Rony Lopes

[Neville Kneville]

I'll quote these together, Neville I see the point, but the fact remains Pelle's been backed with new first team players, and some of those who let him down are gone. The ones who have been given another chance have delivered so far, and I think Denayer needs to play every week, and he wouldn't get that here even if rotated. It may not be liked, but I think for one more season it's the right move.

to Frank, of course the argument has merit. However look at the number of times we were 2 up, then threw it away last season. I'm not saying this is why, but logically, wouldn't that put doubts in the manager's mind? So the next time he's 2-0 up, he goes to tried and tested as a safety mechanism, thus leaving the kid, if there is one by this point, on the bench. Now we go 3 up but the player who needs the rest is Silva, and we don't have a similar kid on the bench, so for the benefit of the team, an established pro has to come on.

Now, I'm not saying that's how it is, but hypothetically, the way our first team played last season, it's could be possible. It could be stubbornness, but then I don't see why Pelle would trust the likes of Isco at Malaga if it were so. I think he's under pressure, in his first season, he had a poor start and always had to play catch up. In his second, we struggled for top form and fell away in the winter/spring, and then had to protect our CL spot. By that point, we weren't even sure if he was staying, so he picked a team to do a job and I think, to partly send a statement to the men in charge over what was needed. There is a wider range of factors, that I think sometimes go unappreciated. If the first team deliver and sweep all before them this season, there may well be the confidence and opportunity to give some youngsters a go, later in the season, at least I hope so, as I think the club wants and needs us to win a title comfortably, not just get it done on a nail-biting final day, I think we need to make that step and stamp our authority on the league.

The rags have done that many times wih kids in the squad.

Liverpool had an 18 year old cb/rb playing at left back at Arsenal the other night & he played a seriously good game. We have now got an untried kid as backup to Sagna there & we don't evn know what we would get from Zaba if fit. Denayer imo was potential cover for 3 positions, Cb, rb & def mid. If Guardiola, Ferguson, Clough, was in charge, Ithink they would see that & see him as an asset not a liability. This guy, who, don't get me wrong, is doing a great job imo with the senior players, hasn't got the vision when it comes to the kids.

 

[blueincy]

Rony Lopes ‏@Rony10Lopes 8h8 hours ago
Thank you @AS_Monaco for the wonderful welcome and for believing in me! I'm honoured and eager to work hard!!

The tweet says it all..

 

[malg]

Is it? We have lost a 19 year old player for 9 million, who has had such a successful loan spell he has attracted the interest of a Champions league club.

If that is good business what do you think of our signing of Roberts who is not yet a regular for a struggling Fulham side and who cost 5.5 million (???).

£9m for someone we weren't going to play? Yep, good business. Hey, 3 or 4 years down the line he might well go for a lot more, but that's because he's getting regular football, which he won't get here. As for Roberts, well only time will tell. I'm still happy that we're getting £9m for someone who doesn't get game time for us. Maybe this is the way ahead, we develop them then get a shit load of money. Unfortunately for some, football is a business. I'm sure Lopes is happy for the way we've handled him and furthered his career.

 

[Neville Kneville]

Denayer would struggle in Barcelona's set up.

I can't think of a player more perfectly suited to it. He is perfect for City too, apart from he's untried aerially vs Prem cfs. If I could guarantee Denayer aerially, I would be looking to train him up & play him now, a first choice in the Prem for City. He is the best 1v1 defender at the club & the best footballer out of all defenders.

 

[Bluewonder]

I can't think of a player more perfectly suited to it. He is perfect for City too, apart from he's untried aerially vs Prem cfs. If I could guarantee Denayer aerially, I would be looking to train him up & play him now, a first choice in the Prem for City. He is the best 1v1 defender at the club & the best footballer out of all defenders.

You overrate our youth players massively. Denayer is not the best footballing defender, or best 1 vs 1 defender at the club. The step up from SPL/ U21s footy to Champions League is absolutely huge. Denayer would be torn apart at the highest level.

I'm sure he'll be a very good defender in the future but these young players have a hell of a long way to go.

 

[franksinatra]

I'll quote these together, Neville I see the point, but the fact remains Pelle's been backed with new first team players, and some of those who let him down are gone. The ones who have been given another chance have delivered so far, and I think Denayer needs to play every week, and he wouldn't get that here even if rotated. It may not be liked, but I think for one more season it's the right move.

to Frank, of course the argument has merit. However look at the number of times we were 2 up, then threw it away last season. I'm not saying this is why, but logically, wouldn't that put doubts in the manager's mind? So the next time he's 2-0 up, he goes to tried and tested as a safety mechanism, thus leaving the kid, if there is one by this point, on the bench. Now we go 3 up but the player who needs the rest is Silva, and we don't have a similar kid on the bench, so for the benefit of the team, an established pro has to come on.

Now, I'm not saying that's how it is, but hypothetically, the way our first team played last season, it's could be possible. It could be stubbornness, but then I don't see why Pelle would trust the likes of Isco at Malaga if it were so. I think he's under pressure, in his first season, he had a poor start and always had to play catch up. In his second, we struggled for top form and fell away in the winter/spring, and then had to protect our CL spot. By that point, we weren't even sure if he was staying, so he picked a team to do a job and I think, to partly send a statement to the men in charge over what was needed. There is a wider range of factors, that I think sometimes go unappreciated. If the first team deliver and sweep all before them this season, there may well be the confidence and opportunity to give some youngsters a go, later in the season, at least I hope so, as I think the club wants and needs us to win a title comfortably, not just get it done on a nail-biting final day, I think we need to make that step and stamp our authority on the league.

Straight back at you. Your argument has a lot of merit and is an excellent counter-balance to mine and Neville's opinion.

I suppose it is a question of considering is there more to gain than lose? I take your point about Isco but was this more to do with the limitations of the budget at Malaga and if he had been in a city situation would he have stockpiled international players rather than given him a chance?

As well as the positive or seeing young players for me it makes financial and squad sense to introduce young players and by playing kids this can also limit risk in other areas.

It could be argued financially if we had trusted Denayer (as fourth choice) the otamendi money could have been used to buy a decent central midfielder. That in my opinion would have more significantly reduced the risk this year than stockpiling another centre half as I think it may prove our Achilles heel.

The 2-0 argument has some weight, specifically for a centre half, would you still think the same if 3-0, 4-0 or if a striker like Iheanacho was bloodied?

 

[JoeMercer'sWay]

The rags have done that many times wih kids in the squad.

Liverpool had an 18 year old cb/rb playing at left back at Arsenal the other night & he played a seriously good game. We have now got an untried kid as backup to Sagna there & we don't evn know what we would get from Zaba if fit. Denayer imo was potential cover for 3 positions, Cb, rb & def mid. If Guardiola, Ferguson, Clough, was in charge, Ithink they would see that & see him as an asset not a liability. This guy, who, don't get me wrong, is doing a great job imo with the senior players, hasn't got the vision when it comes to the kids.

well, you could be right. I think as we're developing, I think we are risk averse, and that can be seen across the club. Denayer might be a mistake, it might be the right move, we can only have our opinions and hope for the best, either way. Again though, Liverpool are in a slightly different position to us, and don't have the depth of quality we do. Equally though, what's to say the untried kid comes in and does a Bellerin, or something like that? Maybe the club feel it better to go that route and give Denayer regular football in the position they want him to play, at a CL club? It's a balancing act, but the club clearly want Denayer to play, they just want him to develop a bit more to takeover when he's absolutely ready. Maybe it's our club culture now, maybe it's just the reality of where we are as a club. We'll just have to see how it goes.

 

[Neville Kneville]

You overrate our youth players massively. Denayer is not the best footballing defender, or best 1 vs 1 defender at the club. The step up from SPL/ U21s footy to Champions League is absolutely huge. Denayer would be torn apart at the highest level.

I'm sure he'll be a very good defender in the future but these young players have a hell of a long way to go.

Denayer has played at that level.

Check out our defence ve Roma, & Moscow & get back to me. And give me a better footballer in the back 4.

 

[Bluewonder]

Denayer has played at that level.

Check out our defence ve Roma, & Moscow & get back to me. And give me a better footballer in the back 4.

He hasn't really. One friendly against France doesn't constitute the high intensity, elite-level competition our lads are so regularly involved in.

 

[JoeMercer'sWay]

Straight back at you. Your argument has a lot of merit and is an excellent counter-balance to mine and Neville's opinion.

I suppose it is a question of considering is there more to gain than lose? I take your point about Isco but was this more to do with the limitations of the budget at Malaga and if he had been in a city situation would he have stockpiled international players rather than given him a chance?

As well as the positive or seeing young players for me it makes financial and squad sense to introduce young players and by playing kids this can also limit risk in other areas.

It could be argued financially if we had trusted Denayer (as fourth choice) the otamendi money could have been used to buy a decent central midfielder. That in my opinion would have more significantly reduced the risk this year than stockpiling another centre half as I think it may prove our Achilles heel.

The 2-0 argument has some weight, specifically for a centre half, would you still think the same if 3-0, 4-0 or if a striker like Iheanacho was bloodied?

Well, we could see tomorrow regarding Kelechi, it was just a hypothetical scenario to illustrate the unpredictability and perhaps risk averse nature the manager has when he has targets and is always under such scrutiny. Maybe you're right about Malaga and resources, but perhaps it's also to do with the lack of expectation compared to us, yes Malaga had money but Pelle always had the Barca/Real card to play, which he can't here. I think it's that scrutiny and job pressure which is playing a significant role, but ultimately if we want to see kids in the manner suggested, the first team has to earn the trust of the boss by beating teams as expected and allowing him the opportunity.

It will be interesting tomorrow, as the first home game we're expected to win, what team he picks and how he makes his subs. I hope we fix last season and go and do our business, and maybe then the likes of Kelechi will get time.