UEFA FFP investigation - CAS decision to be announced Monday, 13th July 9.30am BST

[Colin Bells Boots]

Even if CAS side with us you just know that anyone outside the club will say we paid them off.

Heads we're guilty , tails we paid them off - what's the difference ?

 

[hcblue95]

When you say up to something slightly dodgy? By that do you mean try to find a way around invented rules designed to stop investment in Manchester City? Rules that simply wouldn’t exist if Sheikh Mansour had bought Inter Milan, for example? Whilst allowing other owners to saddle their clubs with massive debts?

I don’t think we’ve done anything dodgy at all.

I agree with you, dodgy was probably the wrong wording. Still, if we were proven to have broken the rules (I know they're shit rules), I'll accept the punishment because I feel we should have taken them to court over the legality of FFP anyway.

 

[Colin Bells Boots]

Any football fan outside of City ones think you are guilty; that if anything it took too long for you to get a ban; and that if you are found not guilty, it is only because you have bribed the right people.

You need to understand that most fans don't even know how FFP works. They'll see you spending 150 M€ and selling for 40 and say you are in infraction. They don't take into account the ticketing money, the TV rights money, the sponsorship/marketing money, the amortization of contracts, mutation indemnities,...

The fact for most is City is spending more, much more than their fav clubs or established clubs and it is unfair. That alone warrants a FFP sanction in their book.

I dunno how it will end in CAS, reason why i'm not posting much in this topic anymore. I think it is useless because CAS is serious and there will be no leaks. You just have to wait to know, no guessing game.

The only rival or non rival fans who are not condemning City are the ones who think FFP and its application is a scam. And even then, i saw a lot of PSG fans or Milan fans who think City is guilty and did some terrible thing (fraud). I was surprised to see a guy on redcafe who was vehemently against FFP as a MU fan some time ago.

He's probably been assassinated by now .

 

[tolmie's hairdoo]

Even if CAS side with us you just know that anyone outside the club will say we paid them off.

Amazing, innit?

We've gone through all this shit for two years, untold reputational damage, when all it required was a couple of brown envelopes to CAS?

UEFA's bribe rate must be slipping, eh?

 

[SilvaisSkyBlue]

I just said I'll leave the thread but I wanted to answer this one. If City win and the irrefutable proof is made public I will happily change my opinion.

Your whole post is absolute bòllocks, but the above is not what you said in your post, you said ‘It's so technical and so huge that there is a massive chance someone in UEFA has fucked up somewhere along the line, I suspect City's bluster is based around having the confidence that the best legal team money can buy will find that mistake’.

You say the only way City are found not to have broken any FFP rules it’s because of our expensive legal team, and you now require the ‘irrefutable proof’ to be made public to satisfy you, not that the actual case is based on bòllocks created to prevent us ever becoming successful in the first place and the man who implemented was barred from all football for taking a one million euro bribe which he thought he could say was for work completed 10 years previously.

So you would rather take the word of an already proven corrupt UEFA who are absolutely still infected with corruption (step forward Leterme and many others) in that organisation without question and you have already proven in your replies you have zero idea what actual charges or proof UEFA have against City, but we need to publish irrefutable proof to satisfy you, for actual charges you have no idea of, well done you utter fućkwit.

 

[blueyorkie]

Any football fan outside of City ones think you are guilty; that if anything it took too long for you to get a ban; and that if you are found not guilty, it is only because you have bribed the right people.

You need to understand that most fans don't even know how FFP works. They'll see you spending 150 M€ and selling for 40 and say you are in infraction. They don't take into account the ticketing money, the TV rights money, the sponsorship/marketing money, the amortization of contracts, mutation indemnities,...

The fact for most is City is spending more, much more than their fav clubs or established clubs and it is unfair. That alone warrants a FFP sanction in their book. They are even saying that FFP is dead if City isn't banned... The truth is City sanction is in the hands of CAS now and it has nothing to do with FFP future.

I dunno how it will end in CAS, reason why i'm not posting much in this topic anymore. I think it is useless because CAS is serious and there will be no leaks. You just have to wait to know, no guessing game.

The only rival or non rival fans who are not condemning City are the ones who think FFP and its application is a scam. And even then, i saw a lot of PSG fans or Milan fans who think City is guilty and did some terrible thing (fraud). I was surprised to see a guy on redcafe who was vehemently against FFP as a MU fan some time ago.

The problem is that the narrative is that we spend more, people routinely write that we spend £100m on a player when in reality our biggest ever purchases is about £60m

 

[Coatigan]

Any football fan outside of City ones think you are guilty; that if anything it took too long for you to get a ban; and that if you are found not guilty, it is only because you have bribed the right people.

You need to understand that most fans don't even know how FFP works. They'll see you spending 150 M€ and selling for 40 and say you are in infraction. They don't take into account the ticketing money, the TV rights money, the sponsorship/marketing money, the amortization of contracts, mutation indemnities,...

The fact for most is City is spending more, much more than their fav clubs or established clubs and it is unfair. That alone warrants a FFP sanction in their book. They are even saying that FFP is dead if City isn't banned... The truth is City sanction is in the hands of CAS now and it has nothing to do with FFP future.

I dunno how it will end in CAS, reason why i'm not posting much in this topic anymore. I think it is useless because CAS is serious and there will be no leaks. You just have to wait to know, no guessing game.

The only rival or non rival fans who are not condemning City are the ones who think FFP and its application is a scam. And even then, i saw a lot of PSG fans or Milan fans who think City is guilty and did some terrible thing (fraud). I was surprised to see a guy on redcafe who was vehemently against FFP as a MU fan some time ago.

That is fair. And agreed, hardly unexpected. In the same way people, myself included, can't help beleiving PSG took the mick of FFP with that summer of 400m worth of signings, and dodged punishment through some very convenient coincidences. It is inevitable, when the scenes are set.

And note i don't use the words breached or guilty etc, i Have read your previous detailed posts on it, no blame or accusations attributed, PSG found their way to spend what they thought they needed and wanted to, hopefully we will have found and proven ours. The perception of the rest won't change, for either.

 

[The Colonel]

You make a good point. It is very difficult to judge because we have virtually no allies in the media or the football world. Of course we are all biased and Bluemoon is certainly an echo chamber. No one outside City has been positive but I do think the media hate campaign against us has generally reduced since Christmas and that could be a good sign.

The difference is that here we try and learn the facts. Yes we may put a positive spin on them but at least it’s from a position of knowledge rather than ignorance.

 

[JRockBlues]

Anyone who says we're guilty is correct (at the moment) as a totally unbiased UEFA have found us so. Hopefully along will come CAS and overturn the ban. Unfortunately a lot of damage has been done and regardless of the upcoming verdict it won't change very many opinions of how we're perceived outside of our club. The club need to be aggressive at pursuing any negative media narrative against us if, as we all hope, the ban is overturned.

 

[Exeter Blue I am here]

Does anyone outside the club and fans think we win the case? I've not read anyone being positive.

Are we in our own little echo chamber and suffering from confirmation bias.

I live and work in the South. I don’t know a single fan of any other club down here, who doesn’t think we’re guilty. However, the echo chamber thing applies to them as much as it does to us, and their knowledge/understanding of FFP is non-existent

 

[SilverFox2]

Thanks for the reply. I'll be honest, I think it's quite possible we've been up to something slightly dodgy. I personally wouldn't trust any judgement from uefa though, because it's in their interest to work for the cartel. If CAS rule against us I will accept it, because I believe them to be by the book. I think a lot of city fans will also accept CAS' verdict, so I don't think we should be lumped in with the dippers in denial.

Surely not embracing "spirit of the rule".
as "something dodgy" are we?

To find any way to circumnavigate rules or even laws is surely the job of good accountants where finance is concerned.

 

[Metalartin]

Thanks for the reply. I'll be honest, I think it's quite possible we've been up to something slightly dodgy. I personally wouldn't trust any judgement from uefa though, because it's in their interest to work for the cartel. If CAS rule against us I will accept it, because I believe them to be by the book. I think a lot of city fans will also accept CAS' verdict, so I don't think we should be lumped in with the dippers in denial.

I was thinking along the same lines(CAS will do what UEFA didn't) but other people have been saying CAS aren't even going to a make a guilty or innocent verdict because that's not what they do(since they are not a court). It is said all they will do is make a decision on whether they think UEFA's process was above board, as to whether the decision can be trusted. I really hope they will be looking at the evidence City say was ignored though.

 

[Metalartin]

As for the Spurs fan saying everyone thinks City fans are bonkers, isn't that hypocrisy? Since most of those fans(him included) know far less than alot of the more vocal City fans do about the subject more often than not. For them to say "Your club are definitely guilty and you're bonkers for denying it" without seeing any proof(the emails are not proof, context is everything with those) or knowing much about specifics of our ownership, sponsorship and the situation with Etihad and Abu Dhabi in general. Surely those are the more ignorant/deluded individuals, until we actually see any evidence from either side? Let's not forget that UEFA(or the CFCB) haven't shown any evidence either, they certainly haven't .

 

[jaiguruKun]

I was thinking along the same lines(CAS will do what UEFA didn't) but other people have been saying CAS aren't even going to a make a guilty or innocent verdict because that's not what they do(since they are not a court). It is said all they will do is make a decision on whether they think UEFA's process was above board, as to whether the decision can be trusted. I really hope they will be looking at the evidence City say was ignored though.

They will, I'm going over old ground her but it's a hearing de novo, which means all the evidence will be considered hence any procedural defects are cured.

 

[BLUEMATT23]

I'm 6 months on here and so far have avoided giving my opinion on the subject. Seeing as you have specifically asked I will share my thoughts. Firstly I have noticed a real change in mood in the last few weeks since the poll went up and @projectriver provided his brilliant analysis.

Now gets ready to run for the hills*

As an outsider looking in and what I feel is the general consensus among other fans is City are obviously guilty. In so many ways it reminds of 2 cases, the John Terry/Anton Ferdinand case and the Suarez/Evra case. The Chelsea fans weren't as ferocious as they were inwardly delighted to have a racist as captain but still wouldn't have it be said that only true version of events was the one provided by their spiritual leader. With Liverpool you had players wearing t-shirts in support and supporters learning intricate pieces of law and Montevideo slang and swearing blind their man is the victim when literally everyone else is looking at them and saying what the fuck is wrong with them? To this day they won't have anyone say Suarez was a wrongun despite a mountain of evidence and a series of various crimes for differnet teams in different countries. They wanted to sue the FA, Ferguson,Evra, UEFA and anyone else that didn't believe them. It was only the eventual intervention by sponsors that had them put their guns away. In 20 years time those fans will still reject any accusation he made racist remarks.

I think something similar will happen here, City will lose and eventually sponsors/investors will demand a line is drawn underneath this. I won't line, I do think City are guilty but I don't think this is anywhere near as clear cut as the Suarez case simply because there is so much more involved and City at every level (bar internet security) seem to be world leaders, add in another jurisdiction which UEFA have no rights in and it becomes a much closer call. It's so technical and so huge that there is a massive chance someone in UEFA has fucked up somewhere along the line, I suspect City's bluster is based around having the confidence that the best legal team money can buy will find that mistake.

* you did ask.

Guilty of what exactly?
Your comments make little sense and making a comparison between this and the Suarez incident make even less sense.

 

[BLUEMATT23]

The facts of the Suarez incident are irrelevant to the point I was making. The poster I replied to asked about how the case is viewed outside your "bubble". My reference is the Suarez incident is a comparison between both sets of fans, both are adamant, unequivocal, 100% certain, whatever word you want to use for not entertaining any other outcome than innocent. There was/is no doubt among the support base where as other clubs supporters are looking on thinking your bonkers.

What a load of crap

 

[chaddblue]

I live and work in the South. I don’t know a single fan of any other club down here, who doesn’t think we’re guilty. However, the echo chamber thing applies to them as much as it does to us, and their knowledge/understanding of FFP is non-existent

It applies more to them as all they know is what the sun, mirror and Simon Jordan has told them

 

[BluessinceHydeRoad]

The attitude of other clubs' fans is hardly surprising. I remember being astonished by the claim coming out of OT the morning after news of the takeover reached the public that City's money was ruining football! Before long fans everywhere had been led to believe that spending was evil unless clubs spent "their own money" which was actually somebody else's money. Then we got the rubbish about "financial doping". Then they started on sponsorship but only Etihad. "What was the losing bid" was even more popular in Liverpool than YNWA, and just as noone ever bothered about the rags spending no one was bothered about Liverpool's sponsors or Bayern's or Juventus's. It was an unquestioned truth etched in stone that City are cheats and the sheep believe it as an unquestioned article of faith. You don't need evidence. You don't need specific accusations. FFP was to give City their deserts and if you can't find specific rules they have broken, it doesn't matter. Do the cheating buggers anyway.

 

[Marvin]

What a load of crap

No it's not crap. Most fans outside of City do think city are guilty. How could you expect otherwise with the media coverage? That doesn't make City guilty it just means that mud sticks if you throw enough of it.

 

[BuryBlue1977]

Pep sounds ultra confident we’ll be in the CL next year!!!