Pep Guardiola

[BlueDejong]

Even Mancio, who loves Mancini and is qualified more than most to speak of his managerial merits, stated the other day that Pep is a major upgrade.

What happen next summer ?

 

[Didsbury Dave]

Even Mancio, who loves Mancini and is qualified more than most to speak of his managerial merits, stated the other day that Pep is a major upgrade.

Jesus, did he really?

Who next? Damocles?

 

[Scareye]

Even Mancio, who loves Mancini and is qualified more than most to speak of his managerial merits, stated the other day that Pep is a major upgrade.

I don't know how anyone can say that with any degree of certainty.
If Mancini were to leave for whatever reason, there is only one man who you could be sure would be an upgrade.
I won't mention his name as it annoys some people on here :-)

 

[Uwe's 80s mullet]

Does anyone in their right mind really think City would go for Benitez? Cannot see it at all myself.

Not after his meltdown at liverpool and his shocking performance at Inter (a side that had just months before won the CL)

 

[Chippy_boy]

I think we can relax safe in the knowledge that Benitez is NOT coming to City any time this millennium.

 

[sniff]

What does make me smile are those who try and play down Guardiola's achievements with Barca, stating his success is all down to his great players.

But when others suggest the same re Bobby, you are lambasted for it.

Can't have it both ways.

Mancini had never managed outside of Italy before he came to us.

Guardiola is clearly a superior manager in terms of the definition of trophies he has won.

That's all you can judge any manager on.

Del Bosque is one of football's greatest-ever, but he stuck it out in Spain, didn't do too bad.

It also make's me smile when people dissregard the fact Rijkaard left him a team of champion's. He also took control if a stable and club that had all the right people in place...

It also fails to take into account that he built his team around three players that Rikaard can be credited with bringing to the peak of the game.. Xavi, Inesta, Messi. He got very lucky, a once in a lifetime deal, just like bacon chops dwn the road.

To say he is poor is wrong, but to say he alone is the foundation of those achivements is way off the mark. That point is the one above all he will be required to do at Chelsea

Rijkaard did not bring Messi to the peak of his game. He left a Barca team short on discipline, overweight, and ego-driven.

It's certainly laughable to suggest Ferguson got lucky with his crop of youngsters, he had nurtured them for years before blooding them, integrating them one by one.

Explain to me how Ferguson also got lucky at Aberdeen?

Messi became the superstar he is because of his natural talent being realised by Pep.

Messi was skilfully allowed to go to the Youth World Cup by Pep, something which became the catalyst for their bond and his form.

He employed a different playing style than Rijkaard, who was more off-the-cuff.

Really, well he gave him his debut at 17, played him as a regular for four years and moved him to the right wing.. In that time he was nominated twice in the player of the year awards and already regarded as one of the worlds best.. You cant really say he nutured the lad into the big time, he was already a star.

How Pep allowed him to go to the youth world cup is beyond me, he wasnt his manager at the time, it was Pere Gratacos that allowed him leave to go.



Id also love a overweight and ego drive team if they win the Cup, the leauge and the Champions leauge.. He may not have wone everything every year as Barca demand, but he wasnt poor as you are saying either.

As for fergie, i dont really see why his time at Aberdeen is being brought into this, i never questioned his ability as a manager, did i ?

But if you do not think a awfull lot of luck went into that youth team as well as hard work you are mad. Lots of clubs do exactly what they did at the time, but they didnt get the break that brought them 6/7 international in the space of 4/5 years.

 

[OB1]

Even Mancio, who loves Mancini and is qualified more than most to speak of his managerial merits, stated the other day that Pep is a major upgrade.

I don't know how anyone can say that with any degree of certainty.
If Mancini were to leave for whatever reason, there is only one man who you could be sure would be an upgrade.
I won't mention his name as it annoys some people on here :-)

Certainty, maybe not; high degree of confidence, definitely. I watch about 75% (maybe more) of Barca's games on TV and 90 odd percent of City's in some form; based on that, I'm bloody sure that Pep would be an upgrade. Barca's players did not manage themselves.

 

[Neville Kneville]

How can Guardiola possibly be an upgrade on Mancini, until he actually wins the Premier League ?

Sure if the two were both available two years ago, you would pick Guardiola 100 times over Mancini, but it's not two years ago it's now & Mancini has been working here, & won the Premier League.

The idea that achievement counts for nothing by comparison is absurd.

 

[Didsbury Dave]

Even Mancio, who loves Mancini and is qualified more than most to speak of his managerial merits, stated the other day that Pep is a major upgrade.

I don't know how anyone can say that with any degree of certainty.
If Mancini were to leave for whatever reason, there is only one man who you could be sure would be an upgrade.
I won't mention his name as it annoys some people on here :-)

And he's rumoured (again!) to be available in summer!

 

[tolmie's hairdoo]

It also make's me smile when people dissregard the fact Rijkaard left him a team of champion's. He also took control if a stable and club that had all the right people in place...

It also fails to take into account that he built his team around three players that Rikaard can be credited with bringing to the peak of the game.. Xavi, Inesta, Messi. He got very lucky, a once in a lifetime deal, just like bacon chops dwn the road.

To say he is poor is wrong, but to say he alone is the foundation of those achivements is way off the mark. That point is the one above all he will be required to do at Chelsea

Rijkaard did not bring Messi to the peak of his game. He left a Barca team short on discipline, overweight, and ego-driven.

It's certainly laughable to suggest Ferguson got lucky with his crop of youngsters, he had nurtured them for years before blooding them, integrating them one by one.

Explain to me how Ferguson also got lucky at Aberdeen?

Messi became the superstar he is because of his natural talent being realised by Pep.

Messi was skilfully allowed to go to the Youth World Cup by Pep, something which became the catalyst for their bond and his form.

He employed a different playing style than Rijkaard, who was more off-the-cuff.

Really, well he gave him his debut at 17, played him as a regular for four years and moved him to the right wing.. In that time he was nominated twice in the player of the year awards and already regarded as one of the worlds best.. You cant really say he nutured the lad into the big time, he was already a star.

How Pep allowed him to go to the youth world cup is beyond me, he wasnt his manager at the time, it was Pere Gratacos that allowed him leave to go.



Id also love a overweight and ego drive team if they win the Cup, the leauge and the Champions leauge.. He may not have wone everything every year as Barca demand, but he wasnt poor as you are saying either.

As for fergie, i dont really see why his time at Aberdeen is being brought into this, i never questioned his ability as a manager, did i ?

But if you do not think a awfull lot of luck went into that youth team as well as hard work you are mad. Lots of clubs do exactly what they did at the time, but they didnt get the break that brought them 6/7 international in the space of 4/5 years.

It was the Olympics, not the Youth World Cup...this will help in terms of what Pep did to get the best out of Messi

<a class="postlink" href="http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=FdVABn_TAX4C&pg=PR3-IA31&lpg=PR3-IA31&dq=pep+let+messi+go+to+olympics&source=bl&ots=3pVNPLkxgA&sig=ckT36bq5FT_R8rwCYdSu5icU6Ag&hl=en&sa=X&ei=EsKsUKmNI-PX0QWOn4HgBA&ved=0CC0Q6AEwAw#v=onepage&q=pep%20let%20messi%20go%20to%20olympics&f=false" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=FdVA ... cs&f=false</a>

 

[Scareye]

Even Mancio, who loves Mancini and is qualified more than most to speak of his managerial merits, stated the other day that Pep is a major upgrade.

I don't know how anyone can say that with any degree of certainty.
If Mancini were to leave for whatever reason, there is only one man who you could be sure would be an upgrade.
I won't mention his name as it annoys some people on here :-)

Certainty, maybe not; high degree of confidence, definitely. I watch about 75% (maybe more) of Barca's games on TV and 90 odd percent of City's in some form; based on that, I'm bloody sure that Pep would be an upgrade. Barca's players did not manage themselves.

His record at Barcelona is irrefutable, my only concern is if he could achieve that kind of success elsewhere. I think he would be a gamble as strange as that sounds and a very expensive one probably.

 

[OB1]

How can Guardiola possibly be an upgrade on Mancini, until he actually wins the Premier League ?

Sure if the two were both available two years ago, you would pick Guardiola 100 times over Mancini, but it's not two years ago it's now & Mancini has been working here, & won the Premier League.

The idea that achievement counts for nothing by comparison is absurd.

It's all about opinion. No one, well certainly not I, is suggesting Mancini's achievements count for nothing. Some people, myself included, think that Pep is a more talented manager and would produce a team that produces better (i.e. even more attractive) football and results.

Whether or not there will be any significant justification to get rid of Bobby at the season's end is a very open question.

 

[Chippy_boy]

I don't have stats for Mancini, but it's this that might have our owner interested:

Guardiola in Europe:

P50, W30, D15, L5

A quite remarkable achievement when you bear in mind the quality of some of the opposition and especially the tough away games against such opposition.

 

[Akai]

Will be interested to see how this impacts the Falcao transfer.

If he moves in January, I would assume Chelsea have stacked the deck for Pep.

If he stays put, I think Pep will keep his jets cool and wait to see what happens at City, before taking Falcao wherever.

There is some chatter today that the appointment of Benitiez could even be announced as a longer-term thing.

Benitez is in Abu Dhabi at the moment. My biggest fear is that he has coveted the City job for a very long time.

If he is 'worded up' that Mancini will be sacked next summer, and we have no chance of either Pep or Jose, we get the fat waiter.

has nothing to do with City!

 

[OB1]

His record at Barcelona is irrefutable, my only concern is if he could achieve that kind of success elsewhere. I think he would be a gamble as strange as that sounds and a very expensive one probably.

All about opinions; I don't think Pep would be a big gamble and certainly no more of a gamble than appointing Mancini, an idea that I supported well before Hughes was sacked.

 

[Deleted member 52846]

I don't have stats for Mancini, but it's this that might have our owner interested:

Guardiola in Europe:
P50, W30, D15, L5

A quite remarkable achievement when you bear in mind the quality of some of the opposition and especially the tough away games against such opposition.

Or "the best team in the world in Europe (whilst Pep was in charge):"

 

[Mancio]

Even Mancio, who loves Mancini and is qualified more than most to speak of his managerial merits, stated the other day that Pep is a major upgrade.

Jesus, did he really?

Who next? Damocles?

well.... to be honest i didnt , but maybe my poor english betrayed me.

i only stated how much i love guardiola , firstly as a very polite no-nonsense guy , and secondly as a coach that has bring in the game a revolutionary way of play the game . based on that i said i would be happy if guardiola will be the new City's manager in the unlikely event that Mancini should no longer be.

also becouse if this year tito villanova should win the treeble maybe we all could be forced re-think about the real importance of the coach/manager in a team.

 

[Scareye]

His record at Barcelona is irrefutable, my only concern is if he could achieve that kind of success elsewhere. I think he would be a gamble as strange as that sounds and a very expensive one probably.

All about opinions; I don't think Pep would be a big gamble and certainly no more of a gamble than appointing Mancini, an idea that I supported well before Hughes was sacked.

The thing is though mate, when talking about replacing Hughes with an upgrade the world is your lobster. When talking about replacing Mancini the options are a lot more limited.
You're right though, all about opinions.

 

[Zin 'messiah' Zimmer]

Pep a upgrade on bob???

No way pedro

and please don't give me this 'he's won 2 champions leagues' bollocks - when he achieves the same success in another league i'll be converted. The whole ethos behind Barcelona is the infrastructure, Pep was part of that and all power to his achievements but I defy anyone to tell me that he is an upgrade!!!

 

[The Future's Blue]

Fact, how can that be fact? It's not just the arguement that he has only done it with one club, there's also the debate that the players coming through at the club were going to go on and be the best team ever. There's also the debate that he did it with his players, having years of pre-assembling the team.

And what about assembling a team, has he done it that way? Or what about in different leagues, different styles, has he done it that way?

No, my friend, it isn't fact, it is just opinion. Until you get the managers to exact similar conditions, you cannot state anything as fact Who's to say that in 3 years Mancini hasn't got his homegrown flowers to nurture?

Well done though, it really shows.

PS. Fuck off Pep! Not my type of guy.

I've read that post about fifteen times now and it still makes very little sense to me. Whatever it is your trying to say just isn't connecting. Pep developed a group of very talented young players. He then coached them into being the best team in the world, granted with the exceptional talent that is Messi. If that isn't an advert of your abilities as a coach and manager I don't know what is. As to whether it's a fact or an opinion that he's better than Mancini, it doesn't really matter. I can say it's a fact, you can say it's not. Neither of us can prove it so it's a fruitless argument. I suppose I said it was fact because you asked the question. I found it a bit stupid.

As always mate, your answer is very interesting. The point of the post is simple, as you point out. Pep Guardiola has brought a team through the academy and then onto the world stage. He has excelled in the way he has given that one team such dynamism and through what they have acheived over the course of his tenure. However, it does not go to prove anything other than he is able to create a youthful team from scratch, with already excellent players, and gel that team into a winning side.

I do not believe that Guardiola is an average coach nor do I believe that he is a great coach. My personal opinion is that the jury is out and only time will tell whether he can cut it at another club.

So, of course it is opinion and can never be classed as fact. Which of course, is your opinion.

Next you'll be telling me he's bringing Messi with him.