United thread 2012/13 (inc merged IPO thread)

[smudgedj]

What most rags don't realise is that if it wasn't for City's generosity and good neighbourliness in hard times United's progress would have been severely restricted and they might not even exist today.

When City got stitched up by he FA over illegal bonuses to players (the practice was widespread but the FA wanted to make City a scapegoat because of their growing power) and were forced to sell off most of their squad, the club generously allowed United to pick up several top players including Billy Meredith and Sandy Turnbull. This was instrumental in United winning their first trophies, two league championships and an FA Cup, between 1908 and 1911. (After which they won jack shit for 37 years).

In the late 20s Manchester Central were founded and were soon pushing hard for admission to the Football League. Despite the 3rd Division North accepting them in place of Wigan Borough (who had resigned from the League) in 1931, City backed United in their opposition to Central being admitted to the League on the basis that United were struggling financially and had poor gates and a successful Central would cause United serious damage.

During and after the war City generously offered United the use of Maine Road for first team games while the swamp was being repaired. They stayed from 1941 until 1949 durig which time their record attendance was set (82,360 v Arsenal in 1948, a fact which they have airbrushed from their history).

Likewise in 1956-57 City allowed United to use Maine Road fo European Cup games as City had floodlights but the swamp didn't. Without that generosity the rags wouldn't have been able to appear in the European Cup until they next won the League Championship in 1965.

No good deed goes unpunished.

 

[Andy Conway]

FOREVER IN OUR DEBT

 

[SWP's back]

3rd July S&P 500 1374.02
Now 1356.55

It's not a big decline

It is no decline at all (in general terms) and investors look at the long term picture, they do not look at market volatility ranged over a few weeks. That would be madness. The markets are generally up on the calendar year.

If the IPO does not go ahead, it has nothing to do with a volatility and everything to do with lack of interest. Don't believe the hype fella.

 

[Marvin]

3rd July S&P 500 1374.02
Now 1356.55

It's not a big decline

It is no decline at all (in general terms) and investors look at the long term picture, they do not look at market volatility ranged over a few weeks. That would be madness. The markets are generally up on the calendar year.

If the IPO does not go ahead, it has nothing to do with a volatility and everything to do with lack of interest. Don't believe the hype fella.

Up 10% YTD but the markets have been stalked by periods of fear.

 

[JM Mcr]

during which time their record attendance was set (82,360 v Arsenal in 1948, a fact which they have airbrushed from their history).

Airbrushed from their history? Any Utd fan with a grasp of the clubs history acknowledges the fact that City allowed Utd to rent Maine Road, at a reasonable charge, whilst Old Trafford was out of commission and that our record attendance was during that period (I believe our highest "home" FA cup attendance was also at Maine Road - against Yeovil) Oh yeah, n we don't airbrush the fact that our average league attendance at Maine Road, in those post war years, was significantly higher than Citys ;-)

 

[SWP's back]

3rd July S&P 500 1374.02
Now 1356.55

It's not a big decline

It is no decline at all (in general terms) and investors look at the long term picture, they do not look at market volatility ranged over a few weeks. That would be madness. The markets are generally up on the calendar year.

If the IPO does not go ahead, it has nothing to do with a volatility and everything to do with lack of interest. Don't believe the hype fella.

Up 10% YTD but the markets have been stalked by periods of fear.

But short term volatility over the last few weeks have been no where near as volatile as periods in the last 36 months. That is why that excuse is so see through as to be ridiculous.

Here is the VIX, it maps the volatility in the US markets mate. Now they chose the US to do the float after "volatility" in the Far East (despite emerging markets stock growing at 63% over the past 3 years), now "volatility" looks to have killed it again (despite actual volatility being lower than when they announced the float and as low as at any point in the past 5 years give or take a percentage point or two).

 

[Marvin]

I saw on another thread that you work in the industry. Any news on whether these Investor road-shows are back on? We still don't know whether the offer had been delayed or abandoned

 

[SWP's back]

I saw on another thread that you work in the industry. Any news on whether these Investor road-shows are back on? We still don't know whether the offer had been delayed or abandoned

I haven't heard anything sorry mate about the road shows but I have heard that interest has not exactly been what they were after.

Investors like dividends, no sorry, (serious) investors LOVE dividends. Utd isn't a growth company (a young company likely to need to reinvest all profit back into the company and see huge capital growth), not in the classical sense. There market share is not likely to increase dramatically and their competitors are investing heavily. The IPO never likely to do well and I hope the graph above shows just how barefaced the "oh no, there is suddenly volatility in the market, we can't go ahead" lie is.

 

[laserblue]

during which time their record attendance was set (82,360 v Arsenal in 1948, a fact which they have airbrushed from their history).

Airbrushed from their history? Any Utd fan with a grasp of the clubs history acknowledges the fact that City allowed Utd to rent Maine Road, at a reasonable charge, whilst Old Trafford was out of commission and that our record attendance was during that period (I believe our highest "home" FA cup attendance was also at Maine Road - against Yeovil) Oh yeah, n we don't airbrush the fact that our average league attendance at Maine Road, in those post war years, was significantly higher than Citys ;-)

Strange then that the stats they submitted to Sky Sports 2011-12 Yearbook state that their club record attendance is 76,098 v Blackburn in 2007. As for getting bigger crowds than City at Maine Road perhaps that was something to do with City fans going to watch United games at 'their' ground at a time when attendances boomed after the war. My dad and many of his contemporaries used to go to watch United at Maine Road most games at a time when away travel was much more difficultthan nowadays.

Shame United don't hold the attendance record at their own ground. That honour goes to Grimsby (and Wolves) ;)

 

[gordondaviesmoustache]

during which time their record attendance was set (82,360 v Arsenal in 1948, a fact which they have airbrushed from their history).

Airbrushed from their history? Any Utd fan with a grasp of the clubs history acknowledges the fact that City allowed Utd to rent Maine Road, at a reasonable charge, whilst Old Trafford was out of commission and that our record attendance was during that period (I believe our highest "home" FA cup attendance was also at Maine Road - against Yeovil) Oh yeah, n we don't airbrush the fact that our average league attendance at Maine Road, in those post war years, was significantly higher than Citys ;-)

Strange then that the stats they submitted to Sky Sports 2011-12 Yearbook state that their club record attendance is 76,098 v Blackburn in 2007. As for getting bigger crowds than City at Maine Road perhaps that was something to do with City fans going to watch United games at 'their' ground at a time when attendances boomed after the war. My dad and many of his contemporaries used to go to watch United at Maine Road most games at a time when away travel was much more difficultthan nowadays.

Shame United don't hold the attendance record at their own ground. That honour goes to Grimsby (and Wolves) ;)

That last sentence did make me chuckle.