Our best ever player

[supercity88]

I don't doubt David and Yaya, I question the relative (worse) standing of Bernardo.

One can argue that Dickov made more decisive contributions than Bernardo, but we discuss here the overall quality.

Bernardo vs Liverpool in January 2019, and Bernardo vs Bayern and Real in 2023 were better performances against better teams than David's and Yaya's best performances which came against lesser teams (United were a dying giant back then, nowhere near as good as Liverpool and Real). I think people conflate the emotional significance of beating United and winning first trophies in the PL era with objective quality. Taking into account the whole package, namely technique, intelligence, big-game mentality, productivity vs our domestic and European rivals, work rate, defensive contributions, big trophies, etc... Bernardo is not worse than David and Yaya. It's because he played in a better team with world stars like KDB, Haaland and now Rodri that he is a bit underrated.

IMO, he's much more of a Pep player than Yaya, who I'm not sure could press and run like Bernardo. Ultimately, Bernie has 3-4 advantages over Yaya: consistency over many years, top performances against the best in Europe, work rate and intricate play in small spaces (which Pep adores).

The rags got to the CL final that season and only lost 7 games all season, also winning the league. Liverpool and Real were better teams yes, but so were we. 35 years without a trophy, a team without much experience winning things either - that requires special players to step up.

There's definitely the sentiment of us having great teams not great individual players. I think the fact Pep rotates so much means only certain standout performances get the praise they should. Haaland scores loads so stands out for praise. Rodri plays and usually wins so the same is true. De Bruyne delivers goals and assists and highlight reels galore. Bernardo is consistently brilliant and delivers in big games but is perhaps lost amongst other headlines unfairly.

You're right about Pep's view and the metrics in Bernie's favour.

Ultimately it's hard to separate favourite moments and players from greatest.

But De Bruyne wins anyway!

 

[alexmcity]

The rags got to the CL final that season and only lost 7 games all season, also winning the league. Liverpool and Real were better teams yes, but so were we. 35 years without a trophy, a team without much experience winning things either - that requires special players to step up.

There's definitely the sentiment of us having great teams not great individual players. I think the fact Pep rotates so much means only certain standout performances get the praise they should. Haaland scores loads so stands out for praise. Rodri plays and usually wins so the same is true. De Bruyne delivers goals and assists and highlight reels galore. Bernardo is consistently brilliant and delivers in big games but is perhaps lost amongst other headlines unfairly.

You're right about Pep's view and the metrics in Bernie's favour.

Ultimately it's hard to separate favourite moments and players from greatest.

But De Bruyne wins anyway!

Good points. Still think United were in decline after they peaked between 07 and 09. They won the league in 2011 with 80 pts and were lucky in the CL. Pep humiliated them in the final. Can't forget Ferguson's shaking hand.

Of course, United still were a force and our lads did brilliantly to beat them. And then Liverpool in 13/14 when Yaya was sublime.

 

[bhayes]

I think the fact that KdB is in the debate for possibly top 3 greatest PL players of all time by other fanbases and pundits and David Silva isn't answers the question

 

[ChicagoBlue]

It’s all personal, because objectivity and football rarely go together, especially over the decades and different football eras.

In his day, and as a local lad, Colin Bell would have been considered a top, top player, but Franny Lee was a bigger star in that era, and neither were considered especially as the top players of their day domestically, let alone internationally, so placing any of that era in with global superstars who did it for club and country is much harder, without blue-tinted specs.

All-Time? Well, I can only comment on my 50+ years of watching City and create a handful of players who could have played for any team in the world while they were at their best playing for City.

KDB - Best all-rounder over last decade
Sergio - Best pure striker I’ve ever seen
Yaya - Most dominant midfield presence
David - Most skillful and exquisite touch
Rodri - Strongest current all-rounder ITW.

It’s no secret I think Godri is the best player in the world at the moment, but best all-time…while at City?

I’ll stick with the order above, because Rodri is another season or two from the rest. He may move up that pecking order, but let’s see what he looks like next season, and the one after that, and the one after that.

 

[alexmcity]

It’s all personal, because objectivity and football rarely go together, especially over the decades and different football eras.

In his day, and as a local lad, Colin Bell would have been considered a top, top player, but Franny Lee was a bigger star in that era, and neither were considered especially as the top players of their day domestically, let alone internationally, so placing any of that era in with global superstars who did it for club and country is much harder, without blue-tinted specs.

All-Time? Well, I can only comment on my 50+ years of watching City and create a handful of players who could have played for any team in the world while they were at their best playing for City.

KDB - Best all-rounder over last decade
Sergio - Best pure striker I’ve ever seen
Yaya - Most dominant midfield presence
David - Most skillful and exquisite touch
Rodri - Strongest current all-rounder ITW.

It’s no secret I think Godri is the best player in the world at the moment, but best all-time…while at City?

I’ll stick with the order above, because Rodri is another season or two from the rest. He may move up that pecking order, but let’s see what he looks like next season, and the one after that, and the one after that.

I agree with much of what you say, but I think that KDB is an all-rounder only attacking wise, he is lacking defensively, except for high pressing in his younger years. He's a genius at completing passes that other players can't even see.

The beauty of Rodri is he can do everything from top defending to top passing to scoring top goals. He is *the* all-rounder. His main (aesthetical) problem is that he is exceptional at things that don't capture the imagination, like being utterly complete in all phases of the game, being able to read the game like a manager, and also being able to receive and progress the ball under intense pressure as if the oppo players aren't there. Unlike other legends, Anfield couldn't bother him.

Yaya had the talent to do such things, he played as a CB in a CL final! But I'm not sure he had the stamina and attitude to do what Rodri did over 4 consecutive seasons. Rodri was covering most distance for club and country. Also, he is more of a natural leader than the other picks.

 

[bondsman]

I agree with much of what you say, but I think that KDB is an all-rounder only attacking wise, he is lacking defensively, except for high pressing in his younger years. He's a genius at completing passes that other players can't even see.

The beauty of Rodri is he can do everything from top defending to top passing to scoring top goals. He is *the* all-rounder. His main (aesthetical) problem is that he is exceptional at things that don't capture the imagination, like being utterly complete in all phases of the game, being able to read the game like a manager, and also being able to receive and progress the ball under intense pressure as if the oppo players aren't there. Unlike other legends, Anfield couldn't bother him.

Yaya had the talent to do such things, he played as a CB in a CL final! But I'm not sure he had the stamina and attitude to do what Rodri did over 4 consecutive seasons. Rodri was covering most distance for club and country. Also, he is more of a natural leader than the other picks.

Agree. Imagine if we had Rodri and peak Yaya in same team frightening. KDB very special though. How many times has he been the difference for us.