How good were Pink Floyd?

Don't like their early stuff or their later stuff but their 'middle' period is fantastic.

I find Animals so relaxing I don't think I've ever listened to it all the way through without nodding off.

And I love Wish you Were Here... so dark and cynical, full of bitterness and resentment, that's my kind of music!
 
Mustard Dave said:
David Gilmour is a fantastic guitarist. There are many others out there who may be faster etc, but there are few that even come close to his level of expressiveness.

Richard Wright was a talented musician. I don't think you could say he was one of the greatest technically, but he had a fantastic understanding of harmony and knew exactly what was needed. The end of Shine on You Crazy Diamond is a good example of the dramatic tension he could bring to a piece.

Nick Mason never really shone for me as a live performer, but he wasn't bad. He did the job and no doubt also contributed a lot in the creative process in the studio.

Roger Waters is a shite bass player, however, he more than makes up for it with his song writing abilities, as well as his creativity in his experimentation with unusual recording techniques and early synthesisers.

The important thing is the end result. Pink Floyd created a lot of self-indulgent shite, but the likes of Darr Side, Wish You Were Here, the Wall etc. were masterpieces. If I wanted to listen to people purely for their musical talent, there are plenty of videos of people fret-wanking on YouTube.

Stuuuuuu makes a good point about Oasis - pub rock is pretty accurate in my opinion. There's no end of love on here for them, but nobody ever complains that as musicians, they are average at best.

Nimrod - your point about 'unknown' session musicians - that was a David Gimour solo performance - not a Pink Floyd one. The session musicians are all credited and all selected for their musical ability. The drummer (Steve DiStanislao) was working with Crosby Stills & Nash, and David Gilmour said he was 'too good not to nick'. The other keyboard player is John Carin, who has worked with post-Waters Pink Floyd and both David Gilmour on recordings and tours for many years and also with Roger Waters as part of his touring band. He has also worked with the likes of Bryan Ferry, Pete Townsend and The Who, and Kate Bush. The sax player is Dick Parry, who performed on Dark Side of the Moon, Wish You Were Here and the Division Bell, and was a member of Joker's Wild with Gilmour before Pink Floyd. The bass player is Guy Pratt, who has worked with Pink Floyd since Roger Waters departed. The other guitarist should need no introduction - it's Phil Manzanera.

If you were in Gilmour's shoes, and you were embarking on a world tour, where you are performing your new album in its entirety, along with old favourites off DSOTM, WYWH and The Wall, you cannot do it on your own and you are not going to play along with a backing tape. Would you carefully select some of the world's best musicians, or would you ring John from the Nag's Head to see if he's got his bass back from Cash Converters yet?
Click to expand...

I know its a Dave solo gig my point is that they do this as Pink Floyd, I have Pulse and theres about 10 muso's on stage, I saw them in Oz and it was the same.

The OP asked 'how good were PF' ? in my post I said they had made some great records but not that great musicians, Gilmour plays tasteful guitar (I acknowledged that) but the rest are very average and none of them can sing well since Syd Barrett left.

If were talking 'live' I prefer a band who can really play, like Weather Report, Yes or Led Zep ...or Deep Purple (as was)
 
Up till the Wall they were well up there, 'Atom Heart Mother' being a personal favourite.

Roger Waters is a black hearted bastard though mind.
 
Really taken aback by some comments about them not being very good musicians.
Nobody needs to be a virtuoso on their instrument in any band, indeed it can make the music boring but the craft they had, using a subtle key change, in timing, knowing when to bend a note or hold one for me, is where they are the elite.
I never see anything special with Clapton. But I do with Hendrix and I do with Gilmour.

For shit, run of the mill, nothing special "musicians" plying their trade look no further than Blink 182 et al. 4 chords and a 5 note tune and you're genius. Thats shit that anyone with a few weeks practice can do.
I played for 6 years, had a break of 14 then picked it up again this summer and im still better than those knobs.

I suppose people like what they like though.
 
nimrod said:
Mustard Dave said:
David Gilmour is a fantastic guitarist. There are many others out there who may be faster etc, but there are few that even come close to his level of expressiveness.

Richard Wright was a talented musician. I don't think you could say he was one of the greatest technically, but he had a fantastic understanding of harmony and knew exactly what was needed. The end of Shine on You Crazy Diamond is a good example of the dramatic tension he could bring to a piece.

Nick Mason never really shone for me as a live performer, but he wasn't bad. He did the job and no doubt also contributed a lot in the creative process in the studio.

Roger Waters is a shite bass player, however, he more than makes up for it with his song writing abilities, as well as his creativity in his experimentation with unusual recording techniques and early synthesisers.

The important thing is the end result. Pink Floyd created a lot of self-indulgent shite, but the likes of Darr Side, Wish You Were Here, the Wall etc. were masterpieces. If I wanted to listen to people purely for their musical talent, there are plenty of videos of people fret-wanking on YouTube.

Stuuuuuu makes a good point about Oasis - pub rock is pretty accurate in my opinion. There's no end of love on here for them, but nobody ever complains that as musicians, they are average at best.

Nimrod - your point about 'unknown' session musicians - that was a David Gimour solo performance - not a Pink Floyd one. The session musicians are all credited and all selected for their musical ability. The drummer (Steve DiStanislao) was working with Crosby Stills & Nash, and David Gilmour said he was 'too good not to nick'. The other keyboard player is John Carin, who has worked with post-Waters Pink Floyd and both David Gilmour on recordings and tours for many years and also with Roger Waters as part of his touring band. He has also worked with the likes of Bryan Ferry, Pete Townsend and The Who, and Kate Bush. The sax player is Dick Parry, who performed on Dark Side of the Moon, Wish You Were Here and the Division Bell, and was a member of Joker's Wild with Gilmour before Pink Floyd. The bass player is Guy Pratt, who has worked with Pink Floyd since Roger Waters departed. The other guitarist should need no introduction - it's Phil Manzanera.

If you were in Gilmour's shoes, and you were embarking on a world tour, where you are performing your new album in its entirety, along with old favourites off DSOTM, WYWH and The Wall, you cannot do it on your own and you are not going to play along with a backing tape. Would you carefully select some of the world's best musicians, or would you ring John from the Nag's Head to see if he's got his bass back from Cash Converters yet?
Click to expand...

I know its a Dave solo gig my point is that they do this as Pink Floyd, I have Pulse and theres about 10 muso's on stage, I saw them in Oz and it was the same.

The OP asked 'how good were PF' ? in my post I said they had made some great records but not that great musicians, Gilmour plays tasteful guitar (I acknowledged that) but the rest are very average and none of them can sing well since Syd Barrett left.

If were talking 'live' I prefer a band who can really play, like Weather Report, Yes or Led Zep ...or Deep Purple (as was)
Click to expand...

If you'd have seen them in 1971 or 1972 they were just a four piece band. Have you watched the Live at Pompeii DVD? That was recorded in October 1971 before they became a supergroup, just the four of them!! When I saw them in 1977 they had Snowy White as a second guitarist but were still just a 5 piece band!!
 
nimrod said:
Mustard Dave said:
David Gilmour is a fantastic guitarist. There are many others out there who may be faster etc, but there are few that even come close to his level of expressiveness.

Richard Wright was a talented musician. I don't think you could say he was one of the greatest technically, but he had a fantastic understanding of harmony and knew exactly what was needed. The end of Shine on You Crazy Diamond is a good example of the dramatic tension he could bring to a piece.

Nick Mason never really shone for me as a live performer, but he wasn't bad. He did the job and no doubt also contributed a lot in the creative process in the studio.

Roger Waters is a shite bass player, however, he more than makes up for it with his song writing abilities, as well as his creativity in his experimentation with unusual recording techniques and early synthesisers.

The important thing is the end result. Pink Floyd created a lot of self-indulgent shite, but the likes of Darr Side, Wish You Were Here, the Wall etc. were masterpieces. If I wanted to listen to people purely for their musical talent, there are plenty of videos of people fret-wanking on YouTube.

Stuuuuuu makes a good point about Oasis - pub rock is pretty accurate in my opinion. There's no end of love on here for them, but nobody ever complains that as musicians, they are average at best.

Nimrod - your point about 'unknown' session musicians - that was a David Gimour solo performance - not a Pink Floyd one. The session musicians are all credited and all selected for their musical ability. The drummer (Steve DiStanislao) was working with Crosby Stills & Nash, and David Gilmour said he was 'too good not to nick'. The other keyboard player is John Carin, who has worked with post-Waters Pink Floyd and both David Gilmour on recordings and tours for many years and also with Roger Waters as part of his touring band. He has also worked with the likes of Bryan Ferry, Pete Townsend and The Who, and Kate Bush. The sax player is Dick Parry, who performed on Dark Side of the Moon, Wish You Were Here and the Division Bell, and was a member of Joker's Wild with Gilmour before Pink Floyd. The bass player is Guy Pratt, who has worked with Pink Floyd since Roger Waters departed. The other guitarist should need no introduction - it's Phil Manzanera.

If you were in Gilmour's shoes, and you were embarking on a world tour, where you are performing your new album in its entirety, along with old favourites off DSOTM, WYWH and The Wall, you cannot do it on your own and you are not going to play along with a backing tape. Would you carefully select some of the world's best musicians, or would you ring John from the Nag's Head to see if he's got his bass back from Cash Converters yet?
Click to expand...

I know its a Dave solo gig my point is that they do this as Pink Floyd, I have Pulse and theres about 10 muso's on stage, I saw them in Oz and it was the same.

The OP asked 'how good were PF' ? in my post I said they had made some great records but not that great musicians, Gilmour plays tasteful guitar (I acknowledged that) but the rest are very average and none of them can sing well since Syd Barrett left.

If were talking 'live' I prefer a band who can really play, like Weather Report, Yes or Led Zep ...or Deep Purple (as was)
Click to expand...

Punk rock was supposed to kill you off.

And I love 70s pink floyd. But it's nothing to do with their musicianship. Any fool can play guitar.
 
nimrod said:
As musicians, pretty average, instrumentally Gilmour was the most talented

They usually had a bunch of very talented session musicians on stage on theyre big tours
Click to expand...

I don't really get this, especially as you are a musician yourself.

If a band spends a year creating an album in the studio using all of the technology available to produce something that is complex, multi-tracked and multi-layered, it stands to reason that to take that and re-produce it on the road would need elements of it to be either pre-recorded or, if not, to be performed by the band supplemented by additional musicians. This latter option to me seems a far more honest approach?

So I just don 't understand your inferred criticism that to do so is a reflection of their ability as "pretty average" musicians.
 
Musicianship isn't everything ..... I just personally, find them dull whiney and shite ..... and the 'spectacular' stage shows were to keep the punters awake.....
 
1961_vintage said:
nimrod said:
As musicians, pretty average, instrumentally Gilmour was the most talented

They usually had a bunch of very talented session musicians on stage on theyre big tours
Click to expand...

I don't really get this, especially as you are a musician yourself.

If a band spends a year creating an album in the studio using all of the technology available to produce something that is complex, multi-tracked and multi-layered, it stands to reason that to take that and re-produce it on the road would need elements of it to be either pre-recorded or, if not, to be performed by the band supplemented by additional musicians. This latter option to me seems a far more honest approach?

So I just don 't understand your inferred criticism that to do so is a reflection of their ability as "pretty average" musicians.
Click to expand...

Why cant anybody on here have an opinion without somebody getting whiney ffs?

These extra guys dont play trumpets or cello's they play drums & Bass & keyboards and they do vocals and when they play DSOTM they DO use lots of backing tapes and sequenced parts.

I have seen PF 3 times live, I have all theyre albums, I have about 12 bootlegs of theyre concerts I have Pompei both DVd & as a live album, I am a fan, but you have to accept they are average musicians, why does this upset people, its a fact, have you heard Eloy ? (The German Pink Floyd) I have also been a fan of theirs for 20 years I have all theyre albums, most of them are better than PF's and the standard of musicianship is higher.

If you think these guys are musical gods....fine! carry on............. to me they are average, they learnt theyre parts for theyre records and thats what they play, what they are very good at is writing (well Waters & Barrett were) Gilmour is a decent guitarist but to call him elite as somebody did is laughable. I have seen hundreds of live guitarists in my long life and he would come about two thirds up the list.

I repeat if you or anybody else thinks they are great musicians and in fact elite musicians then by all means carry on thinking that.
 
nimrod said:
Why cant anybody on here have an opinion without somebody getting whiney ffs?
If you think these guys are musical gods....fine! carry on.
I repeat if you or anybody else thinks they are great musicians and in fact elite musicians then by all means carry on thinking that.
Click to expand...

Can't see anything in my reply that is "whiney" so don't be such a precious prick. Equally I don't think they are "musical gods", "great musicians" and/or "elite musicians". The very idea is laughable - I'm an adult not a fucking fan-boy. And therefore my question to you was an adult one - in that you seemed to be connecting the need to use additional musicians for their live performances as a reflection on their ability as musicians. But seriously - please don't bother trying to explain if being asked pisses you off as it really is not that important to me.
 
I love the fact that punk failed in every aspiration both musically and politically. Was just a vehicle for frustrated middle class white boys to vent their spleen.
Huge PF fan. Gifted musicians or not they were always more than the sum of their parts. They were studio gurus who needed supplementing on stage. When they were good they were amazing. Not many bands can notch up at least 4 classic albums in a row. They have their fare share of Turkeys as well but on form no one was better.
 
1961_vintage said:
nimrod said:
Why cant anybody on here have an opinion without somebody getting whiney ffs?
If you think these guys are musical gods....fine! carry on.
I repeat if you or anybody else thinks they are great musicians and in fact elite musicians then by all means carry on thinking that.
Click to expand...

Can't see anything in my reply that is "whiney" so don't be such a precious prick. Equally I don't think they are "musical gods", "great musicians" and/or "elite musicians". The very idea is laughable - I'm an adult not a fucking fan-boy. And therefore my question to you was an adult one - in that you seemed to be connecting the need to use additional musicians for their live performances as a reflection on their ability as musicians. But seriously - please don't bother trying to explain if being asked pisses you off as it really is not that important to me.
Click to expand...


no need for the personal abuse mate, Im a **** not a prick
 
Hart of the matter said:
I love the fact that punk failed in every aspiration both musically and politically. Was just a vehicle for frustrated middle class white boys to vent their spleen.
Huge PF fan. Gifted musicians or not they were always more than the sum of their parts. They were studio gurus who needed supplementing on stage. When they were good they were amazing. Not many bands can notch up at least 4 classic albums in a row. They have their fare share of Turkeys as well but on form no one was better.
Click to expand...

Punk didnt fail mate

and many bands were better
 
Hey - who would have thought that a Pink Floyd thread would end up resembling the Ched Evans thread?

Keep going fellas - I was wondering how I would occupy my time over the Xmas break but looks like this thread might just do the trick.

Just don't fucking knock Porcupine Tree or I'll have your balls you bunch of c**ts.
 
chabal said:
Hey - who would have thought that a Pink Floyd thread would end up resembling the Ched Evans thread?

Keep going fellas - I was wondering how I would occupy my time over the Xmas break but looks like this thread might just do the trick.

Just don't fucking knock Porcupine Tree or I'll have your balls you bunch of c**ts.
Click to expand...

Pink Floyd are the greatest band ever and Dave is the best guitarist in the friggin world end of thread

thats fucked you up chantal
 
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