Well emotions were still high when he died and his minutes silence was observed perfectly and respectfully.I wonder, had he still been alive and returned to the Etihad on New Year's Eve to celebrate his 90th, what sort of reaction he'd get, knowing what we know now?
I really do wonder, though I'm not sure I know any more now than I did then. Or should I say I'm not sure I understand more now than I did then. It's now nearly thirty years since PJS relinquished his grip on the club and it's half a century since he became chairman. For 22 years City's story was linked inextricably with the "ego" of PJS and yet he is still so elusive in so many ways. He certainly wanted to see City as a successful, even dominant, club but was he just a rent-a-tele wide boy who got above himself. He wanted to see City replace the rags as the best club in Manchester - how did he fail to notice this was actually happening by the early 70s? The rift between Jo and Big Mal would take some handling but he handled it pretty badly but during the 70s City maintained their status as one of the biggest clubs in the country but things went dramatically wrong in 1979 with the return to the club of another giant ego, Big Mal. Old Jo had confined him to coaching: PJS let him loose with the cheque book, and the consequences were disastrous. A club which had been at the elite level for most of its history found itself suddenly broke and unable to compete. And Swales, finding the club in a hole kept on digging. The club could still attract managers of ability and most performed creditably but often not creditably enough for the chairman who must NEVER be held responsible. Out they went and things seemed normal - for 18 months. Until the fans could take it no more and the anti-Swales campaign gathered momentum, spilling over into intimidation at the extremes.I wonder, had he still been alive and returned to the Etihad on New Year's Eve to celebrate his 90th, what sort of reaction he'd get, knowing what we know now?
Still remember people outside singing "dig him up!"Well emotions were still high when he died and his minutes silence was observed perfectly and respectfully.
many old heads would probably ironically cheer the silly old sod.
new fans post swales would probably clap indifferently
some still not over it would probabaly boo
As Joe Mercer left us before Swales became chairman, I'm not sure you can blame him for the Mercer/Allison split. More like the other way round, in that the split, at boardroom level more than between the two individuals, led to his arrival.I really do wonder, though I'm not sure I know any more now than I did then. Or should I say I'm not sure I understand more now than I did then. It's now nearly thirty years since PJS relinquished his grip on the club and it's half a century since he became chairman. For 22 years City's story was linked inextricably with the "ego" of PJS and yet he is still so elusive in so many ways. He certainly wanted to see City as a successful, even dominant, club but was he just a rent-a-tele wide boy who got above himself. He wanted to see City replace the rags as the best club in Manchester - how did he fail to notice this was actually happening by the early 70s? The rift between Jo and Big Mal would take some handling but he handled it pretty badly but during the 70s City maintained their status as one of the biggest clubs in the country but things went dramatically wrong in 1979 with the return to the club of another giant ego, Big Mal. Old Jo had confined him to coaching: PJS let him loose with the cheque book, and the consequences were disastrous. A club which had been at the elite level for most of its history found itself suddenly broke and unable to compete. And Swales, finding the club in a hole kept on digging. The club could still attract managers of ability and most performed creditably but often not creditably enough for the chairman who must NEVER be held responsible. Out they went and things seemed normal - for 18 months. Until the fans could take it no more and the anti-Swales campaign gathered momentum, spilling over into intimidation at the extremes.
I don't know now if this view of the "Swales Years" is objective or simply confused, but what I do know is that I am no nearer understanding the ideas and motives of a very complex personality. He cannot be held to blame on his own for the absolute debacle of the second half of the 1990s but how exactly do we share out blame? To what extent was the ethos of the club which he had created responsible for the increasingly irrational actions of managers who had performed reasonably successfully at other clubs? I am hardly sympathetic to Swales but I don't have much perspective on him either. Please help!
Yes, my mistake. The Mercer-Allison split had been brewing leading to Joe's departure on the early summer of 1972 (?) so he can be absolved of blame there -what I was thinking of I'm not sure! I can only assume that i think the fallout from the rift was handled badly by all concerned because Allison soon left to be replaced by Ron Saunders who not unreasonably tried to rebuild what had been a great team before Tony Book brought stability and success back. In the end a poor run of form/a flawed team led to Allison's return and a spending spree on players worth a fraction of what we paid which almost ruined the club. For me this is where Swales becomes opaque. How far was he an egomaniac? Or was he a City fan desperate for success but out of his depth at a club of City's stature. Did he fall for the visions of another massive ego? Why was he so hostile to investment by others coming into the club? And so on ... Questions by the score but very few answers which help us to explain a massive influence on our club.As Joe Mercer left us before Swales became chairman, I'm not sure you can blame him for the Mercer/Allison split. More like the other way round, in that the split, at boardroom level more than between the two individuals, led to his arrival.
I did a three-part podcast for Bolt From The Blue about the Swales era, so did a fair bit of reading on the subject, and had some correspondence with Gary James. I'd also had the good fortune to know the late Sidney Rose, who was on the board at the time, and had spoken to him a few years ago about Swales. I started off with the generally held view that Swales was a City fan who just got out of his depth and let his ego get the better of him, but the more I looked into it, my views changed.Yes, my mistake. The Mercer-Allison split had been brewing leading to Joe's departure on the early summer of 1972 (?) so he can be absolved of blame there -what I was thinking of I'm not sure! I can only assume that i think the fallout from the rift was handled badly by all concerned because Allison soon left to be replaced by Ron Saunders who not unreasonably tried to rebuild what had been a great team before Tony Book brought stability and success back. In the end a poor run of form/a flawed team led to Allison's return and a spending spree on players worth a fraction of what we paid which almost ruined the club. For me this is where Swales becomes opaque. How far was he an egomaniac? Or was he a City fan desperate for success but out of his depth at a club of City's stature. Did he fall for the visions of another massive ego? Why was he so hostile to investment by others coming into the club? And so on ... Questions by the score but very few answers which help us to explain a massive influence on our club.
Thanks, PB. A lot to think aboutI did a three-part podcast for Bolt From The Blue about the Swales era, so did a fair bit of reading on the subject, and had some correspondence with Gary James. I'd also had the good fortune to know the late Sidney Rose, who was on the board at the time, and had spoken to him a few years ago about Swales. I started off with the generally held view that Swales was a City fan who just got out of his depth and let his ego get the better of him, but the more I looked into it, my views changed.
Swales always told the story about him happening on Rose and Umbro's John Humphreys (who was also on the board at the time) in a pub in Hale. The takeover battle between the Alexander family and Joe Smith was ongoing and Swales' version of events was that he saw Rose & Humphreys and wandered over, offering to sort out the differences between the two factions. Sidney Rose, however, totally rubbished that version of events. According to him, they had approached Swales, who was involved with Altrincham FC at the time and had some other position of responsibility in local amateur football. That started me wondering that if Swales could twit that story, what else could he have twisted?
There was another story he told (I forget off the top of my head what it was) that could be debunked relatively easily, so I then assumed that anything he said that served to big himself up was suspect. One thing I wanted to try to get an answer to from Gary was whether he was even a City fan. Was there any evidence of his visiting Maine Road regularly in his youth, or any other signs of his allegiance? There wasn't (although that doesn't necessarily mean he wasn't a Blue). Back in 2005, I also spoke to the late Brian Lomax, who set up the fort Supporter Trust, at Northampton. Brian told me that he was the one who got Swales involved in football, as he's been an Altrincham fan in his youth and had spearheaded a campaign to save them when they'd been in financial difficulty. This campaign brought Swales and Noel White to the club. Again, there was no indication from Brian that Swales had any interest in football previously.
Another piece of evidence is that when he was finally forced to hand over control to Franny Lee, I don't believe he ever came back to Maine Road to watch us. If he genuinely was a City fan, then you'd have thought he might have been relieved to hand over the club and just get back to watching it, although you could understand why he might have felt aggrieved and detached. His fatal mistake was bringing Allison back of course, which he always claimed he was forced into (but can you imagine Swales being forced into anything?).
I could be judging him unfairly but my conclusion was that Swales, as a self-important person who had a few bob in his pocket, saw football as a means to an end. Altrincham got him on the ladder but a high-profile, successful club like City enabled him to climb a few more rungs. It eventually got him to a Vice-Presidency at the FA and the chairmanship of the International Committee. I suspect these were far more important to him than his chairmanship of City, and might well account for his reluctance to hand over the reins to someone else.
I did a three-part podcast for Bolt From The Blue about the Swales era, so did a fair bit of reading on the subject, and had some correspondence with Gary James. I'd also had the good fortune to know the late Sidney Rose, who was on the board at the time, and had spoken to him a few years ago about Swales. I started off with the generally held view that Swales was a City fan who just got out of his depth and let his ego get the better of him, but the more I looked into it, my views changed.
Swales always told the story about him happening on Rose and Umbro's John Humphreys (who was also on the board at the time) in a pub in Hale. The takeover battle between the Alexander family and Joe Smith was ongoing and Swales' version of events was that he saw Rose & Humphreys and wandered over, offering to sort out the differences between the two factions. Sidney Rose, however, totally rubbished that version of events. According to him, they had approached Swales, who was involved with Altrincham FC at the time and had some other position of responsibility in local amateur football. That started me wondering that if Swales could twit that story, what else could he have twisted?
There was another story he told (I forget off the top of my head what it was) that could be debunked relatively easily, so I then assumed that anything he said that served to big himself up was suspect. One thing I wanted to try to get an answer to from Gary was whether he was even a City fan. Was there any evidence of his visiting Maine Road regularly in his youth, or any other signs of his allegiance? There wasn't (although that doesn't necessarily mean he wasn't a Blue). Back in 2005, I also spoke to the late Brian Lomax, who set up the fort Supporter Trust, at Northampton. Brian told me that he was the one who got Swales involved in football, as he's been an Altrincham fan in his youth and had spearheaded a campaign to save them when they'd been in financial difficulty. This campaign brought Swales and Noel White to the club. Again, there was no indication from Brian that Swales had any interest in football previously.
Another piece of evidence is that when he was finally forced to hand over control to Franny Lee, I don't believe he ever came back to Maine Road to watch us. If he genuinely was a City fan, then you'd have thought he might have been relieved to hand over the club and just get back to watching it, although you could understand why he might have felt aggrieved and detached. His fatal mistake was bringing Allison back of course, which he always claimed he was forced into (but can you imagine Swales being forced into anything?).
I could be judging him unfairly but my conclusion was that Swales, as a self-important person who had a few bob in his pocket, saw football as a means to an end. Altrincham got him on the ladder but a high-profile, successful club like City enabled him to climb a few more rungs. It eventually got him to a Vice-Presidency at the FA and the chairmanship of the International Committee. I suspect these were far more important to him than his chairmanship of City, and might well account for his reluctance to hand over the reins to someone else.
Yes, born on Xmas day in 1932.......
The scary thing is he died aged 63..... in 3 years and 2 months I shall be the same age yet he looked a real FOC compared to my still youthful looks.......
View attachment 64395
Typical Peter Swales - photographed with a backdrop of a cheap, plastic carrier bag.
the takings from his own turnstile i'd imagine.Anything but cheap. That carrier bag was stuffed with 50 quid notes!
Made many mistakes like us all but he was a serious Rag hater and for that, I would give him the clapI wonder, had he still been alive and returned to the Etihad on New Year's Eve to celebrate his 90th, what sort of reaction he'd get, knowing what we know now?