' semi was against Ipswich Town - North v Southern sections?

Did we even play them in the run, or is age finally catching up with me. Went to the game, first time at Wembley, left ten minutes before end and missed Mark Lillis fightback.

It stood me in good stead, experience told me to stick around in 99 for play-off final

We played Ipswich in round 4 1986-87 (the 2nd season). By that time it wasn't regionalised. I don't remember if that was a semi - it could have been considering the number of teams in it. We lost 3-2 (Varadi double) at Maine Road.

 

[Barney Daniels]

I think Ipswich in 87 was the QF, we played on FA Cup 4th Round day having both been knocked out in R3.

Wembley was a great day out apart from the result. We got top price tickets - £12.50! Although they weren't that brilliant in the old stadium. Not only did we stay to the end but we gave the lads a great reception on their lap of honour.

My recollection of afterwards was that the Chelsea fans were fairly gracious but another two goals may have produced a different response.

 

[sleeping bluety]

dnt no we playd them at wembly, sorry i missed it.

 

[Didsbury Dave]

Could of sworn the Full Members' semi was against Ipswich Town - North v Southern sections?

Did we even play them in the run, or is age finally catching up with me. Went to the game, first time at Wembley, left ten minutes before end and missed Mark Lillis fightback.

It stood me in good stead, experience told me to stick around in 99 for play-off final

We played Ipswich in round 4 1986-87 (the 2nd season). By that time it wasn't regionalised. I don't remember if that was a semi - it could have been considering the number of teams in it. We lost 3-2 (Varadi double) at Maine Road.

I was at that game. It wasn't a semi.

Oddly, it was on a Saturday afternoon. The whole ground was open but there was only half a crowd, if memory serves me right about 10,000.

It was surreal being on a 3/4 empty Kippax, it was the smallest crowd I had been in at Maine Road.

 

[fathellensbellend]

my recollections of the top of my head, the last ever game at wednesday we were leading 2-1 going into injury time, and threw it away.

i also remember going to bramall lane where we won 2-0 mark ward scored both i think, and i am sure he scored both goals against the same opposition on the previous saturday at maine road.

also remember going to elland road for the northern area semi final, we lost 2-0 in extra time.

and also going to forest where we lost 3-2, in about 1989 methinks.

god these games were dire

 

[blue b4 the moon]

Another 5 minutes and we would have won the game... our fightback stunned Chelsea and they couldn't compete in those final minutes.

Disappointing result but in some ways it now embarrasses Chelsea that they have to have it on their roll of honour.

That was my last 'old' wembley trip. Abroad for the 1999 game.

My recolection is that the ref played almost no injury time.

 

[Dyed Petya]

It was always a bit of a joke competition to be honest, but especially in that first year. City were the only top division side in the Northern Section, so qualifying for the final was no great achievement. Only Oxford, West Brom and Chelsea from the first division were in the Southern Section.

In that first year, because the final was between the two best supported clubs, both of whom had been through lean times since they'd last won anything, their fans made a day of it and turned out in numbers, they continued with it in subsequent seasons.

The 68,000 crowd showed that it was worthwhile in revenue terms for the clubs who made progress to the very latter stages because supporters would fancy a big day out at Wembley. However, as a tournament it was an utter waste of time from beginning to end, as crowds for most of the matches proved.

Anyone remember the night in 1986/7 when we beat Wimbledon at Maine Road and they had two (yes, TWO) fans in the whole Platt Lane? United were playing at Southampton in the League Cup and lost 4-1, which prompted them finally to lose patience and sack Fat Ron. We had a little over 4,000 in, IIRC, who were cheering like mad every time a Saints goal was announced over the tannoy.

The pitch invasion in 1985/6 was after the penalty shoot out win in the northern semi final against Sunderland. The game was a dire 0-0 AET, but Paul Power celebrated the winning penalty as if it had just brought home the European Cup and many of the ?5K-ish who were present piled onto the pitch.

The northern final (effectively the competition semi) was against Hull. We lost at their place, and drew 10,000 to the game at Maine Road. We were 1-0 up on the night and heading for extra time (no away goals, IIRC) until Jim Melrose got a last minute aggregate winner.

There was definitely no pitch invasion that night. In fact, the crowd was around 10K, I think, even with the carrot of a Wembley appearance.

 

[Dyed Petya]

Purely to illustrate what an utterly dreadful competition this was, I've been on mcfcstats.com and looked at our home attendances for this competition. We played nine games at Maine Road in total, and drew an aggregate of 61,044 fans - an average of 6,783 per game, lower than our lowest EVER league attendance of 8,015. Only two of the nine matches actually attracted a crowd in excess of that 8,015 figure: against Hull in December 1985 and Ipswich in January 1987.

I went to Wembley for the Chelsea game and enjoyed the day out, but let's not pretend it represented anything more in City history than a decent day out. Given the absence of any other top flight side in our half of the draw, it was no kind of achievement to get to the final. And that final appearance came in the context of a tournament that was a complete joke.

 

[Dakovich]

Purely to illustrate what an utterly dreadful competition this was, I've been on mcfcstats.com and looked at our home attendances for this competition. We played nine games at Maine Road in total, and drew an aggregate of 61,044 fans - an average of 6,783 per game, lower than our lowest EVER league attendance of 8,015. Only two of the nine matches actually attracted a crowd in excess of that 8,015 figure: against Hull in December 1985 and Ipswich in January 1987.

I went to Wembley for the Chelsea game and enjoyed the day out, but let's not pretend it represented anything more in City history than a decent day out. Given the absence of any other top flight side in our half of the draw, it was no kind of achievement to get to the final. And that final appearance came in the context of a tournament that was a complete joke.

Is there any mention of an early round game at ewood park against blackburn
around 1987 or `88 in the stats mate?
I`m sure we travelled up there on a weds night and the crowd was about 3,000??

 

[Dyed Petya]

Purely to illustrate what an utterly dreadful competition this was, I've been on mcfcstats.com and looked at our home attendances for this competition. We played nine games at Maine Road in total, and drew an aggregate of 61,044 fans - an average of 6,783 per game, lower than our lowest EVER league attendance of 8,015. Only two of the nine matches actually attracted a crowd in excess of that 8,015 figure: against Hull in December 1985 and Ipswich in January 1987.

I went to Wembley for the Chelsea game and enjoyed the day out, but let's not pretend it represented anything more in City history than a decent day out. Given the absence of any other top flight side in our half of the draw, it was no kind of achievement to get to the final. And that final appearance came in the context of a tournament that was a complete joke.

Is there any mention of an early round game at ewood park against blackburn
around 1987 or `88 in the stats mate?
I`m sure we travelled up there on a weds night and the crowd was about 3,000??

According to MCFC Stats, we lost 3-2 in the 2nd round at Blackburn on Tuesday, 13 December 1988, with our goals coming from Gleghorn and a Hendry own goal. (We didn't have a 1st round tie that year, so that was the only game we played in the competition). Crowd is given as 5,763.

 

[Dakovich]

Is there any mention of an early round game at ewood park against blackburn
around 1987 or `88 in the stats mate?
I`m sure we travelled up there on a weds night and the crowd was about 3,000??

According to MCFC Stats, we lost 3-2 in the 2nd round at Blackburn on Tuesday, 13 December 1988, with our goals coming from Gleghorn and a Hendry own goal. (We didn't have a 1st round tie that year, so that was the only game we played in the competition). Crowd is given as 5,763.

Nice one mate - I was pretty sure it was in the Full members and around that time.

 

[CelticBhoyCityBlue]

The derby the day before was my first at OT and I'll never forget Kenny Clements getting injured and coming off in tears knowing that probably his last chance to play at Wembley had gone.

What a game that derby was though, "oooooohh, Arthur Arthur! Arthur Arthur Arthur Albiston ......"

I wonder if Albistion knew his name was being chanted at Wembley the next day?

The 2-2 V Utd was a bit of a pride game. We were supposed to roll over and let utd humiliate us, plus we had that final to play (no matter how you look at it now, it was significant to play in a Wembley final back then because it was so rare for any team to play there). Billy McNeill deliberately picked what he called a 'Manchester' team to play Utd and it worked.

City's team was predominantly Mancunian/players who had developed via the Club. Utd's only 'Manc' that day was ex-Blue Peter Barnes.

The 2-2 draw was worth celebrating, and we couldn't wait for Wembley.

I haven't seen the FMC Final goals for a long time. Can you just imagine the furore if teams were asked to play games back to back, Saturday & Sunday??!

Billy McNeill makes reference to the "Manchester" team he put out at Ragworld in his autobiography. Another interesting line was his pre match media conference before the Charlton promotion game in '85.

With Wilson, McCarthy and Baker all injured the team lacked any presence at the back, and drive from midfield. McNeill made out to the hacks that he was more than confident he had the side to go out and win the game. The truth was he was absolutely brickin it with a make shift and somewhat small centre half pairing (Nicky Reid & Andy May?). Thankfully the team went out and pumped Charlton anyway and nobody even batted an eyelid about the team line up!

 

[cleavers]

I drove back from Germany for the FM final (couldn't get up to the derby as well as I worked Friday in Germany), I had to get the ferry back Sunday evening (no tunnel then), and at 5-1 thought "f**k this" and left, heard a as we were getting in the car, and expected the worst so was glad to be on my way home. Just as we got to Dover I found out I'd driven all that way at no small expense and missed 3 City goals !!

I've only left early twice since, a home stuffing by Charlton when Dunne kicked the ball against a striker and it looped in, JR season after we'd just been promoted back to the Premiership I think, can't remember the other one, but had to get home for something and its a 3 hour journey.

 

[Blue Streak]

I went to that final against Chelsea. The research on the early rounds, the lower league history of City etc etc all shows why we deserve to finally have the sun smile down on us.