The Conservative Party

[yerwot?]

the experts wheeled out to discourage the wearing of masks must take responsibility for the initial spread.
They wont of couse, like all this government.
The decimation of the stocks of emergency supplies by the murdoch puppet j. hunt meant there was not even enough masks for essential workers , and then the desperate scramble to ensure the equipment supply went to party backers and chums (ffs) meant further shortages. The idea that a virus could only be transmitted by contact is an insult to common sense.
A vested interest msm, an already weak and fatally split opposition, a purged cabinet stocked with johnson acolytes obessed with brexit, but nothing else meant that 100,00(and counting) deaths was inevitable.
Anyone expecting a genuine investigation and verdict on this farce must have been asleep for the last thirty years..

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

Thank you for that. I’m intrigued as to why you didn’t say that first time I asked.

Because in reality I've no idea, and I thought you were after an answer. I don't mind speculating, but once you start attaching numbers then there is a danger of speculation becoming fact.

 

[Didsbury Dave]

the experts wheeled out to discourage the wearing of masks must take responsibility for the initial spread.
They wont of couse, like all this government.
The decimation of the stocks of emergency supplies by the murdoch puppet j. hunt meant there was not even enough masks for essential workers , and then the desperate scramble to ensure the equipment supply went to party backers and chums (ffs) meant further shortages. The idea that a virus could only be transmitted by contact is an insult to common sense.
A vested interest msm, an already weak and fatally split opposition, a purged cabinet stocked with johnson acolytes obessed with brexit, but nothing else meant that 100,00(and counting) deaths was inevitable.
Anyone expecting a genuine investigation and verdict on this farce must have been asleep for the last thirty years..

A perfect summary.

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

Coming in cold, but knowing the posters, I'd say that both are desperate to be seen as the "sensible middle ground" when on some subjects the sensible opinion is not the middle ground.

The extremists at the fringe of the looney middle I suppose. I've given it a bit of thought and I suppose to more accurately calculate the impact of govt policy on the pandemic you could take overall covid mortality as a % of population (possibly broken down by age) and compare with similar nearby countries - France, Germany etc. There might be issues with the way deaths are recorded/assigned to covid varying from country to country though.

 

[Didsbury Dave]

It's obvious to a six year old that you wouldn't give a figure because you'd just been giving the government a free pass on their decisions, and giving a number would have meant that you thought that number of excess deaths was fine and dandy.

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

It's obvious to a six year old that you wouldn't give a figure because you'd just been giving the government a free pass on their decisions, and giving a number would have meant that you thought that number of excess deaths was fine and dandy.

Ffs. It's because I've no idea. That's all. Frankly neither have you.

 

[Didsbury Dave]

Ffs. It's because I've no idea. That's all. Frankly neither have you.

Yeah, they've been "generally well meaning" so that's alright for those of you who aren't hate-filled extremists like the rest of us.

 

[BobKowalski]

Even then you’d not be close mate. Age and health demographics have to be similar, similar flow of transient workers, policy makers at a central versus regional level, variants of virus, and so on and so forth. And even then they’ll be more and more variables.

That the government made mistakes is without question but to try and put a body count on it is a little macabre.

You could build in smoothing mechanisms, but Germany is close to the UK including culturally, unlike say France or Italy. In any crisis there has to be an investigation into what we did right and what we did wrong and how much errors contributed to deaths.

Every European country had a heads up on this virus and were still caught with their pants down. We had a heads up based on how it impacted Italy and still kept our pants down. We are an island which theoretically should have been an advantage in that it is easier to lock down sea borders than land and still ended up with the highest death rate.

Looking at the rights and wrongs and measuring that may be ‘macabre’, but better that then repeating our errors.

 

[Ban-jani]

Of course it’s reasonable to hold the opinion without giving an estimated figure, but you said you did have an opinion, and even if your methodology is potentially challengeable I’m still interested in what it is. I’ve asked if 30-50,000 is a fair summary and you’ve said it isn’t.

As to your last point the two are not mutually exclusive.

I’m baffled by your reluctance and Mazz’s to give your opinion on a matter on which you have already said you do hold an opinion.

I never said I hold an opinion on specific numbers, if I did I didn’t mean to, what my opinion is is that it’s without question significant lives will have been lost due to delay and the care home debacle, how many that is I don’t know.

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

Yeah, they've been "generally well meaning" so that's alright for those of you who aren't hate-filled extremists like the rest of us.

Let me give you a bit of context mate. I have a wife who has been kept very busy at a badly under resourced NHS hospital since March last year and hasn't been able to take decent holidays during that time. I lost my sense of taste and smell jus before new year tested positive on 5th Jan and have been stuck in bed until Saturday just gone, while the rest of my family were unable to take tests due to being non symptomatic which I find stupid. I'm far from happy with or condoning the tory govt for which I didn't vote, but simply do not know the facts as to the full extent of their negligence. Until this is in some way 'over' no one will.