IS Says Jordanian Pilot Burned Alive

[mancityvstoke]

I blame Ched Evans

 

[rickmcfc]

Here's what I don't understand - many of the prominent lefties on this board, eg Damocles, are atheist and will not think twice about ridiculing religious beliefs (quite rightly in my opinion)...

...UNLESS it's Islam, in which case they almost seem to be apologising for and sympathising with Muslims. These are people who believe in fairy stories & displays a real lack of intellect IMO - so why are they given special treatment?

Very confused.

Because there are 1.6 billion Muslims. If you want a Athiest to attack the beliefs of moderate Muslim they can do that... An Athiest doesn't need to attack the beliefs of a jihadi terrorist using religion as an excuse to justify murder as simply there is little point, extremists that kill innocent people are brianwashed, angry (sometimes justified) and mentally ill. It's nothing to do with the actual religion.

It's the equivalent of saying football is evil because of Ched Evans.

Damocles and the ''lefties'' you mention don't go out there way to defend Islam beliefs - we go out our way to stop the discrimination and abuse shown by idiots who whenever a terrorist attack occurs they blame 'muslims' - when in fact the term should be 'extremist bastards' why even give there religion a platform.

However you miss the point that The Koran not only sanctions but advocates some of the actions of these Extremists

Perhaps people like to get caught up in semantics the bottom line is you find it hard to get away from the fact 1.6 Billion people on this planet follow a religion that actually advocates the actual persecution of non believers and if that wasn't enough this so called religion also denies 50% of the worlds population equal rights.


I find it hard to believe any sane person can defend the teachings of the Koran whether or not you get into the arguments about what should be classed as a moderate or extremist.

Defend the teachings of the Koran to your Daughter or your Mother.

Very well said.

 

[idahoblues]

Cobblers

What's cobblers?

Northampton.

Went to college in Northampton, went to a lot of Cobblers games. Back then they played at the `County Ground' easily the worst ground in the league
Still my second team

 

[Silva_Spell]

Here's what I don't understand - many of the prominent lefties on this board, eg Damocles, are atheist and will not think twice about ridiculing religious beliefs (quite rightly in my opinion)...

...UNLESS it's Islam, in which case they almost seem to be apologising for and sympathising with Muslims. These are people who believe in fairy stories & displays a real lack of intellect IMO - so why are they given special treatment?

Very confused.

Because there are 1.6 billion Muslims. If you want a Athiest to attack the beliefs of moderate Muslim they can do that... An Athiest doesn't need to attack the beliefs of a jihadi terrorist using religion as an excuse to justify murder as simply there is little point, extremists that kill innocent people are brianwashed, angry (sometimes justified) and mentally ill. It's nothing to do with the actual religion.

It's the equivalent of saying football is evil because of Ched Evans.

Damocles and the ''lefties'' you mention don't go out there way to defend Islam beliefs - we go out our way to stop the discrimination and abuse shown by idiots who whenever a terrorist attack occurs they blame 'muslims' - when in fact the term should be 'extremist bastards' why even give there religion a platform.

False.

You need to get it into your head that there really are people out there who take their religious beliefs very, very seriously. You're right to talk about brainwashing but to deny that it's religious in nature... well, you may as well be saying that the Westboro Baptist Church is a secular organisation.

The majority of Muslims are moderate, they see their religion in a similar way to most moderate conservative leaning Christians do (ie. they may think homosexuality is wrong but generally keep it a personal belief), however there's a sizeable portion of Muslims (tens to hundreds of millions worldwide) who we would (did and do) consider pieces of shit if they were Christians or just political organisations like the EDL. I'm talking about fundamentalist or extreme Muslims who aren't terrorists but given the chance would (and do) force their beliefs on others, people who think you forfeit your life if you leave the religion etc. These beliefs and communities are a breeding ground for Islamist terrorists. And they are the sub communities within the 'Islamic community' that pretty much only the reasonable moderate Muslim majority can truly deal with.

Christianity was made moderate with the help of outside irreligious influences but most of the actual work was done from within. There are a few Muslim organisations, like Quilliam, out there who are actively pushing back against the fundamentalists but they are few and far between at present. But at least it's a start, a start which could be made easier if more 'lefties' actually stood up for liberal principles when the topic of Islam pops up.
I wouldn't want to paint it all as a fear of being seen as racist or bigoted by many of their compatriots but there certainly is an element of that to it.

 

[SWP's back]

Here's what I don't understand - many of the prominent lefties on this board, eg Damocles, are atheist and will not think twice about ridiculing religious beliefs (quite rightly in my opinion)...

...UNLESS it's Islam, in which case they almost seem to be apologising for and sympathising with Muslims. These are people who believe in fairy stories & displays a real lack of intellect IMO - so why are they given special treatment?

Very confused.

Because there are 1.6 billion Muslims. If you want a Athiest to attack the beliefs of moderate Muslim they can do that... An Athiest doesn't need to attack the beliefs of a jihadi terrorist using religion as an excuse to justify murder as simply there is little point, extremists that kill innocent people are brianwashed, angry (sometimes justified) and mentally ill. It's nothing to do with the actual religion.

It's the equivalent of saying football is evil because of Ched Evans.

Damocles and the ''lefties'' you mention don't go out there way to defend Islam beliefs - we go out our way to stop the discrimination and abuse shown by idiots who whenever a terrorist attack occurs they blame 'muslims' - when in fact the term should be 'extremist bastards' why even give there religion a platform.

No it isn't anything of the sort.

Did he rape in the name of football? Did he rape her because she was a Wednesday fan?

 

[oakiecokie]

8 February 2015, 10:43
Prince Charles: UK Youth Extremism 'Alarming'

e-mail

The Prince of Wales has voiced concern over the "alarming" radicalisation of young people in the UK.

In a radio interview Prince Charles said the extent to which young people are becoming radicalised is one of the "greatest worries".

He said it was particularly concerning "in a country like ours where you know the values we hold dear".

"You think that the people who have come here, born here, go to school here, would abide by those values and outlooks," the Prince told BBC Radio 2's The Sunday Hour.

His comments came as he kicked off a six-day tour of the Middle East.

The Prince of Wales landed in Jordan late on Saturday, where he is due to hold talks with King Abdullah II.

Jordan has carried out three consecutive days of airstrikes on Islamic State targets after the terrorist group released a video showing 26-year-old Jordanian pilot Moaz al Kasabeh being burned to death.

Prince Charles said preventing the radicalisation of Muslim youth was a "great challenge" and something that could not be swept "under the carpet".

He expressed particular concern over the threat posed by young Muslims coming into contact with extremists online, describing it as "frightening".

"I can see I suppose to a certain extent, some aspect of this radicalisation is a search for adventure and excitement at a particular age," he said, adding that he had tried to create alternative paths for young people through his work with The Princes Trust charity.

The Prince's tour will also see him travel to Kuwait, Saudi Arabia, Qatar and the United Arab Emirates.

His first official stop in Jordan was a Syrian refugee camp to see how thousands displaced from their homeland are rebuilding their lives.

The Prince was joined by International Development Secretary Justine Greening.

Good old Charlie Boy. Or is he barking mad (again) ?

 

[nobody can eat fifty eggs]

I wonder why ISIS haven't invaded Israel yet?

By orders of the Zionists running America by any chance?

 

[mindmyp's_n_q's]

I wonder why ISIS haven't invaded Israel yet?

By orders of the Zionists running America by any chance?

[bigimg]http://img1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20130211050004/friends/images/d/da/Shocked.gif[/bigimg]

 

[oakiecokie]

I wonder why ISIS haven't invaded Israel yet?

By orders of the Zionists running America by any chance?

Have you got a tin hat ? ;)

 

[roaminblue]

However you miss the point that The Koran not only sanctions but advocates some of the actions of these Extremists

Perhaps people like to get caught up in semantics the bottom line is you find it hard to get away from the fact 1.6 Billion people on this planet follow a religion that actually advocates the actual persecution of non believers and if that wasn't enough this so called religion also denies 50% of the worlds population equal rights.

I find it hard to believe any sane person can defend the teachings of the Koran whether or not you get into the arguments about what should be classed as a moderate or extremist.

Defend the teachings of the Koran to your Daughter or your Mother.

But would you argue that any of the Abrahamic religions don't have pretty abhorrent text within it?

If not, then surely we must look further beyond simply the religious text?

There is a great deal of commonality between Islam and Christianity. They are both religious texts written an incredibly long-time ago, in a different world entirely. They both contain incredibly restrictive and prescriptive doctrine, they have both been tools to, historically, control and subjugate.

So surely there is something else at play, rather than it being just religious indoctrination?

I mean, quite frankly, its a book. Firstly, a book written by people, it doesn't have magical powers, its "strength" lies in its interpretation. Like with any religious material, there will be passages some people follow word-for-word, there will be some passages that people gloss over and ignore.

In the bible isn't there some guff about it being a sin to eat shellfish?

Anyway, taking the above into account, then there must be other factors to consider, surely?

In the case of religious extremism, barbarism, murder, etc. It will almost certainly fall under socio-demographic factors. What are themes that a number of middle eastern countries have in common? Poverty, lack of education, lack of resources, (etc.)

Barbarism isn't restricted to religion, but it is strongly correlated with the above. Take Mexico City. In recent years it has recorded higher murder counts than Afghanistan. Take MS13, want to have a bet on who has beheaded more people, them or ISIS? I don't know the true figures, it may well be ISIS. But I tell you what, I wouldn't bet my house upon the outcome without doing in depth research.

The simple, unavoidable, truth is that religious subordination weakens as a countries GDP grows, as its citizens come out of poverty, as its citizens gain education. We can look at some of the more developed Muslim countries. Dubai, UAE, etc. While they aren't exactly places I would like to make my home, they are more tolerant of different cultures than a number of muslim countries; it could even be argued they've come an incredibly long way, at an incredibly fast pace considering when they started their path of development.

As for UK born extremists. This is a different topic, but again, its probably no surprise that a lot of these people are those who found their extreme sense of relegion at a later stage in life. The murderers of Lee Rigby, Choudary himself, even the recent article on the BBC discussing female Jihadis - all "born again" to a certain extent.

This to me looks more like individuals who are disenfranchised, detached, lacking a sense of community. Although the current events are extreme examples, its probably not a hugely different mindset than those from the UK who supported the IRA, spied for Russia, etc.

I mean, although massively different even those who become football hooligans I think are testament to a certain section of society who lack identity and try to fill that void.

Anyway, just my opinion and the actions are of course abhorrent. I just don't think the solution is placing the emphasis on a book that, in its own right, can actually just be put down as an example of fiction.