The Album Review Club - Week #195 (page 1310) - A New World Record - ELO

KnaresboroughBlue said:
Just go with how it makes you feel. No specialist knowledge required. It won't be for everybody but hopefully some people may get a bit of something from it.
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The opening bit of the first poem feels more Austrian to me with the horn section(s) (that maybe more of a classical stereotype on my behalf) and some form of jubilation (I think I clocked it about 9 minutes in?).

However, I am possibly way off the mark.

This review is going to be a work in progress.........
 
I've listened to the Václav Talich conducting the Czech Philharmonic recording this morning, but I definitely need a few more listens before writing a review.
 
RobMCFC said:
I've listened to the Václav Talich conducting the Czech Philharmonic recording this morning, but I definitely need a few more listens before writing a review.
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That's my favourite recording but obviously the sound isn't the greatest being from 1954 (unless you found one of his from the 30s).

I have just found a remastered version of his 1954 recording on YouTube this morning
 
KnaresboroughBlue said:
That's my favourite recording but obviously the sound isn't the greatest being from 1954 (unless you found one of his from the 30s).

I have just found a remastered version of his 1954 recording on YouTube this morning
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This is the version I am listening to.

Smetana: Má Vlast - Decca: 4833187 - CD or download | Presto Music

It is lovely in bits but I will need more listens to make cohesive sense of it.
 
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Something different but also something tricky to score. The musicians are all going to be highly qualified and skilled because that's the nature of orchestras, there's no hiding places, and if it's a recording with a conductor of note, then the prestige of the orchestra itself is going to be higher too. That said, the musicians cannot do anything other than play as the composer intended and/or conductor instructs. And as I myself cannot tell the difference between one top level conductor & orchestra combination and the next, I am left purely scoring the composition.

I'm no expert on classical music and I rarely listen to recordings in full, but I have my favourites - such as perhaps the uninspired choice of Vivaldi's Four Seasons - but generally it will be select pieces from composers such as Debussy, Sibelius or Erik Satie, or just random Classic FM.

I reviewed this nomination using the 1994 recording of the Polish National Radio Symphony Orchestra conducted by Antoni Wit. I enjoyed some of it, the intro to #4 being the highlight for me but the bits I was drawn to seemed too short for my liking, with the rest being okay but not something that would make me listen again I don't think, but neither would I turn any of it off if it popped up on Classic FM.

I think 6 / 10 is a fair score from my perspective.
 
KnaresboroughBlue said:
Had a really tough time choosing which album to review and after much though finally decided on a change of pace and genre and we’re going to be having some classical music. My choice is:

Bedřich Smetana - Má Vlast (My Homeland)

Despite not being as well known internationally as compatriot Dvořák, he is the most revered composer in his homeland and his composition Má Vlast is regarded by many as both his greatest work and the unofficial national anthem of the Czech Republic. What makes it an even more remarkable piece of work is that the majority of it was composed after he was completely deaf.

Má Vlast is a set of 6 symphonic poems composed between 1874 and 1879. These poems were set around the time of the Czech National revival, a cultural movement aiming to bring the Czech language and culture back to life after 200 years of Germanisation under Austro-Hungarian rule. As such it is considered a patriotic and nationalistic work. These 6 poems were originally composed individually and given their own premieres but were always designed to be played together as a series alternating between historical/mythological narrative and musical interpretations of prominent natural features, all the while celebrating his native Bohemia.

The 6 poems are:

Vyšehrad (High Castle) - The place where the Bohemian court flourished in the 8th century. A dreamy piece about the past. Sets the 4-note motif that crops up regularly in the other poems. O The harps of the seers begin; fortune tellers singing of goings on at Vyšehrad - fame, brilliance, tournaments, fights - up until the final decline and ruins. The song ends in an elegant tone of regret at the present ruin.

Vltava - Probably the most popular of the 6 movements and often played on its own in ‘best of’ concerts. It paints a portrait of Bohemia’s mighty river from its source (flutes and clarinets) as it winds its way through the country (strings) passing groves and meadows. Sometimes swift and shallow, sometimes deep and slow with the light of the sun flickering upon it (pizzicato). Along the way we hear hunting horns, wedding dances, merry feasts, and foaming rapids, finally disappearing into the Elbe.

Šárka - After the depiction of history and nature we move on to the legend of wild and passionate Šárka. A tale of love, betrayal, rage and revenge.

Z českých luhu a haju (From Bohemia's woods and fields) - Following the violence of Šárka, Smetana paints a pastoral portrait, celebrating the beauty of nature on a warm Summer’s day. At times cheerful, at times melancholic. The fugato of the strings represents the rustling of the wind in the grass and we hear hints of songs and polkas as they drift over the wide open countryside.

Tábor - A portrait of the Hussite warriors of the 15 century who set up their stronghold at the town of Tábor, which they were prepared to defend to their deaths. It conjures up imagery of their prayers, preparations for battle, glory and praise from their victories and sadness after their ultimate defeat.

Blaník - Blaník takes over from where Tabor left off, The Hussite heroes are now at peace under the mountain of Blaník, deep in sleep, always ready and waiting to come to the rescue of Bohemia in her time of need and led by St Wenceslas. A poem about hope for the future and a fitting way to end the work. Both Tábor and Blaník draw heavily from the Hussite hymn ‘Who are you, God’s warriors’.

The Czech Republic is the place I have always felt most at home and I am very passionate about all aspects of Czech culture, life and language. Consequently, it is a piece of work that is very important to me and I listen to it usually at least once a month. I love to put on my headphones, close my eyes and let the glorious magic of the music conjure up its own images. That’s how I would recommend listening to it if you can.

Classical music has always been my favourite and makes up probably 90% of my collection. I do realise that it isn’t to everybody’s tastes and that it isn’t likely to fare well in the scoring stakes but I hope that you will all find it pleasant enough for at least one full listen and that it brings you some of the pleasure that it has given me.

Of course there are many variations with different composers and orchestras. I would personally recommend Václav Talich conducting the Czech Philharmonic but as that is a 1954 recording (I think), the sound might not be as good as a more modern recording. For a more modern rendering, Jakub Hrůša conducting the Bamberg Symphony orchestra is very nice.

Sorry for the ramble!
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Great post that Stephen and Mrs Prague agrees with me :)

We're coming over next Monday for a week as Eva hasn't seen her mum for over a year and obviously we haven't been to our house either.

Take care mate, Phil
 
mcfcinprague said:
Great post that Stephen and Mrs Prague agrees with me :)

We're coming over next Monday for a week as Eva hasn't seen her mum for over a year and obviously we haven't been to our house either.

Take care mate, Phil
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If you're at a loose end while over here and fancy a beer or taking in a City game, give me a shout.
 
I love Prague: was forunate to have to spend several working weeks there across much of 2019.

I cannot claim a love of Classical Music, simply never had the bandwidth for it. I still haven't played my late mother-in-law's modest collection of Classical cd's (Mozart mostly IIRC), which sit alongside my other cds, and she passed almost 21 years ago.

I do enjoy orchestral music but I favour movie soundtracks so I am probably a bit of a philistine in respct of symphonic music. What I do know about (say) the John Williams and John Barry albums I have is that they are stuffed with (instantly) memorable music.

What I found with this album is that nothing jumped out and grabbed me; equally nothing had me reaching for the fast forward button. I have only given it one play and it may be that repeated lsitenings will yield deeper treasures but if I am going to put on another Classical suite of music, I suspect I might personally be better served by grabbing something by Wolfie off the shelf; in fact I shall put that to the test right now.

Don't think I can justify more than 5/10.
 
I suppose that it was only a matter of time before somebody nominated a whole album of covers! Ha ha.

No, seriously, I've said a few times on these music threads that I got into music relatively late aged 17, but when I analyse it, I should have clarified that I got into ROCK and POP music relatively late. I've always enjoyed a good TV or film theme, and who could forget all those classical epics used in countless adverts over the years?

So like most, I enjoy lots of classical music in small doses, but have never sat down to listen to a full album, let alone a singe work by one composer. But as noted earlier, I did actually study The Vltava back in 1979 in my first year at secondary school and had to write a 200-word essay on Smetana.

Even though that's over 40 years ago, when this album was nominated, I had that theme running through my head last night, which just goes to show that repeated listening is the key to any music, and I'm guessing that's even more true with classical music.

Well, listening to this, I feel like I'm getting wise and I'm feeling so bohemian like you.

I listened to both the Václav Talich 1954 recording (with headphones) and the Jakub Hrůša 2017 version (through my new desktop speakers). The sound of the Hrůša version is better to my ears because it's a cleaner sound where you can here the individual instruments more clearly. This tends to get lost in the mix of the older recording. I suppose that this is one advantage of listening to classical music - if you don't like one part of a recording, there may very well be another orchestra with a different interpretation along soon enough. This must make for endless intrigue if this is your kind of music.

Although "The High Castle" is a little slow for me, I loved hearing "The Vltava" again - it's main theme is superb,
and if this is generally a lesser known work, I don't know why. "Sarka" has a nice lively piece just past the middle and it builds to an rousing crescendo. Same with the end of "Blanik", but I have to admit that a lot of what I listened to is slow and ponderous. I'm not saying that it is bad, but it's just not something I'd choose to listen to for long periods. To be honest, despite my earlier comments about film and TV music, I often find that stripped of the imagery, the music doesn't always work on its own, and this was the feeling I had for a lot of this work. However, I can imagine that this piece of music is very fitting if you live in a city like Prague, seeing the gothic architecture every day. Maybe this is the film reel that is missing from this music, if you see what I mean?

Scoring of this is quite easy for me - 5 and below is stuff that either I don't like or has some irritating element that drives me towards negative commentary, 7 and above is stuff that piques my interest enough for repeat listens and potential purchases then "must haves" the further we go up the scale.
So "Ma Vlast" sits comfortably in the safer waters of 6/10.

I think it's great that @KnaresboroughBlue has followed his heart and given us the opportunity to listen to this. Albums, songs, pieces of music that mean something to people and their lives is exactly the reason why I started this thread, and I look forward to many more left turns.
 
RobMCFC said:
I suppose that it was only a matter of time before somebody nominated a whole album of covers! Ha ha.

No, seriously, I've said a few times on these music threads that I got into music relatively late aged 17, but when I analyse it, I should have clarified that I got into ROCK and POP music relatively late. I've always enjoyed a good TV or film theme, and who could forget all those classical epics used in countless adverts over the years?

So like most, I enjoy lots of classical music in small doses, but have never sat down to listen to a full album, let alone a singe work by one composer. But as noted earlier, I did actually study The Vltava back in 1979 in my first year at secondary school and had to write a 200-word essay on Smetana.

Even though that's over 40 years ago, when this album was nominated, I had that theme running through my head last night, which just goes to show that repeated listening is the key to any music, and I'm guessing that's even more true with classical music.

Well, listening to this, I feel like I'm getting wise and I'm feeling so bohemian like you.

I listened to both the Václav Talich 1954 recording (with headphones) and the Jakub Hrůša 2017 version (through my new desktop speakers). The sound of the Hrůša version is better to my ears because it's a cleaner sound where you can here the individual instruments more clearly. This tends to get lost in the mix of the older recording. I suppose that this is one advantage of listening to classical music - if you don't like one part of a recording, there may very well be another orchestra with a different interpretation along soon enough. This must make for endless intrigue if this is your kind of music.

Although "The High Castle" is a little slow for me, I loved hearing "The Vltava" again - it's main theme is superb,
and if this is generally a lesser known work, I don't know why. "Sarka" has a nice lively piece just past the middle and it builds to an rousing crescendo. Same with the end of "Blanik", but I have to admit that a lot of what I listened to is slow and ponderous. I'm not saying that it is bad, but it's just not something I'd choose to listen to for long periods. To be honest, despite my earlier comments about film and TV music, I often find that stripped of the imagery, the music doesn't always work on its own, and this was the feeling I had for a lot of this work. However, I can imagine that this piece of music is very fitting if you live in a city like Prague, seeing the gothic architecture every day. Maybe this is the film reel that is missing from this music, if you see what I mean?

Scoring of this is quite easy for me - 5 and below is stuff that either I don't like or has some irritating element that drives me towards negative commentary, 7 and above is stuff that piques my interest enough for repeat listens and potential purchases then "must haves" the further we go up the scale.
So "Ma Vlast" sits comfortably in the safer waters of 6/10.

I think it's great that @KnaresboroughBlue has followed his heart and given us the opportunity to listen to this. Albums, songs, pieces of music that mean something to people and their lives is exactly the reason why I started this thread, and I look forward to many more left turns.
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I do think its interesting that you mention the lack of visuals which was also a recurring theme on 'before the dawn'. Maybe its a generational thing but I always listened to music and (read novels) to let images be created in my imagination. Its maybe not for this thread but there is an interesting discussion somewhere on how much part do images/videos/films/theatre play in your love of music. Is it not simply, that until you are very familiar with a piece of music it is easier to comprehend if its associated with images? Or maybe i'm talking mince :-)
 
RobMCFC said:
I suppose that it was only a matter of time before somebody nominated a whole album of covers! Ha ha.

No, seriously, I've said a few times on these music threads that I got into music relatively late aged 17, but when I analyse it, I should have clarified that I got into ROCK and POP music relatively late. I've always enjoyed a good TV or film theme, and who could forget all those classical epics used in countless adverts over the years?

So like most, I enjoy lots of classical music in small doses, but have never sat down to listen to a full album, let alone a singe work by one composer. But as noted earlier, I did actually study The Vltava back in 1979 in my first year at secondary school and had to write a 200-word essay on Smetana.

Even though that's over 40 years ago, when this album was nominated, I had that theme running through my head last night, which just goes to show that repeated listening is the key to any music, and I'm guessing that's even more true with classical music.

Well, listening to this, I feel like I'm getting wise and I'm feeling so bohemian like you.

I listened to both the Václav Talich 1954 recording (with headphones) and the Jakub Hrůša 2017 version (through my new desktop speakers). The sound of the Hrůša version is better to my ears because it's a cleaner sound where you can here the individual instruments more clearly. This tends to get lost in the mix of the older recording. I suppose that this is one advantage of listening to classical music - if you don't like one part of a recording, there may very well be another orchestra with a different interpretation along soon enough. This must make for endless intrigue if this is your kind of music.

Although "The High Castle" is a little slow for me, I loved hearing "The Vltava" again - it's main theme is superb,
and if this is generally a lesser known work, I don't know why. "Sarka" has a nice lively piece just past the middle and it builds to an rousing crescendo. Same with the end of "Blanik", but I have to admit that a lot of what I listened to is slow and ponderous. I'm not saying that it is bad, but it's just not something I'd choose to listen to for long periods. To be honest, despite my earlier comments about film and TV music, I often find that stripped of the imagery, the music doesn't always work on its own, and this was the feeling I had for a lot of this work. However, I can imagine that this piece of music is very fitting if you live in a city like Prague, seeing the gothic architecture every day. Maybe this is the film reel that is missing from this music, if you see what I mean?

Scoring of this is quite easy for me - 5 and below is stuff that either I don't like or has some irritating element that drives me towards negative commentary, 7 and above is stuff that piques my interest enough for repeat listens and potential purchases then "must haves" the further we go up the scale.
So "Ma Vlast" sits comfortably in the safer waters of 6/10.

I think it's great that @KnaresboroughBlue has followed his heart and given us the opportunity to listen to this. Albums, songs, pieces of music that mean something to people and their lives is exactly the reason why I started this thread, and I look forward to many more left turns.
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Nicely put Rob, you've obviously given much thought to this.
I'm gonna struggle to write anything even remotely nearing a review, as I don't have the experience with this type of music to pass judgement.
All I can say is I like it, but I haven't got a clue about scoring it, because I haven't got much to compare it with. Not the music's fault of course.
 
Saddleworth2 said:
I do think its interesting that you mention the lack of visuals which was also a recurring theme on 'before the dawn'. Maybe its a generational thing but I always listened to music and (read novels) to let images be created in my imagination. Its maybe not for this thread but there is an interesting discussion somewhere on how much part do images/videos/films/theatre play in your love of music. Is it not simply, that until you are very familiar with a piece of music it is easier to comprehend if its associated with images? Or maybe i'm talking mince :-)
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I see your point but I don't consider this a fault on my part. I have no problem conjuring images of the desert when I listen to certain rock music, such as Midnight Oil, for example. It was more a comment about film and TV music in general, not about classical music per se. I sometimes hear music on a TV drama and think "wow, that's great, I'll go and listen to the music for that." And then when I do listen to the music in isolation, it doesn't have the same effect.

crublue1 said:
Nicely put Rob, you've obviously given much thought to this.
I'm gonna struggle to write anything even remotely nearing a review, as I don't have the experience with this type of music to pass judgement.
All I can say is I like it, but I haven't got a clue about scoring it, because I haven't got much to compare it with. Not the music's fault of course.
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It can be difficult not having similar experiences to compare it to - I'm in the same boat.

But all you have to ask yourself is, "would I play this music over my favourite albums or stuff other people have nominated or stuff that's come up in the other thread?" How does it make me feel? Does it annoy me more than Bjork singing (she'd definitely score lower than this)? is it better than a Johnny Cash record (he'd probably score higher) etc.

Everything has it's pecking order and I found this neutral on the whole, but I did like "The Vltava", some of the reasons being nostalgia, but I think it has a good theme that works well (on my ears anyway).
 
RobMCFC said:
I see your point but I don't consider this a fault on my part. I have no problem conjuring images of the desert when I listen to certain rock music, such as Midnight Oil, for example. It was more a comment about film and TV music in general, not about classical music per se. I sometimes hear music on a TV drama and think "wow, that's great, I'll go and listen to the music for that." And then when I do listen to the music in isolation, it doesn't have the same effect.
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I certainly didn't intend it as a criticism or a fault on your part- you are not alone in saying that visuals are an important part of enjoying music.
I hadn't really given much thought as to how you 'process' music until this thread where we are faced with critically responding to stuff we haven't heard before. How do you process new music? What are you listening for? Melody? Dynamics, Instrumentation? Vocals? Lyrics? The shape and flow of a piece? All of that together? The brain must be performing some pretty complex gymnastics. I know mine was when trying to make sense of this long and complex piece of music. No wonder we find visuals helpful to explain what is going on.
I will shut up now because I suspect I am alone in finding that interesting.
 
Interesting to see what those who don’t normally listen to classical music make of this as for a starting point into the genre it probably isn’t the most obvious choice. I know that isn’t the point of this thread though.

(Incidentally I presume anyone is allowed to comment, I’ve not really followed the thread properly)

Having said the above Vltava’s main theme is as stirring a piece of classical music as you can get, absolutely lovely.

The rest I probably need to listen to more. I’m much more familiar with Dvorak and you can hear the similarities with some of his home inspired music. Interesting that Smetena is more popular with the locals.

I used to get recommended recordings of particular pieces back in the days of the Britannia music club and then later when I had the rough guide to classical music. Nowadays it’s what comes up on Spotify and the recording I’m listening to is the Czech Philharmonic conducted by Belohlavak. I’ve not got a well enough educated ear to discern major differences but the Czech Philharmonic are always good value and you would expect them to have a feel for the music.

For those who want better streaming quality I believe IDAGIO is the app of choice but it does come at a cost.

From what I’ve heard of Ma Vlast so far it feels like Vlatava is so good that it almost distracts from the rest of the works but Sarka also has some great themes in it and I’ll listen to the rest with interest when I have time to concentrate
 
RobMCFC said:
I see your point but I don't consider this a fault on my part. I have no problem conjuring images of the desert when I listen to certain rock music, such as Midnight Oil, for example. It was more a comment about film and TV music in general, not about classical music per se. I sometimes hear music on a TV drama and think "wow, that's great, I'll go and listen to the music for that." And then when I do listen to the music in isolation, it doesn't have the same effect.


It can be difficult not having similar experiences to compare it to - I'm in the same boat.

But all you have to ask yourself is, "would I play this music over my favourite albums or stuff other people have nominated or stuff that's come up in the other thread?" How does it make me feel? Does it annoy me more than Bjork singing (she'd definitely score lower than this)? is it better than a Johnny Cash record (he'd probably score higher) etc.

Everything has it's pecking order and I found this neutral on the whole, but I did like "The Vltava", some of the reasons being nostalgia, but I think it has a good theme that works well (on my ears anyway).
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Good points, but (rightly or wrongly) I'm tending to treat classical music completely differently than other forms. I can't compare it to anything else, it sits apart from my other stuff, by a long way.
Given the choice between this, and say, (using your example) Mr cash, I'd say it depends on my mood. I'm a cash fan, but to say this is better or worse is like asking me if I like a curry better than a Sunday roast or a good Chinese.
It's (to me anyway) music that you have to give your full attention to, or you quickly lose the plot. It can't be on in the background or played while you're doing something else. It's demanding of your time, at least that's been my take on the genre so far.
Talking of plots, when I first read Mr knares's excellent intro I must admit that although it was well written and brimming with enthusiasm, it didn't really mean much to me. Listening to the record and re-reading it, makes a lot more sense now. Maybe not a visual aid, but certainly the narrative helps a layman like me.
 
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