Jorginho

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TRUE BLUE NO1 said:
I dont expect him to get 15 goals a season.....thats not what his game is about! He helps others get more goals....a bit like a QB that passes to a WR or hands off to a RB....his style of play will helps others get more goals. I think he's a good player, just felt there was better options out there that offered more flexibility.
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Here we go with the American football analogy again. :P

No one understands you bro!!!
 
Dax777 said:
Here we go with the American football analogy again. :P

No one understands you bro!!!
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He's like Pirlo or Alonso. I don't know why people continuously use this American football analogy when Football has had deep-lying playmakers and registas for decades on decades.
 
93.01 said:
I think this may be what Pep is looking for. Therefore although it's legitimate to have concerns about how we may shape up defensively, I think it may be time to drop comparisons between jorghino and ferdy. Two different players.
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Excellent article. Jorginho is indeed a Registss or a Quarter Back Dax ;-D
 
BlueindianNewcity said:
If he comes, I would assume that our wide forwards will end up with at least 10 more assists combined next season. His 'over the defense' passes are awesome.
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I think we're going to be even more of an attacking threat this season. Can't wait to see what this team is capable of when Pep has finished building it.
 
93.01 said:
Homar, is right. The role jorghino will take up is akin to Regista. This role has different responsibilities to that of defensive midfielder.
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A regista is a type of defensive midfielder.

There will be no doubt that Jorginho will be the defensive midfielder in the team regardless of what he does with the ball, and anyone who's watched him at Napoli should know that. Pep will call him a holding midfielder which is the terminology he's already used to describe the position whilst he's been here.

Also anyone posting a video of Pirlo expecting Pep to play Jorginho like that is out of their minds, Guardiola would never have accepted a player that who contributed so little off the ball and needed 3 midfielders to do enough running to make up for his lack of mobility.

If he wanted to do that he could have kept Yaya.
 
Neville Kneville said:
Except, a lot of the time, Pep has required Fernandinho to be a 'holding' midfielder, not this.

Which is pretty much a defensive midfielder a lot of the time.

He has had him challenging for headers with people like Harry Kane whilst the cbs drop off, and also dropping into the penalty area to win headers & also dropping between the central defenders winning challenges. If he didn't want that, Fern would be doing something else.

So the idea Pep doesn't play with a defensive midfielder is actually, not really true.

He just won the Premier League with imo the world's best one playing there & in Pep's opinion, one of the 3 best.

“I think Fernandinho, right now, is one of the three best holding midfielders in the world,” said the City manager.

https://www.mancity.com/news/first-...er/pep-says-fernandinho-is-one-of-worlds-best

He may decide to play with a 'quarterback'. Or he may change from one game to the next.

But Pep Guardiola has benn using a 'holding' midfielder. So fuck his books off & look at what he's done in he Premier League, & see what he does next, rather than basing everything on stuff he did years ago.
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He talks about holding midfielders and defensive midfielders all the time in the book, I don't know why anyone would think it goes against the idea of him having a defensive midfielder. Lahm going there was the biggest decision of the season, then he decided he needed 2 holding midfielders not 1, he was converting Javi Martinez from holding midfielder to centre back etc.

"He's the best defensive central midfielder in the world." - Guardiola on Busquets playing pretty much the role of our guy at the base of midfield.

‘He is one of the best holding midfielders I’ve ever seen in my life by far. He’s the level of Xabi Alonso and Sergio Busquets.’ - Being generous with the praise for Carrick.

I don't know where this semantic debate has arisen from over the last few days that Pep either a) doesn't want/use a defensive midfielder or b)Jorginho isn't a defensive midfielder but it's all a load of shite, seemingly coming about because people can't work out that a 6'3'' clogger in the middle of the park isn't the only type of defensive mid.

Jorginho is a holding midfielder, Fernandinho is a holding midfielder. Both have different strenghts and weakness, sometimes both might play, otherwise it'll be horses for courses.


As for the point you bring up with headers - you're right that Fern has become our main defender of aerial balls, with the CB's mopping up the knock downs, or picking up the runners rather than challenging the target man themselves which is what was happening before that Leicester City game when they murdered us getting the second ball every time. With Jorginho that might have to be reversed, putting someone like Laporte on the big man, and having Jorginho mop up and the other CB track any runners.

What will be interesting to me is if that change is made permanently or just when Jorginho is playing. I don't like the idea of CB's having to switch half way through a match or from game to game because I can already see Stones/Otamendi not realising they were supposed to track the runner this time and some relegation candidate team scores against us when someone is 1v1 from a flicked on header.
 
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We really want to close on this deal, Napoli also realizing they have to lock in a replacement soon as their main targets are difficult to sign. Hopefully this saga ends soon.
 
Well Khaldoon said we work a window in advance and knew our targets early. Is it only the player we negotiate with at that point or the club as well?
 
domalino said:
He talks about holding midfielders and defensive midfielders all the time in the book, I don't know why anyone would think it goes against the idea of him having a defensive midfielder. Lahm going there was the biggest decision of the season, then he decided he needed 2 holding midfielders not 1, he was converting Javi Martinez from holding midfielder to centre back etc.

"He's the best defensive central midfielder in the world." - Guardiola on Busquets playing pretty much the role of our guy at the base of midfield.

‘He is one of the best holding midfielders I’ve ever seen in my life by far. He’s the level of Xabi Alonso and Sergio Busquets.’ - Being generous with the praise for Carrick.

I don't know where this semantic debate has arisen from over the last few days that Pep either a) doesn't want/use a defensive midfielder or b)Jorginho isn't a defensive midfielder but it's all a load of shite, seemingly coming about because people can't work out that a 6'3'' clogger in the middle of the park isn't the only type of defensive mid.

Jorginho is a holding midfielder, Fernandinho is a holding midfielder. Both have different strenghts and weakness, sometimes both might play, otherwise it'll be horses for courses.


As for the point you bring up with headers - you're right that Fern has become our main defender of aerial balls, with the CB's mopping up the knock downs, or picking up the runners rather than challenging the target man themselves which is what was happening before that Leicester City game when they murdered us getting the second ball every time. With Jorginho that might have to be reversed, putting someone like Laporte on the big man, and having Jorginho mop up and the other CB track any runners.

What will be interesting to me is if that change is made permanently or just when Jorginho is playing. I don't like the idea of CB's having to switch half way through a match or from game to game because I can already see Stones/Otamendi not realising they were supposed to track the runner this time and some relegation candidate team scores against us when someone is 1v1 from a flicked on header.
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Brilliant post and sums it up perfectly.

Whether you call it a Defensive Midfielder, a Holding Midfielder, a Pivot, a Regista, a number 6, who gives a fuck? It's the same thing. It's the deepest lying midfielder in a 3 man midfield, with two others playing in front.

..........6........
....8............8

A De Jong or a Makelele or Kanté might be better at winning the ball back and giving it simple, but when you average 70% possession, having a grafter who wins a load of tackles isn't quite so important as having someone who can pass the ball forwards.

Fernandinho is brilliant at reading play and winning the ball back. But he's also great at passing the ball forwards. Gundogan is pretty fucking useless at winning the ball back. But he's absolutely mustard at playing the ball forwards. When he filled in for Fernandinho, no one can tell me we were playing a completley different system. Swapping a "Defensive Midfielder" for a "Regista". Fuck Off. It's exactly the same system, each player has just got different attributes.

People calling for a "new DeJong" have just got no fucking clue what they're talking about. We have the ball 70% of the time, we don't need a player who's main attribute is running around and winning the ball back. We need someone who's comfortable on the ball under pressure, can find a forward pass in to tight areas and can be positionally disciplined. If Pep thinks Jorginho is the man to do that for us, then I trust him. He's not done too bad so far.
 
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