Rock Evolution – The History of Rock & Roll - 1985 - (page 203)

Saddleworth2 said:
From wiki, which has it pretty spot on:

The band's sound has been variously described as progressive rock, psychedelic rock, acid rock, folk rock, jazz fusion, not to mention "British art rock," and hard rock.

Family were particularly known for their live performances; one reviewer describing the band as "one of the wildest, most innovative groups of the underground rock scene", noting that they produced "some of the rawest, most intense performances on stage in rock history" and "that the Jimi Hendrix Experience were afraid to follow them at festivals".

Family was an influence on Jethro Tull, with Ian Anderson noting that the band were particularly underrated. Both in his vocal sound and style and his dramatic stage presentation, Chapman was also a strong early influence on Peter Gabriel.

I got to know them around 72, I think at the time of their album 'Bandstand' which was more traditional rock than some of their others. I loved the looseness, the musicianship and the vocals. Burlesque remains one of my favourite singles.
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Yep, that Wiki mish-mash tells you everything, really. People simply don't know which pigeonhole to put them in. By the way, I'm struck listening to those old albums, then A Song for Me, Anyway and all that followed, how much they've got a sneaking soft spot for country & western! So you'd have to add that in to the Wiki list. As well as, well, just good old pop. Oh, and the influence of Jethro Tull doesn't surprise me, because they've got a fair dose of the English folk tradition in them (and I've always thought of Anderson as basically a folkie at heart who happened to play with electric musicians).

Addendum: Ric Grech, the bassist, left the group early doors, and went on to join the short-lived Blind Faith, who produced one fine album, and then went their separate ways. Well, Ginger Baker, Grech on bass, Clapton, Winwood. What wasn't to like? That album had a cover which was very controversial, even at the time. I was only fifteen but even then I thought it was odd, right on the limit. Nowadays it wouldn't wash. They changed that cover for the CD (remember CDs?) to something much less likely to give offence.
Although I see on iTunes, which I've just checked, that they keep the original cover. Which surprises me.
 
Lovebitesandeveryfing said:
Yep, that Wiki mish-mash tells you everything, really. People simply don't know which pigeonhole to put them in. By the way, I'm struck listening to those old albums, then A Song for Me, Anyway and all that followed, how much they've got a sneaking soft spot for country & western! So you'd have to add that in to the Wiki list. As well as, well, just good old pop. Oh, and the influence of Jethro Tull doesn't surprise me, because they've got a fair dose of the English folk tradition in them (and I've always thought of Anderson as basically a folkie at heart who happened to play with electric musicians).

Addendum: Ric Grech, the bassist, left the group early doors, and went on to join the short-lived Blind Faith, who produced one fine album, and then went their separate ways. Well, Ginger Baker, Grech on bass, Clapton, Winwood. What wasn't to like? That album had a cover which was very controversial, even at the time. I was only fifteen but even then I thought it was odd, right on the limit. Nowadays it wouldn't wash. They changed that cover for the CD (remember CDs?) to something much less likely to give offence.
Although I see on iTunes, which I've just checked, that they keep the original cover. Which surprises me.
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I remember it. Houses of the Holy also had a questionable cover by today’s standards. Anyhow, I only remembered today with you talking about Family, John Whetton played bass for them around the time of Burlesque. I will definitely be revisiting some of their stuff this week.
 
Saddleworth2 said:
What was your overall impression of 1976 following completion of the playlist?
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I think rock clearly still dominates but the degree to which that is a function of our posters preferences as opposed to what was on offer I'm not sure. I think it's clear there was a lot of variety beginning to become available in 76 and that was certainly beginning to be reflected in the album charts. But it was in many ways the calm before the storm I think.

I think whether you agree with it or not, you can see why some people thought rock had become over produced and had lost its edge.
 
threespires said:
I think rock clearly still dominates but the degree to which that is a function of our posters preferences as opposed to what was on offer I'm not sure. I think it's clear there was a lot of variety beginning to become available in 76 and that was certainly beginning to be reflected in the album charts. But it was in many ways the calm before the storm I think.

I think whether you agree with it or not, you can see why some people thought rock had become over produced and had lost its edge.
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Not so much over produced but formulaic.
 
Notes on the 1976 playlist

General Comments
  • "More Then A Feeling" by Boston is a brilliant track from an equally brilliant album. The guitar and organ parts are sensational throughout the album, the harmony vocals are uplifting and the production, considering Tom Scholz basically did it in his basement, is astounding. A landmark recording in America's 200th year.
  • I've been looking for the point when the unfairly maligned AOR sound really started, and I'd say that 1976 is as good as any year to call it. "More Than A Feeling", "(Don't Fear) The Reaper" and "Carry On Wayward Son" really are as close as you can get to the holy trinity of this genre. And as @OB1 would say, it's all put together in a truly entertaining way.
  • Put these together with a superb debut album by Tom Petty & The Heartbeakers, an album full of great songs by the Steve Miller Band, and it adds up to the best year in music since 1971.
  • Having listened to a few BOC albums, I still can't quite figure out why the vocals sound so different on Reaper when compared to all of their other songs - in a good way by the way - nothing else I've heard by them sounds like this vocally.

From the original 10
  • "Dirty Deeds Done Dirt Cheap" - AC/DC - I had it on my original list for this year. A brilliant track from the Aussie rockers for the second successive year.
  • "Lowdown" by Boz Scaggs - another name I know but I've not head any of his music. This felt like a good introduction.
  • I don't think that I've ever heard the 10-minute version of "Disco Inferno". There's some really nice Manzarek-style jazz piano going on as the song enters it's final phase.
  • "Pastime Paradise" by Stevie Wonder - Good to hear the inspiration for "Gangsta's Paradise" and the even better Wierd Al Yankovich version, "Amish Paradise".

Best new tracks I'd not heard before

1. "Eggplant" - Michael Franks - some cool jazz to listen to on a drive in to the office on Monday
2. "Blinded by the Light" - Manfred Mann's Earth Band - obviously I know the original but this might be the first time I've listened to this cover, although I knew of its existence. Even as a Bruce fan, I'd say that this cover version is better than the original.
3. "Rose of Cimarron" - Poco - one of those bands I've heard ofbut not really listened to.

- "Crystal Ball" - Styx
- "I Don't Want To Go Home" - Southside Johnny and the Asbury Jukes
- "The Wreck of Edmund Fitzgerald" - Gordon Lightfoot
- "The Royal Scam" - Steely Dan


Tracks I'd heard before but enjoyed relistening

- "Oxygene, Part 4" - Jean-Michel Jarre - one of those pieces of music that I was familiar with way before I was into music. It's a fabulous instrumental piece.
- "Moonchild" - Rory Gallagher
- "Year of the Cat" - Al Stewart - another classic to go with his "Roads to Moscow"
- "Fly Like An Eagle" - Steve Miller Band - other-worldy sounds mixed wth Hammond, a sublime piece of music
- "Night Moves" - Bob Seger - such great opening chords and a simple yet effective song.
- "Poor Poor Pitiful Me" - Warren Zevon - a great track from an album that we reviewed in the album club.
- "Back in the Saddle" - Aerosmith
- "Let Your Love Flow" - The Bellamy Brothers. I agree with @threespires, it's a great, upbeat way to end the playlist.
 
RobMCFC said:
Notes on the 1976 playlist

General Comments
  • "More Then A Feeling" by Boston is a brilliant track from an equally brilliant album. The guitar and organ parts are sensational throughout the album, the harmony vocals are uplifting and the production, considering Tom Scholz basically did it in his basement, is astounding. A landmark recording in America's 200th year.
  • I've been looking for the point when the unfairly maligned AOR sound really started, and I'd say that 1976 is as good as any year to call it. "More Than A Feeling", "(Don't Fear) The Reaper" and "Carry On Wayward Son" really are as close as you can get to the holy trinity of this genre. And as @OB1 would say, it's all put together in a truly entertaining way.
  • Put these together with a superb debut album by Tom Petty & The Heartbeakers, an album full of great songs by the Steve Miller Band, and it adds up to the best year in music since 1971.
  • Having listened to a few BOC albums, I still can't quite figure out why the vocals sound so different on Reaper when compared to all of their other songs - in a good way by the way - nothing else I've heard by them sounds like this vocally.

From the original 10
  • "Dirty Deeds Done Dirt Cheap" - AC/DC - I had it on my original list for this year. A brilliant track from the Aussie rockers for the second successive year.
  • "Lowdown" by Boz Scaggs - another name I know but I've not head any of his music. This felt like a good introduction.
  • I don't think that I've ever heard the 10-minute version of "Disco Inferno". There's some really nice Manzarek-style jazz piano going on as the song enters it's final phase.
  • "Pastime Paradise" by Stevie Wonder - Good to hear the inspiration for "Gangsta's Paradise" and the even better Wierd Al Yankovich version, "Amish Paradise".

Best new tracks I'd not heard before

1. "Eggplant" - Michael Franks - some cool jazz to listen to on a drive in to the office on Monday
2. "Blinded by the Light" - Manfred Mann's Earth Band - obviously I know the original but this might be the first time I've listened to this cover, although I knew of its existence. Even as a Bruce fan, I'd say that this cover version is better than the original.
3. "Rose of Cimarron" - Poco - one of those bands I've heard ofbut not really listened to.

- "Crystal Ball" - Styx
- "I Don't Want To Go Home" - Southside Johnny and the Asbury Jukes
- "The Wreck of Edmund Fitzgerald" - Gordon Lightfoot
- "The Royal Scam" - Steely Dan


Tracks I'd heard before but enjoyed relistening

- "Oxygene, Part 4" - Jean-Michel Jarre - one of those pieces of music that I was familiar with way before I was into music. It's a fabulous instrumental piece.
- "Moonchild" - Rory Gallagher
- "Year of the Cat" - Al Stewart - another classic to go with his "Roads to Moscow"
- "Fly Like An Eagle" - Steve Miller Band - other-worldy sounds mixed wth Hammond, a sublime piece of music
- "Night Moves" - Bob Seger - such great opening chords and a simple yet effective song.
- "Poor Poor Pitiful Me" - Warren Zevon - a great track from an album that we reviewed in the album club.
- "Back in the Saddle" - Aerosmith
- "Let Your Love Flow" - The Bellamy Brothers. I agree with @threespires, it's a great, upbeat way to end the playlist.
Click to expand...
Why is Don't Fear The Reaper classed as AOR? Was it written to appeal to Arena audiences?
 
Saddleworth2 said:
Why is Don't Fear The Reaper classed as AOR? Was it written to appeal to Arena audiences?
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I don't know why it was written, but to me it fits in the Adult Oriented Rock genre.

It's certainly not got the heavier classic rock sound of their early releases. It sounds a bit more polished and produced than that.

Plus, along with "Spirit of Radio", "Carry on Wayward Son" and "More then a Feeling" it was always on of the tracks on those American rock compilations of the 80s.
 
RobMCFC said:
I don't know why it was written, but to me it fits in the Adult Oriented Rock genre.

It's certainly not got the heavier classic rock sound of their early releases. It sounds a bit more polished and produced than that.

Plus, along with "Spirit of Radio", "Carry on Wayward Son" and "More then a Feeling" it was always on of the tracks on those American rock compilations of the 80s.
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I just have a dislike of the label AOR. Is it Adult or Arena. I usually go with Arena as Adult is just bloody meaningless - a piece of music written for a target audience of er, Adults. Really ???? :-)
DFTR is just about bloody note for note perfect imo and my individual prejudices balk at it being bracketed as AOR along side the likes of Boston et al.
 
Saddleworth2 said:
I just have a dislike of the label AOR. Is it Adult or Arena. I usually go with Arena as Adult is just bloody meaningless - a piece of music written for a target audience of er, Adults. Really ???? :-)
DFTR is just about bloody note for note perfect imo and my individual prejudices balk at it being bracketed as AOR along side the likes of Boston et al.
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To be fair, I've had a quick look and there doesn't seem to be any support for DFTR or BOC being AOR so you're probably right.

Have you listened to Boston's debut album? I'm surprised you are so negative towards them.
 
RobMCFC said:
To be fair, I've had a quick look and there doesn't seem to be any support for DFTR or BOC being AOR so you're probably right.

Have you listened to Boston's debut album? I'm surprised you are so negative towards them.
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Never deliberately mate. I listened to their singles on radio and decided I didn't like them back in the 70's. Maybe one of my mates did and being an argumentative fucker (even then) I probably set out to dislike them just for fun.

I will give it a listen and then compare with my benchmark rock bands and come back and tell you why they aren't as good ;-)
 
threespires said:
I think rock clearly still dominates but the degree to which that is a function of our posters preferences as opposed to what was on offer I'm not sure. I think it's clear there was a lot of variety beginning to become available in 76 and that was certainly beginning to be reflected in the album charts. But it was in many ways the calm before the storm I think.

I think whether you agree with it or not, you can see why some people thought rock had become over produced and had lost its edge.
Click to expand...
I agree. I'm not enjoying this playlist half as much as I think I should. I'm desperately trying to find shape and sense to how the genres were developing and failing miserably. There are some gems but too few for me. Will listen more and revert.
 
Saddleworth2 said:
I just have a dislike of the label AOR. Is it Adult or Arena. I usually go with Arena as Adult is just bloody meaningless - a piece of music written for a target audience of er, Adults. Really ???? :-)
Click to expand...

Here in the US, AOR typically was used in context of Album Oriented Rock as it pertains to radio. As in, a focus on the album over the single. Stevie Wonder certainly had this in his masterpiece release that year, as did others, such as Steely Dan, etc. I'd note AOR as focused on the other tracks, not just "the hit" and we saw that begin in the 1960s with the Beatles and Beach Boys (especially '66!). ;-)

Springsteen, Yes, Zeppelin, Floyd and plenty of other bands we've covered here (too many to list) had this focus where the release was more than just a focus on a particular track hit.

Album-oriented rock - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org

Saddleworth2 said:
DFTR is just about bloody note for note perfect imo and my individual prejudices balk at it being bracketed as AOR along side the likes of Boston et al.
Click to expand...
How was the rest of that album after DFTR? I didn't recognize any of those songs, so as AOR exists per the "Album" definition, I would agree with you a bit on that too.

Of course, if we're using AOR as Arena or Adult, I'm not as sure on one. Plenty of us younguns enjoyed DFTR and Boston's entire debut album back in the day. Both bands checked the arena category too.
 
Saddleworth2 said:
I agree. I'm not enjoying this playlist half as much as I think I should. I'm desperately trying to find shape and sense to how the genres were developing and failing miserably. There are some gems but too few for me. Will listen more and revert.
Click to expand...

I deliberately took the approach in the first 10 of showing the variety on offer but maybe that doesn't help. I'm also conscious that I've not tried to curate the track order I've just added on the playlist either.
 
threespires said:
I deliberately took the approach in the first 10 of showing the variety on offer but maybe that doesn't help. I'm also conscious that I've not tried to curate the track order I've just added on the playlist either.
Click to expand...
I think that's better. When I start listening to a playlist on week one, I don't like it when the order changes and I don't know where I'm up to.
 
Black&White&BlueMoon Town said:
Here in the US, AOR typically was used in context of Album Oriented Rock as it pertains to radio. As in, a focus on the album over the single. Stevie Wonder certainly had this in his masterpiece release that year, as did others, such as Steely Dan, etc. I'd note AOR as focused on the other tracks, not just "the hit" and we saw that begin in the 1960s with the Beatles and Beach Boys (especially '66!). ;-)

Springsteen, Yes, Zeppelin, Floyd and plenty of other bands we've covered here (too many to list) had this focus where the release was more than just a focus on a particular track hit.

Album-oriented rock - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org


How was the rest of that album after DFTR? I didn't recognize any of those songs, so as AOR exists per the "Album" definition, I would agree with you a bit on that too.

Of course, if we're using AOR as Arena or Adult, I'm not as sure on one. Plenty of us younguns enjoyed DFTR and Boston's entire debut album back in the day. Both bands checked the arena category too.
Click to expand...
Ok, thats as wide a definition as 'Adult' :-) and as it applies to 90% of what appears on this thread renders it almost useless.

I like Agents of Fortune well enough but DFTR stands out. They were an albums band and I haven't in the past associated them with arenas but I might be wrong on that. When I listen to that track it stands out because to me every part of it is damn near perfect. From the understated vocals to the guitar builds leading to the solo and break and return to the main theme. Underpinned by a wonderful bass line and percussion including the legendary CB.
So much other music of the time tried too hard to display their undoubted prowess favouring technical prowess over song construction, musicality and arrangement.

Some of these genre labels are really unhelpful and probably one of the reasons I have so many musical prejudices and dislike of Bands I've barely listened to. Thats where this thread and you guys are helpful in helping me confront my fatally flawed psyche. ;-)
 
Isn't AOR the same as the stupidly named Yacht Rock (a name that seems to have been invented in the last 20 years)?

I think the term was used derisively by many, who didn't like the polished, melodic and commercial approach taken by many of the bands. To me it is defined by groups starting out in the mid '70s, such as REO Speedwagon, Journey, Styx, Toto, Foreigner, Kansas, Loverboy, Night Ranger and The Babys to name but a few.
 
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