Middle East Conflict | Netanyahu orders strikes on Gaza (p1161)

blueinsa said:
Doubt they would bomb but I’d wager Mossad would be sending a team in to dispose of them.
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A bit like Putin sending a couple of his lads to Salisbury to do Skripal. Why our government made such a fuss about that I'll never know. It's not like it's illegal or anything...
 
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blueinsa said:
Israel is surrounded by enemies who want nothing more than to wipe them from the face of the Earth.

That has always been the case.

That was the case before this war started and will be the case long after it’s finished.

What exactly could Israel do that would enable them to live peacefully with its predominately Muslim neighbours?

I’m all ears?
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Maybe a hearts and minds campaign to win over the majority of the populace who want to live in peace and see their kids grow up without the potential of being injured or killed by reckless military action? There will always be radicals but there would be far fewer if people were not having their loved ones butchered by indiscriminate air strikes and artillery fire. Israel's security forces had a calamitous failure in not detecting and countering the Hamas action but that does not justify a nation state responding as they are doing.
 
Postman Pep said:
www.middleeasteye.net

Israel-Palestine war: Mounting evidence suggests Israel may be ready to ‘cleanse’ Gaza

All the signs are in place that Israel is once again seriously considering a massive ethnic cleansing operation, conducted at lightning speed and with US assistance
www.middleeasteye.net www.middleeasteye.net
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That's just propaganda i'm afraid, it's a red line in the sand drawn by the US and Egypt there is absolutely no way it would happen

I think you have to be very choosy about where you pick your news sources from Haaratz, Al Qasira, Sky, BBC, Guardian are all quite reliable in my experience
 
blueinsa said:
Israel is surrounded by enemies who want nothing more than to wipe them from the face of the Earth.

That has always been the case.

That was the case before this war started and will be the case long after it’s finished.

What exactly could Israel do that would enable them to live peacefully with its predominately Muslim neighbours?

I’m all ears?
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I think power and money trumps everything. Ideology, religious beliefs everything, Its how the IRA was ultimately solved imo. Give them power give them an ear.
At the same time, territories in the west bank being taken is clearly an inflammatory thing and needs to be rolled back, make concessions, give land to these people.
That good will would be a start and things go from there. It might not work but its an effort, a serious effort to avoid what is inevitable... Hamas, Hezbollah, (helped by Iran or whoever) will get hold of chemical or dirty weapons and then it goes nuclear. And what Israel are doing now is fuelling exactly that.

So, for me, anything other than what they are doing now is better. Israel are undoubtedly sowing more seeds of anger against them. And the israel government right now need that, they need that anger so they can portray themselves as the saviour of Israel, the party to vote for. Its a downward spiral that will only end badly. All just my opinion though after seeing this run out over the last 50 years.
 
Ducado said:
Well the first thing is the most obvious, get back to the negotiating table, and be serious about the two state solution and not some Bantostan style enclaves that were offered previously (a number of Gaza strips)

The next is stop the brutality on the West Bank, if you can’t see it’s counterproductive then you are blind, there is no need to use live ammunition on rock throwing kids, or the daily humiliation at checkpoints, or the unimpeded violence from settlers so dressed in army uniforms

Quite a few Muslim countries have diplomatic relationships with Israel including the UAE and there is travel and trade, as far as I am aware there is only one country that wants to destroy Israel and that’s Iran and it’s proxy armies

With a fair and just settlement peace would come, there are always going to be some radicals on both sides that will object

What’s your objection to a fair and just settlement? Can you not see that without it this cycle of violence will just go on and on? Or are you enjoying the sight of innocent people being killed and maimed on both sides?

It’s one or the other I’m afraid military might won’t solve this problem it hasn’t before and it won’t now all it does is keep the cycle going

I’m not alone in this, most intelligent commentators see this, because it’s blindingly obvious
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Sounds reasonable but here is the issue.

Hamas and Hezbollah are not interested in a 2 state solution so who are Israel expected to negotiate with and will Hamas and Hezbollah stop their attacks?
 
blueinsa said:
Sounds reasonable but here is the issue.

Hamas and Hezbollah are not interested in a 2 state solution so who are Israel expected to negotiate with and will Hamas and Hezbollah stop their attacks?
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Maybe it suits Netanyahu not to have to negotiate. Maybe the end justifies the means.
Let’s see what the end game is.
You would think at some stage negotiation for hostage release/exchange should happen.

Like I say, let’s see where priorities really lie.
 
metalblue said:
Interestingly many experts, governments and commentators at the time said this was Hamas accepting a two state solution although I’m not entirely convinced of that interpretation from the text.

I’m curious why you think Israel would accept a two state solution though. Let’s look at the evidence; we already have some sort of de-facto two state setup - yet there is no happy coexistence from either side. For example, Israeli settlers have long been an issue - moving in, attacking local Palestinians and destroying Palestinian crops (which they rely upon for food self sufficiency and income) all under the watchful eye of the IDF - this, one might be forgiven for thinking, is state sponsored. How do you even begin to reconcile that with an Israeli desire for a peaceful two state solution? Actions speak louder than words.
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It’s democracy in action, apparently.
 
cucumberman said:
Why concluding on religion only, when the 1948 massacre and gradual push of 750,000 humans to have their lands exiled out is because of culture.

Before 1920s, Palestine was a productive state with modernization, international trade, transport (including its railway around 1900, by Jews, Christians and Arabs. And then came Ben Gurion and that changed
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Certainly not blaming religion alone mate. People kill people.
 
blueinsa said:
Sounds reasonable but here is the issue.

Hamas and Hezbollah are not interested in a 2 state solution so who are Israel expected to negotiate with and will Hamas and Hezbollah stop their attacks?
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You can't keep saying Hamas, in isolation, aren't interested in a two state solution, when Netanyahu also isn't.

The PLO signed up to a two state solution and recognised the state of Israel. Netanyahu literally marched in the streets to oppose the Oslo accord. And whilst in power he has done everything he can to squash the PLOs influence in Gaza and support Hamas'.
 
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