Ta mate, I appreciate your reply. I am not having a go (even if I am coming across like that). I'm trying to understand your thinking. I'm afraid I still don't, but I appreciate you engaging nonetheless.Had deleted my post because I didn't put my point across well at all, but you've quoted it before I managed to. Sorry, that's not me trying to be a dick just for the record.
The point I was trying to make, but put across very poor, was that it doesn't change the fact that he was painted as an assailant by seemingly credible witnesses. That's regardless of him being injured or having blood in the mouth etc, probably assumed to have been from a fall. The stuff about him being stabbed and unable to breathe was tragically thought to be lies, brought about by the presumption of intoxication or concussion or a mix of both given the seemingly decent and coherent people have said nothing about a knife or stabbing. They probably thought they had time to establish how badly he was injured and if he would soon come to or whatever. They didn't.
I feel like we're going round in circles so it's probably best I've said my peace here and wait for the inevitable investigation results.
Thoughts are genuinely with Henry's family, and needless to say the members of the Digwa family involved in this should be left to rot. The Police at the scene? That's where I'm having the difference of opinion and difficulty in hanging them out to dry.
Ta mate, I appreciate your reply. I am not having a go (even if I am coming across like that). I'm trying to understand your thinking. I'm afraid I still don't, but I appreciate you engaging nonetheless.
Ffs they were told as they arrived his mouth is full of blood and he’s being held up! How the fuck does a first responder tbink mouthfuls of blood as normal lets check the walking talking guys first?I never said they were told by emergency services on the way to the call. I don't know details of what was said in the actual call other than they had awareness some sort of disturbance had taken place.
The point is that when they arrived at the scene, probably without any knowledge at that point of what's gone on, they were told by several people what had happened. That turned out to be a huge, awful, pack of lies. But at the time, there'd have been a natural human instinct to believe the little information you've been given and act based on that. With no mention of a stabbing from the family and information that the "assailant" has fell when trying to run away, as bad as it sounds it isn't irrational to assume he's a suspect who's either drunk and/or concussed saying they've been stabbed when in actual fact they've assaulted someone and fell.
It's really difficult to remain fully empathetic 100% of the time when you are consistently being physically and verbally abused throughout the course of doing your job by the very people you are there to serve.fkn hell - time lapse down from three mins to a minute (really), let this pathetic dilution and deflection run uncontested and we could get Nowak convicted at this rate, FFS and medals all around for His Majesty's finest, and the murderer's mum given a OBE
takes a special person... this dick wasn't one, and no amount of straw-clutching will make it soIt's really difficult to remain fully empathetic 100% of the time when you are consistently being physically and verbally abused throughout the course of doing your job by the very people you are there to serve.
People in normal jobs wouldn't hang around long if subject to the levels of abuse I've had to deal with at times in my working life.
The investigation will be bullshit though as the the I doesn’t really stand for independent. It’s like Webb marking var homework. No one can really watch that and say he did an adequate job but that’s what the police are claiming with the 3 fucking minutes. I would expect a first responder to identify a victim in 30 secs top when told he’s being held up with a mouth full of blood when arriving on the scene.Had deleted my post because I didn't put my point across well at all, but you've quoted it before I managed to. Sorry, that's not me trying to be a dick just for the record.
The point I was trying to make, but put across very poor, was that it doesn't change the fact that he was painted as an assailant by seemingly credible witnesses. That's regardless of him being injured or having blood in the mouth etc, probably assumed to have been from a fall. The stuff about him being stabbed and unable to breathe was tragically thought to be lies, brought about by the presumption of intoxication or concussion or a mix of both given the seemingly decent and coherent people have said nothing about a knife or stabbing. They probably thought they had time to establish how badly he was injured and if he would soon come to or whatever. They didn't.
I feel like we're going round in circles so it's probably best I've said my peace here and wait for the inevitable investigation results.
Thoughts are genuinely with Henry's family, and needless to say the members of the Digwa family involved in this should be left to rot. The Police at the scene? That's where I'm having the difference of opinion and difficulty in hanging them out to dry.
Do me a favour.the tinderbox that is the U.K. has had it driven into their heads by every section of the media that all the problems we face today are because of foreigners.
No I think the initial accusations of racism played a part in how the officers initially responded.Do me a favour.
There are so many things that are wrong and then there is this. which is so wrong it's off the scale.
Police Race Action Plan: Improving Policing for Black People
https://www.npcc.police.uk/our-work/police-race-action-plan/
You're looking for racism? Look no further.
That boy died because of shit like this.
And why was that?No I think the initial accusations of racism played a part in how the officers initially responded.
No straw clutching going on here. Just pointing out the difficulties of front line services.takes a special person... this dick wasn't one, and no amount of straw-clutching will make it so
What about L - listen to the guy who has said 4 times he’s been stabbed?No straw clutching going on here. Just pointing out the difficulties of front line services.
Most coppers who've been on the job for a while will have been present at an incident where someone had a face covered in blood, being propped up by someone because they've been scrapping and taken a whack in the face. 99 times out of 100 it will have been superficial or non-life threatening injuries, this time, it wasn't, and that's tragic.
If I'm turning up to a scene like that in a medical capacity, my checklist would be:
H - Hazards - To me primarily, to the casualty and to any bystanders.
H - History - What happened?
R - Response - Is the casualty responsive (level of consciousness, per GCS (Glasgow Coma Scale)/ AVPU (Alert obeys Voice commands responds to Pain or Unresponsive).
A - Airway - Check, clear, maintain
B - Breathing - Type of breathing and rate (there are other checks I would do at this stage to do with chest trauma primarily looking for a collapsed lung of a flail segment rib fracture - both life threatening)
C - Circulation - Do they have a pulse and what is their pulse rate (Radial pulse both wrists potentially indicates a useable volume of blood left in the body)
D - Disability - Checking for body/neurological disfunction (PEARL - Pupils Equal And React to Light or any other outward sign of brain trauma).
E - Exposure - Systematically expose the body to check for hidden injury or trauma
That's an awful lot to concentrate on, and all the time I still have to think about my own safety, and what is going on around me.
HHR can be pretty much achieved simultaneously, but it still takes a little bit of time to ascertain what hazards are present, especially in the dark. In this case the casualty was able to speak which meant they had a decent level of consciousness. Perhaps that formed part of the officers initial assessment? That for me would make ABC a little less urgent, but I still wouldn't be hanging about.
All that said, sometimes even trained medic might not pick up on the outward signs of hypovolemic shock until they've completed their primary survey, especially in the dark, and bear in mind that coppers are't medics. They are trained in basic life support only.
A police officers primary role is public safety, law enforcement and ascertaining evidence for the purposes of law enforcement. That situation was made a whole lot more difficult for the attending officers because of the lies they were told leading up to the interactions with the now sadly deceased. Hindsight is a wonderful thing. I've been on shouts where I wish thing had panned out differently and I'm certain the officers involved here wish they could turn back time and do things differently; they can't.
I would certainly take it onboard as part of H, but at that point I'm also considering hazards (as in where's the knife?). I can't help anyone if I get stabbed. What the police officer was thinking at the time, I can't attest to.What about L - listen to the guy who has said 4 times he’s been stabbed?
And why is that?I’m not defending anyone but I would not like to be a copper in the UK today.
It was strapped to the fucking front of the fella playing the racist card, whilst the poor young kid on the floor bled out.I would certainly take it onboard as part of H, but at that point I'm also considering hazards (as in where's the knife?). I can't help anyone if I get stabbed. What the police officer was thinking at the time, I can't attest to.
I can. He was thinking he’s going to be a **** on this call out and be really shit at his job. The job he no longer has.I would certainly take it onboard as part of H, but at that point I'm also considering hazards (as in where's the knife?). I can't help anyone if I get stabbed. What the police officer was thinking at the time, I can't attest to.
I know and thats basically what people have been saying, the mental gymnastics of others are the only reason the thread is going round in circles.I think he’d made his mind up as to what he was dealing with-ultimately that’s what he will need to explain.
Can't be expected to be seeing stuff when he's got HHRABCDE.......... to go through.It was strapped to the fucking front of the fella playing the racist card, whilst the poor young kid on the floor bled out.
The guy who trains them on L was dyslexic, unfortunately they did upset down r that day.What about L - listen to the guy who has said 4 times he’s been stabbed?