Post Match Thread: Election 2017

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The perfect fumble said:
I think that answers the points you raised, mull it over, ignore it, it's entirely up to you.
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Answers?! It doesn't even address them!

And I love the "divide and rule is such a bad thing but oh by the way you pretend Tories hijacked the Labour Party and don't give a shit about social justice". It's like you can't read your own posts.
 
Damocles said:
Answers?! It doesn't even address them!

And I love the "divide and rule is such a bad thing but oh by the way you pretend Tories hijacked the Labour Party and don't give a shit about social justice". It's like you can't read your own posts.
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Well, maybe that's something we have in common.
 
The perfect fumble said:
Take it up with Damocles, according to his last post he voted for Corbyn twice in the leadership elections and yet he believes...
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Because Corbyn had the best shot of the bunch presented due to the momentum and energy behind him.

Again you are looking at this like you're some sort of alien who doesn't understand human beings at all.

Jeremy Corbyn WAS an electable Labour leader. Over the course of the campaign he became an unelectable Labour leader when the PLP undercut him, the manifesto went too far left on some very easy to point to economic issues that the electorate wouldn't like, and because him and his team were heavily linked to the IRA and we couldn't get the message through the noise to shift it. Then due to these issues he became unelectable, with the terrorist one being the biggest issue IMO but debateably so.

See how that works? That if you don't have a zealoted belief in something that you can change your mind on an issue without it being a religious war when new ideas or information is presented?
 
pirate said:
sorry misunderstood
how are you going to distinguish between those low paid jobs that cant be transitioned into high paid jobs and low paid jobs that just exploit the workers,like mike ashley?
or is subsidising the likes of mike ashley a price that is worth paying?
if it is a price worth paying how do you make sure that employers like mike ashley dont proliferate leading to high unsustainable government subsidy?
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I don't. I simply suggest that for those people who don't earn enough to manage, then as a decent society we need to give them some state support. Employers should pay what they feel is appropriate to attract the numbers and quality of staff they need. If they need 4 employees and offer £8/h and get 4 takers, fine. If they only get 3 takers, perhaps they'd need to offer £8.50

And we pick up the tab for people who cannot manage. It's as simple as that.

It's not ideal, but as I *keep* saying, I can think of no alternative that actually works. Forcing Mike Ashley - or whoever to pay £x per hour - will not work. It's ok in the margins, with a little increase here or there, but slap big fat increases on, and he'll lay people off. Necessarily, to stay in business.
 
Damocles said:
Because Corbyn had the best shot of the bunch presented due to the momentum and energy behind him.

Again you are looking at this like you're some sort of alien who doesn't understand human beings at all.

Jeremy Corbyn WAS an electable Labour leader. Over the course of the campaign he became an unelectable Labour leader when the PLP undercut him, the manifesto went too far left on some very easy to point to economic issues that the electorate wouldn't like, and because him and his team were heavily linked to the IRA and we couldn't get the message through the noise to shift it. Then due to these issues he became unelectable, with the terrorist one being the biggest issue IMO but debateably so.

See how that works? That if you don't have a zealoted belief in something that you can change your mind on an issue without it being a religious war when new ideas or information is presented?
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Your timelines are a bit peculiar, I'm not quite sure at what point Corbyn became unelectable in your eyes. The vote of no confidence by the PLP triggered the second leadership challenge, in which you voted for Corbyn and of course preceded the election campaign, which produced the manifesto, a manifesto credited with giving Corbyn a real boost, so tell me, what was it, precisely, about this socialist manifesto, drafted by an avowed socialist, that took you by surprise?

Corbyn's IRA links have been knocking around for some time, at which moment over the last two years did it tip over in to being an issue?

Oh, I'm interested to know, why is it that to believe in something is zealotry and yet to believe in something, then believe in something else and then nothing at all is pragmatic?

I understand politics, as in life, it is essential to compromise, the Labour party knows that, but there is a line where compromise becomes capitulation, its name is New Labour.
 
The perfect fumble said:
Your timelines are a bit peculiar, I'm not quite sure at what point Corbyn became unelectable in your eyes. The vote of no confidence by the PLP triggered the second leadership challenge, in which you voted for Corbyn and of course preceded the election campaign, which produced the manifesto, a manifesto credited with giving Corbyn a real boost, so tell me, what was it, precisely, about this socialist manifesto, drafted by an avowed socialist, that took you by surprise?

Corbyn's IRA links have been knocking around for some time, at which moment over the last two years did it tip over in to being an issue?

Oh, I'm interested to know, why is it that to believe in something is zealotry and yet to believe in something, then believe in something else and then nothing at all is pragmatic?

I understand politics, as in life, it is essential to compromise, the Labour party knows that, but there is a line where compromise becomes capitulation, its name is New Labour.
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Lets cut through the nonsense - the man is extreme and a prick and he has always and will always be unelectable - anyone with half a brain would like to see someone more palatable in charge of labour so they would be electable and a genuine threat to the Tory's. His manifesto sounded great because it gave away free money. I am starting to see real empathy with some posts on here - such as Karens who has her money cut and such as info posted last night that firemen have had £2000 cut from wages in 7 years. That is a disgrace. Please god can the labour party come more to the centre and have man who is not as extreme as weak on immigration so that the people who are suffering can have a viable chance. You supporting this absolute clown of a man is making the people you support and who i have empathy with suffer for longer. Open your eyes man!
 
worsleyweb said:
Lets cut through the nonsense - the man is extreme and a prick and he has always and will always be unelectable - anyone with half a brain would like to see someone more palatable in charge of labour so they would be electable and a genuine threat to the Tory's. His manifesto sounded great because it gave away free money. I am starting to see real empathy with some posts on here - such as Karens who has her money cut and such as info posted last night that firemen have had £2000 cut from wages in 7 years. That is a disgrace. Please god can the labour party come more to the centre and have man who is not as extreme as weak on immigration so that the people who are suffering can have a viable chance. You supporting this absolute clown of a man is making the people you support and who i have empathy with suffer for longer. Open your eyes man!
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I would urge you to join the Liberals if you think Labour are a joke.
 
worsleyweb said:
Lets cut through the nonsense - the man is extreme and a prick and he has always and will always be unelectable - anyone with half a brain would like to see someone more palatable in charge of labour so they would be electable and a genuine threat to the Tory's. His manifesto sounded great because it gave away free money. I am starting to see real empathy with some posts on here - such as Karens who has her money cut and such as info posted last night that firemen have had £2000 cut from wages in 7 years. That is a disgrace. Please god can the labour party come more to the centre and have man who is not as extreme as weak on immigration so that the people who are suffering can have a viable chance. You supporting this absolute clown of a man is making the people you support and who i have empathy with suffer for longer. Open your eyes man!
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He's sewn them shut, Worsley. And his ears.
 
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