The General Election Thread

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mcfc1632 said:
Blue Maverick said:
So Labour as a party is now dead as they have lost the Scottish vote, so for the foreseeable future there will only be one party winning general elections!! Can they bring the Scottish border down just past manchester as let's face it a England = London and fuck all else. Bye bye public sector hello privitisation.


Actually, this is a big issue - this result could mean the end of the Labour party in any known form. How will it get back into power now - they may just decline away.

They are unlikely to get back into Scotland - how could they? And how are they going to appeal to the majority of English voters over the next 10 years? A lurch to the 'real left' maybe what British politics needs but do that and they will likely only become increasingly marginalised.

History may demonstrate that last night was a major shift in British politics in the same way you can point to previous major parties that faded away. I absolutely do not mean this to be a casual point - I feel that there needs to be a credible left of centre balance - but I am thinking that for Labour to get back they will have to lurch like Blair did and abandon their traditional values.
Interesting points. There have been occasions before when one or other party looked doomed (Tories when they lost under Major and Labour after 1979) but they both found a way back.

The loser finally gets an electable leader and the other side get complacent and the unelectable party is back in play. The opportunity from the Labour point of view is Scotland and if Scottish voters feel that the SNP is never going to deliver any real change then they could be persuaded to go back to Labour, in order to form a government or simply as an anti-Tory vote.

If Labour could pick up 40 seats in Scotland then they'd only need another 30 or so in the rest of the UK to be the majority party. However it does look like a decent overall majority is beyond them for the foreseeable future.
 
Has a victorious party leader ever had such a morning with so many rivals resigning?

Amazing stuff going on here.
 
blueinsa said:
Has a victorious party leader ever had such a morning with so many rivals resigning?

Amazing stuff going on here.
Not since Ducado saw off Fetlocks and a dozen others on blue moon that fateful day.
 
Three dead certs at least and two probables for the last few seats so they're home and dry.

The campaign was tedious and uninspiring but the outcome has been sensational. Now Dave has 2 years of relative peace before his party tears itself apart over the EU referendum.
 
Bluemanc100 said:
Bigga said:
Lucky13 said:
An extra 8bn being pumped into it, four times what the socialists pledged.

In politics a 'pledge' is not a promise. As I said a few weeks ago, if the Cons are going to put in £8 billion, they haven't said at what point that will start to happen and from where they will get that money.

The Cons have less than a 1% swing against Labour, that's about 17 seats, so they didn't do that great against their main rivals. People rejected the Libs and, obviously, the SNP came into play to work against Labour.

What that means is Labour are alive and kicking. A new radiant leader will give them all they need in England, without reliance on Scottish influence.

Really? The Jocks decided the majority of what happened last night and the public have spoken

People are saying that you cant blame Ed, I disagree, its akin to Tommy Cooper passing me his material, I'd die flat on my arse! It's about policies and pledges for sure but the key is the delivery and having credibility

They fucked up big time as we all know when they let David move to the Big Apple and this is not an overnight fix

A gamble that looks to have failed miserably


Ed Milligan was no where near on track to become Labour leader until the real puppet masters decided he was the most malleable tool.

Labour did not 'let' David M go - their bosses chose. It was a simple question of ".......he who pays the piper......."

The control of Labour by the Unions has not been commented upon much in this election - but it is likely the reason that Labour will never come back.

The days that such extreme left-wing doctrine and Union manipulation can be dressed up to be attractive to an increasingly independent and free-thinking public are gone forever.
 
worsleyweb said:
totallywired said:
Yep, the tory scum won fair and square. It`s up to us workers, to stand up to the attacks on the NHS and other frontline services that the less fortunate people of our country need and rely on. The move to the right will be coming quickly. Immigrants, NHS, Disabled and mental heath sufferers and organised workers in Trade Unions, will all be targeted again. To the lib dems who supported this shower in the coalition, just fuck off and die.

Tory scum??

Fuck off and die??

Wonder how many of the people who voted Tory are workers? I would suggest a huge percentage.

Agreed. I'm a full time 'mature' student, also working 30 hours per week. The Mrs works 40 per week and studies part time.
Both voted Tory, seen my income tax contributions almost completely disappear last few years, putting more money in our pockets.
Yet labour are seen as the saviours of the workers.
 
worsleyweb said:
Damocles said:
SWP's back said:
I thought it was cute.

Grrrr. Go on you workers. You tell them. Grrrr.

He's one of those UAF far left nutters. Bit of a loon to be honest.

I thought you were the leftist person on the forum? May I ask what is your genuine reaction to the result apart from shock, are you angry, apathetic?

My dad has just been on the phone and called me a judas Tory and put the phone down on me.

I probably am politically but he's one of those "crusading" types he thinks he's saving the world.

My reaction to the result outside of shock is one of excitement. This entire narrative of "good guys vs bad guys" is unbelievably stupid and I've never suggest that the Tories would be anything but good leaders. I said earlier in the thread that the Tories represent economic stability whilst Labour represented public good - the recovery from the economic crisis isn't over but I felt it was now at a point where we were stable enough to pay our debts responsibly whilst looking after the poorest around us. The electorate obviously didn't agree that we were stable enough and voted the Tories in to continue their economic recovery or to stop the SNP going into Government.

The excitement is for 2 reasons - firstly the state of politics in the country has just changed entirely with the resignation and results so there's much fun speculation to come. The bigger excitement for me though is to do with the polling (because I'm nothing if not a maths geek). Many people believe polls to be shite but they really aren't; the idea that statistical sampling doesn't work is somewhat ridiculous and nobody can possibly live their lives based on this. But the results speak for themselves. There's a thing about this "shy voter like in 1992" that people don't really understand - in 1992 the state of British polling was unbelievably poor and the polls were wrong because the polls were badly designed claptrap rather than people didn't want to say they were voting Tory. This election though was very different - every polling agency in the world got this wrong and are now covering themselves as best they can. The polls were reflective, the weighting was unbiased and sensible and the sampling was significant. The idea that people won't admit in advance to voting Tories but then come out and admit in an exit poll to voting Tory doesn't make any sense logically. What this means is that something went wrong, and nobody yet knows what that is so the investigation and post-mortem will be an exciting time.

In terms of the state of the country - personally me and my family will be fine and my business isn't one that will change in any way no matter who is in charge (unless they cut off the internet or absolutely destroy the pound). The other businesses I'm involved in are doing fine and can't imagine that anything will change in that regards. Socially I'm worried about what this means for the NHS but again the narrative of the Tories as these great big evil people coming to snatch away the NHS from the desperate serfs is a fabrication, people don't tend to be James Bond villains, only their presentation in the media is.

The European question is obviously quite important to me and there's a fight to come on that.
 
st. blue said:
worsleyweb said:
totallywired said:
Yep, the tory scum won fair and square. It`s up to us workers, to stand up to the attacks on the NHS and other frontline services that the less fortunate people of our country need and rely on. The move to the right will be coming quickly. Immigrants, NHS, Disabled and mental heath sufferers and organised workers in Trade Unions, will all be targeted again. To the lib dems who supported this shower in the coalition, just fuck off and die.

Tory scum??

Fuck off and die??

Wonder how many of the people who voted Tory are workers? I would suggest a huge percentage.

Agreed. I'm a full time 'mature' student, also working 30 hours per week. The Mrs works 40 per week and studies part time.
Both voted Tory, seen my income tax contributions almost completely disappear last few years, putting more money in our pockets.
Yet labour are seen as the saviours of the workers.

I think the same, just finished postgraduate part time studies funded by a scheme setup by the Tories and otherwise my industry is booming, my job is safe etc. My Mrs has gone from minimum wage to assistant manager in 2 years. We are now in a great position but we are only average, we don't earn a great deal but we take care of ourselves and don't need to rely on anyone else. It was impossible us to consider voting any other way.
 
Damocles said:
worsleyweb said:
Damocles said:
He's one of those UAF far left nutters. Bit of a loon to be honest.

I thought you were the leftist person on the forum? May I ask what is your genuine reaction to the result apart from shock, are you angry, apathetic?

My dad has just been on the phone and called me a judas Tory and put the phone down on me.

I probably am politically but he's one of those "crusading" types he thinks he's saving the world.

My reaction to the result outside of shock is one of excitement. This entire narrative of "good guys vs bad guys" is unbelievably stupid and I've never suggest that the Tories would be anything but good leaders. I said earlier in the thread that the Tories represent economic stability whilst Labour represented public good - the recovery from the economic crisis isn't over but I felt it was now at a point where we were stable enough to pay our debts responsibly whilst looking after the poorest around us. The electorate obviously didn't agree that we were stable enough and voted the Tories in to continue their economic recovery or to stop the SNP going into Government.

The excitement is for 2 reasons - firstly the state of politics in the country has just changed entirely with the resignation and results so there's much fun speculation to come. The bigger excitement for me though is to do with the polling (because I'm nothing if not a maths geek). Many people believe polls to be shite but they really aren't; the idea that statistical sampling doesn't work is somewhat ridiculous and nobody can possibly live their lives based on this. But the results speak for themselves. There's a thing about this "shy voter like in 1992" that people don't really understand - in 1992 the state of British polling was unbelievably poor and the polls were wrong because the polls were badly designed claptrap rather than people didn't want to say they were voting Tory. This election though was very different - every polling agency in the world got this wrong and are now covering themselves as best they can. The polls were reflective, the weighting was unbiased and sensible and the sampling was significant. The idea that people won't admit in advance to voting Tories but then come out and admit in an exit poll to voting Tory doesn't make any sense logically. What this means is that something went wrong, and nobody yet knows what that is so the investigation and post-mortem will be an exciting time.

In terms of the state of the country - personally me and my family will be fine and my business isn't one that will change in any way no matter who is in charge (unless they cut off the internet or absolutely destroy the pound). The other businesses I'm involved in are doing fine and can't imagine that anything will change in that regards. Socially I'm worried about what this means for the NHS but again the narrative of the Tories as these great big evil people coming to snatch away the NHS from the desperate serfs is a fabrication, people don't tend to be James Bond villains, only their presentation in the media is.

The European question is obviously quite important to me and there's a fight to come on that.
How does the popular vote compare to the polls? I don't see it being that wrong. For me it's the conversion of popular vote to seats where the error lies.
 
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