Sir Keir Starmer

jay_mcfc said:
It's not daft at all, the front bench has been far too London based under Corbyn. My personal preference is for Starmer to be pm, I think he'd destroy Boris in head to heads, but a London based remainer is the last thing we need.
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Starmer is remain and he will not be accepted by those that have just told you the brexit policy was fucking unacceptable.

Christ its ridiculous the political mistakes this labour party makes and will continue to make unless they wake the fuck up.
 
blueinsa said:
Starmer is remain and he will not be accepted by those that have just told you the brexit policy was fucking unacceptable.

Christ its ridiculous the political mistakes this labour party makes and will continue to make unless they wake the fuck up.
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Massively depends if brexit is done and dusted in 5 years. I don't think it will be so a northerner who at least can sympathize with leavers might be a better choice
 
aguerrrroooooooooooo said:
Massively depends if brexit is done and dusted in 5 years. I don't think it will be so a northerner who at least can sympathize with leavers might be a better choice
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No you remainers need to accept we are leaving and get behind the politicians in doing it.

Once we have left by all means campaign to rejoin but this remain shit has to stop.

Its getting you nowhere and its fucked the labour party completely.
 
jay_mcfc said:
It's not daft at all, the front bench has been far too London based under Corbyn. My personal preference is for Starmer to be pm, I think he'd destroy Boris in head to heads, but a London based remainer is the last thing we need.
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I know he lived up north, but Blair seemed to do OK in those communities and he could hardly be described as a northerner.

But it kind of misses the point really. Labour lost because of three things IMO:

1. Corbyn. Nothing to do with policies or Brexit, just Corbyn. Far too many people cannot stand him. No need to debate why, it's just the way it is. Replacing him with anyone (apart from John McDonnell) will gain dozens of extra seats.

2. Brexit. There won't be a Brexit debate in 2024, and if the doom-mongers are correct then maybe Labour communities might even be apologising to Labour!

3. Policies. I keep banging on about this because it is transparently obvious, but people don't seem to get it: We do not live in the 1970's any more. Policies from the 1970's including widespread nationalisations and an increased role for the state, are not things people want or even care about. They want to earn more and be taxed less, more money in their pockets. And they want their employer's business to be successful so that this can happen.

This "us" vs "them", "workers" vs "management" narrative is over. In the 1970's, management paid their staff the bare minimum and gave them fuck all benefits. Workers thought it was great if a strike shut the factory for weeks and the employer nearly went bust. It was a chance to get one over on the bastards. It is not like that any more. Companies realise their staff are their biggest asset and they give them the best benefits they can. And employees feel part of the business and want it to succeed. They don't want to go on strike every 6 weeks. Labour need a pro-business agenda which people can buy into.

They also need *sensible* spending and investment plans which people regard as being pragmatic and deliverable. Not a wish list of freebies which most people realise would wreck the economy.
 
jay_mcfc said:
It's not daft at all, the front bench has been far too London based under Corbyn. My personal preference is for Starmer to be pm, I think he'd destroy Boris in head to heads, but a London based remainer is the last thing we need.
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They need the best man to move them forward, the next leader probably won't be the next Labour P.M. If the best man to reposition them and begin to repair the Labour party is Starmer then they should pick Starmer. I t would be foolish to discount him and chooses the wrong person beacause he was on the side of an argument and lost but which is now over or because of his accent.
Unless of course he sees himself as the one after the next one and needs a 'Kinnock' first.
 
Chippy_boy said:
2. Brexit. There won't be a Brexit debate in 2024, and if the doom-mongers are correct then maybe Labour communities might even be apologising to Labour!
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Never gonna happen. Brexit is beyond reproach for some which is why nobody talks about the benefits of it anymore but that we simply have to get it done.
 
Chippy_boy said:
I know he lived up north, but Blair seemed to do OK in those communities and he could hardly be described as a northerner.

But it kind of misses the point really. Labour lost because of three things IMO:

1. Corbyn. Nothing to do with policies or Brexit, just Corbyn. Far too many people cannot stand him. No need to debate why, it's just the way it is. Replacing him with anyone (apart from John McDonnell) will gain dozens of extra seats.

2. Brexit. There won't be a Brexit debate in 2024, and if the doom-mongers are correct then maybe Labour communities might even be apologising to Labour!

3. Policies. I keep banging on about this because it is transparently obvious, but people don't seem to get it: We do not live in the 1970's any more. Policies from the 1970's including widespread nationalisations and an increased role for the state, are not things people want or even care about. They want to earn more and be taxed less, more money in their pockets. And they want their employer's business to be successful so that this can happen.

This "us" vs "them", "workers" vs "management" narrative is over. In the 1970's, management paid their staff the bare minimum and gave them fuck all benefits. Workers thought it was great if a strike shut the factory for weeks and the employer nearly went bust. It was a chance to get one over on the bastards. It is not like that any more. Companies realise their staff are their biggest asset and they give them the best benefits they can. And employees feel part of the business and want it to succeed. They don't want to go on strike every 6 weeks. Labour need a pro-business agenda which people can buy into.

They also need *sensible* spending and investment plans which people regard as being pragmatic and deliverable. Not a wish list of freebies which most people realise would wreck the economy.
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With hindsight I agree. Corbyn as a person was hated clearly, that's the feedback from a lot of campaigners and mps on the doorstep. Brexit was also a massive fuck up but what's forgotten by most of the people who clamour for a moderate leader is the left of the party weren't arsed about offering a second referendum it was the centrists. In January Labour went ahead in the polls for the first time, a short while later they offered a second ref and the polls plummeted and never recovered.
 
blueinsa said:
No you remainers need to accept we are leaving and get behind the politicians in doing it.

Once we have left by all means campaign to rejoin but this remain shit has to stop.

Its getting you nowhere and its fucked the labour party completely.
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This exactly, we keep hearing on a loop these perpetual cries of 'Division' from those still clinging to this pointless remain
narrative, if there is division, it's because the losers just will not accept the result. Democracy relies on losers consent,
it's no good wailing about divisive outcomes if you're responsible for it.
 
mat said:
AbleGiddyErin-size_restricted.gif

Working class, fearless, sassy as fuck northern lass. She'd piss an election as leader.
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Only if it was a reality show.
She'd be portrayed as "Can you see this woman representing the UK at the next G7 summit, discussing macro-economic strategy with Trump, Merkel, Macron and co?"
Would appeal well to the domestic, northern constituencies, but not in EastEnders land.
 
I can see the attraction of Starmer as the leader of Labour in as much as Labour need to remove themselves from the cult as quickly as possible because good government needs good strong competitive opposition. Opposing the Tories isn't served by screaming Tory scum every 10 minutes which is what the momentum mob and their followers do regularly.
The only blot that I can see are his remain credentials and his links to the Thornberry woman, but saying that you'd be hard pressed to dig up a high profile leave advocate from the opposition ranks.
 
TheBlueDune said:
Only if it was a reality show.
She'd be portrayed as "Can you see this woman representing the UK at the next G7 summit, discussing macro-economic strategy with Trump, Merkel, Macron and co?"
Would appeal well to the domestic, northern constituencies, but not in EastEnders land.
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Whoever becomes the next leader will be villified by the media regardless of background.

Corbyn was universally liked until his policies gained traction then he became a anti semitic terrorist lover. Whoever takes it on will need balls of steel.
 
mat said:
Whoever becomes the next leader will be villified by the media regardless of background.

Corbyn was universally liked until his policies gained traction then he became a anti semitic terrorist lover. Whoever takes it on will need balls of steel.
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totally agree on this - whoever comes in gets torn to shreds nowadays
 
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BlueHammer85 said:
totally agree on this - whoever comes in gets torn to shreds nowadays
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Starmer and Thornberry will be labeled champagne socialists.

Raynor and Nandy - Too inexperienced and Northern.

Long - Bailey - Corbyn in a skirt.

Phillips - Natural leader. Tories scared of her. (Published in The Times yesterday)
 
mat said:
Whoever becomes the next leader will be villified by the media regardless of background.

Corbyn was universally liked until his policies gained traction then he became a anti semitic terrorist lover. Whoever takes it on will need balls of steel.
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Until labour can somehow manage their image better they will never win an election.
Not a coincidence that Blair was backed by the sun and won big majorities.
 
mat said:
Starmer and Thornberry will be labeled champagne socialists.

Raynor and Nandy - Too inexperienced and Northern.

Long - Bailey - Corbyn in a skirt.

Phillips - Natural leader. Tories scared of her. (Published in The Times yesterday)
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Phillips is too emotional and un-statesman-like IMO. Some of her performances in the media and in parliament, although heartfelt, have been quite cringeworthy. You need someone with a bit of gravitas and a lot of composure, and she has not enough of either.

This is not gloating on my part, BTW. The Tories are similarly afflicted and short on talent. i.e. complete dearth of.
 
Chippy_boy said:
Phillips is too emotional and un-statesman-like IMO. Some of her performances in the media and in parliament, although heartfelt, have been quite cringeworthy. You need someone with a bit of gravitas and a lot of composure, and she has not enough of either.

This is not gloating on my part, BTW. The Tories are similarly afflicted and short on talent. i.e. complete dearth of.
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Agree with this - it is genuineky frigtening the scal eof the job at hand and the complete lack of decent people in the Tory ranks. But they what sort of opposition will they face. A piss poor one again.
 
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