Loyalty

allyboy said:
Good post but a bit blinkered to say the least.

Football from a players perspective has changed from the "loyal" days.
There are however some players that still believe it is required.
Those players usually go on and be successful at their respective clubs.

Hate to say it but Giggs is the perfect example.
I'm sure there's been 1 or 200 clubs in the last 15 years that have tried to buy him but he's red scum through and through.

We need continuity and stability for at least 3 years before we can see the rewards.
Players should know that when they sign. The club should know that when they appoint a manager.

Well said. Although I wish you had chose another example other than Giggs who was prised away from City by the Edwards kiddie tapping regime that entered OT when they were under the financial cosh pre Sky TV money coming in.
 
you make reference to united fans getting behind Forlan, its was easy for them to do that as their team was in the top 2 of the league and playing well, so its easy to be sympathetic to the 1 stand-out player playing poorly.

The thing is... right now at city its like we have a team of Forlan's rather than just one, which is why people are struggling to get behind the players, especially considering how much we are paying them.
 
good post,but i think the expectation levels went through the roof when the arabs an there billions came in hence the dissapointment is far greater which has lead to this outpouring of rage
 
Ryan Giggs... he's been booed by his own on more than one occasion, as has Ferguson, Ralph Milne, Garry Birtles, Peter Davenport and a few more besides.
 
Anybody remember Diego Forlan? I can't remember how long it was, but when he was United, he didn't score for an absolute age. United fans still were singing his name and were willing him on, instead of saying how shit he was. As much as I dislike to use this as an example, it is the first that comes to mind.

The difference is they were probably still winning games. We should throw up a cheer if we cross the halfway line these days.
 
unquestioning loyalty is not the way forward. people may take advantage.

better to make an honest judgement of where you stand with someone. are their actions those of someone who is committed to the cause?

robinho is a case in point. people showed enormous patience with him, defended him to the death. I bet almost no-one feels like that now, quite rightly so, because he's patently not the least interested in the success of this club. all the nice things he had said in interviews turned out to be meaningless.

I'm not asking for every player to throw themselves into tackles like Zabaleta. and I'm not asking for them all to run around as much as Tevez. everyone has a different style, and those differences are what make a team. what I look for is a bit more subtle. is this player doing the best he can at any moment? admittedly poor form and fitness can be mistaken for lack of effort, but you do try to build up a picture of how hard people are trying to make it work for the team. and over a period of time, you can build up a picture of someone's attitude from the way they behave and, occasionally, the things they say. it's also important to consider their personal and professional situation.

for example, barry gets a lot of stick. but I think he has as much interest in our team succeeding as any of our players. he is not going to get another chance for success at his age. I'd love him to take control of games more, but he always breaks sweat and does a lot of small things to help the team. he doesn't often fuck up and put his own team mates in the shit. therefore I believe that the positive attitude that he projects in his interview is genuine.

there are other players who I just don't believe are thinking about the team at all. I always worry that some of them would be perfectly happy to walk away and join another premiership club, and I sometimes question their commitment to making it work here and now. perhaps they don't have anything to lose, they have a way they want to work, and rather than embracing change, continuing to push themselves, they could just start again at another club if it doesn't work out here. really I'm saying that I doubt every last one of them is completely committed, and motivated to put in that last 10%. it's not about running yourself into the ground. the last 10% is mental, it's taking responsibility, it's putting your heart and soul into the success of the team. I guess for some it is putting your heart and soul into being everything that you can be, working hard to improve, working hard to concentrate and contribute for the full 90.

it's just the way football is. some of these players have had several clubs already, and walked away when things didn't work out. they aren't scared of doing it again. you can't tell me that it makes sense to be blindly loyal to people in that situation. sentiment is fine to a point. but even ex-academy players, especially ex-academy players, have to continuously contribute everything they can, otherwise they are taking up a place in the squad that should be given to someone more motivated and determined to be as useful as possible. human nature being what it is, if we allow sentiment to interfere with our attitude to ex-academy players, you run the risk that they will abuse that goodwill.
 
It's their bloody jobs to go out and do their best on and off the pitch.

You don't expect any less from any other professional, a doctor you don't expect to have some days where he just can't be arsed and then angles for a transfer to a different hospital whilst putting in half arsed shifts and threatening to not turn up to his clinics. Bollocks.

Players need to grow a pair and realise that they are privilaged to be playing a sport for a living and getting very well payed to do so. Even if fans give a torrent of abuse for a poor performance, so what, it's justified. It would be justified if a patients wrote in and complained about a doctor after a botched operation and even reported him to the GMC. Come on, players are professionals and not some sort of different species that needs to be wrapped in cotton wool so their egos remain undamaged.
 
allyboy said:
Good post but a bit blinkered to say the least.

Football from a players perspective has changed from the "loyal" days.
There are however some players that still believe it is required.
Those players usually go on and be successful at their respective clubs.

Hate to say it but Giggs is the perfect example.
I'm sure there's been 1 or 200 clubs in the last 15 years that have tried to buy him but he's red scum through and through.

We need continuity and stability for at least 3 years before we can see the rewards.
Players should know that when they sign. The club should know that when they appoint a manager.

I don't think Giggs loyalty has ever been tested to be honest. A move to another English team would have been pointless, trophy wise and money wise no other team could have offered him more than United. Never seemed interested in a move abroad either as far as I'm aware? Same with Scholes, he could only have really moved to Real Madrid to better himself and his prospects.

Mat Le Tissier was loyal. Great player who persisted in playing for a shit team.
 
Very little loyalty in football these days. SWP proved that when he ran to Chelsea for money. Now he wants more money before he will sign a new contract. Let him earn it instead of running straight into defenders. We want to be at the top so why did we resign a chelsea flop. As you can see I am not a great fan of SWP. We need to sign players who will give 100% for what ever club they play for. No:1 example has to be Tevez. Where ever he has played he has given everything. This man is a winner & the rest of our players of any age. Should look at him as an example. Maybe if they did we could soon join the so called top 4.
 

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