Well done boss

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br88 said:
I understand some of your points about this game but for me there are just NO excuses for not scoring over 90 minutes against that Villa team.....end of.
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No there aren't but I think people are letting the result cloud their view of the performance. We had a lot worse performances throughout the season.
 
Damocles said:
I think that if you told us three years ago that Pellers was going to come in, win one league title and two League Cups but we'd get to a European semi one season then most would be a bit disappointed.

He made a rod for his own back in a way with the 13/14 season.

There have been doubts about this team, these groups of players that we put together between 2009-2011 maybe have a bit of a soft underbelly and are flat track bullies. Their greatest triumphs such as the 11/12 title have come from disappointing positions and they had to go and pull their finger out to save the day for themselves at the end.

That 13/14 season was the one time that any of our managers actually had this team playing to its potential. They showed us how good they could be when properly motivated which is infuriating when you compare it to the sombre performance in Madrid or even the Arsenal game where we thought that we'd better pull our finger out again.

You never forget your first love so this squad of players will be remembered legendarily for the 11/12 and 13/14 titles but as a talented group of individuals they have failed to achieve what they could have done and possibly what they should have done. We SHOULD have dominated football for a 5 year period there; we had the best squad with the most talented spine and deepest quality in the league. Two league titles, one FA Cup and two League Cups in the last 6 years is absolutely nothing to be sniffed at and represents the most successful period in the history of this club. But I can't shake that feeling that despite this it could have been more. I know that sounds entitled but it's honestly how I feel.

Now we've got perhaps 10 players who will need to be replaced within 2-3 years, we've got a new manager coming in and this feels a bit like the last day of term.

We needed this squad to get us to where we are - full of talent and big names who dragged us through the shit into the top tier of English football and able to challenge the top tier of European football. Now we've started a bit of a different recruitment strategy this year with players like Sterling and KDB who will bring not just talent but enthusiasm and energy. They're the first of the new bunch in my opinion, the first stones in the skyscraper to come.

Neither Pellegrini or Mancini managed to motivate these players for very long despite having extremely contrasting styles. This tells me that when Mancini was shouting and they said they needed an arm around them, they probably didn't. Pellers came in and put an arm round them to great success then all of a sudden performances drop off after one season.

The Guardiola appointment is so hugely important in my opinion not just because he's a world class manager but also because he's the first manager who I think our board will choose in front of a big player if the argument came down to it. I think they've known that they could get Mancini sacked if they wanted and they could get Pellers sacked if they wanted. If they try that with Pep then we'll sell them to Stoke. That's a big culture change for us next season and will hopefully produce some interesting results.
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This reflects my views. Hopefully Pep will be the guy who at least makes the whole equal the sum of the parts. I hope his mere presence will help to instill extra belief whichever players are retained.
 
tolmie's hairdoo said:
Damo, did we win two FA Cups, then ;

Was the Wigan Final just a nightmare after all?

As you say, Pep is the game-changer.
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Ah bollocks I missed that. To be honest I wasn't even thinking about Wigan, I was thinking Stoke, Sunderland, United and Liverpool for some reason. This is why we shouldn't have semis at Wembley, the bastards.

Though beating the rags at Wembley and watching Balo troll the fuck out of Ferdinand was as good as an FA Cup for me.

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Are you expecting a MAJOR clearout this summer mate, or a more longer term strategy?
 
mosssideblue said:
That would hold true if the remainder of the prem league remained static. Do you not concede, the league has been getting increasingly more competitive these last few years?
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I am not sure the top teams have become more competitive in all honesty, but even so, what you are implying is that we have become progressively less competitive?
 
Damocles said:
The Guardiola appointment is so hugely important in my opinion not just because he's a world class manager but also because he's the first manager who I think our board will choose in front of a big player if the argument came down to it. I think they've known that they could get Mancini sacked if they wanted and they could get Pellers sacked if they wanted. If they try that with Pep then we'll sell them to Stoke. That's a big culture change for us next season and will hopefully produce some interesting results.
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Word. (I know you don't like one word replies but that's all you're getting).
 
br88 said:
It's got more competitive because the so called big teams have gone backwards. If we forget positions and results etc. for a minute.....ask yourself did you really enjoy the games this season....my answer to that is very rarely. For most games this season I left the ground thinking what has happened to the great football we used to play...even the home games were a struggle against most teams. And our performances in some of the big games at HOME were pathetic....Leicester, Tottenham, Liverpool, United, West Ham. I think the 0-0 result at an unbelievably bad Aston Villa was also a very good indicator of our decline.
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You cannot say the big teams have gone backwards. Nobody saw what Leicester were about to do. Throw in Spuds, Southampton, West ham and maybe one or two others and to say they have not gotten better this season is simply wrong IMO. Maybe, we didn't play well because we were up against teams who had closed the quality gap on us. I guess once your mind is made up, you cannot see any other reason other than the one you want.

Yes, we could / should have done better but our squad is not the one it once was so an argument could be made that we have allowed others to become better, making our job much harder.
 
mosssideblue said:
You cannot say the big teams have gone backwards. Nobody saw what Leicester were about to do. Throw in Spuds, Southampton, West ham and maybe one or two others and to say they have not gotten better this season is simply wrong IMO. Maybe, we didn't play well because we were up against teams who had closed the quality gap on us. I guess once your mind is made up, you cannot see any other reason other than the one you want.

Yes, we could / should have done better but our squad is not the one it once was so an argument could be made that we have allowed others to become better, making our job much harder.
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Spurs do look to have improved but when you look at their points tally it's just par for the course with them. There's a decent argument there to say they only look good because the usual challengers have been shit.
 
halfcenturyup said:
I am not sure the top teams have become more competitive in all honesty, but even so, what you are implying is that we have become progressively less competitive?
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I do think the top teams have gotten closer to us in terms of their quality, which IMO is a reason we have struggled against most of them this season. To answer your specific question, I think we have become less competitive, because we have allowed others to become better i.e. our squad is not what it was and needed improving.
 
Honestly, I can handle the results side of things just fine. Coming 4th doesn't bother me and I don't expect us to win the league, nor indeed any silverware every single year.

What really ****s me off are the piss poor performances and even worse the way our style of play has regressed to the point that 8 times out of 10 we are pretty dull to watch, with slow, laborious play, everything in front of the opposition's defence, sloppy in possession, disorganised and shambolic defending. As a "team", we are imho in the bottom half of the league, maybe lower. But we are rescued by having a handful of really top class players. West Ham the other night played better than we have done for weeks, with players who wouldn't get on the bench at City.

There's no way on this god's earth that we should be watching sides like Swansea play more attractive football than we do.
 
Rolee said:
I was talking about Spurs. The same can apply to Southampton really, the last two seasons they have similar point tallies.
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I'm not protecting Pellers here, let me make that clear. My point is that there are many factors why a team that is expected to perform struggles. For me there are two major reasons why we haven't done as well as we might

1. Injuries to key personnel
2. Our squad becoming weaker through age, attitude and general loss of form

Yes, if Pellers had been more savvy, he might have squeezed a little more out of them (not enough to win the league though IMO), but for me, they are the two most damning reasons.
 
Rolee said:
Spurs do look to have improved but when you look at their points tally it's just par for the course with them. There's a decent argument there to say they only look good because the usual challengers have been shit.
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I want to try and simplify this discussion. If we forget for a minute the various comparisons of who improved or not etc....I will just say that, as I walked out of the stadium after the vast majority of games last season, I was feeling depressed at what my team had served up. There is no right or wrong with this....that is just what I felt.
 
mosssideblue said:
I'm not protecting Pellers here, let me make that clear. My point is that there are many factors why a team that is expected to perform struggles. For me there are two major reasons why we haven't done as well as we might

1. Injuries to key personnel
2. Our squad becoming weaker through age, attitude and general loss of form

Yes, if Pellers had been more savvy, he might have squeezed a little more out of them (not enough to win the league though IMO), but for me, they are the two most damning reasons.
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Ah well, what is done is done, for whatever reason. Fourth place will be in the bag Sunday night and we have the best manager we could possibly want for the next 3+ years. We will be just fine.
 
BillyShears said:
Topping the group helped. A very difficult group. Still I've read on here that that wasn't our achievement but Juventus "throwing it away". I guess that'll be just like Liverpool and United throwing away the titles we won.
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Well they beat us twice in a six game group so I am not sure what else you'd call it.

We were better than United and Liverpool. We certainly weren't and aren't better than Juve.
 
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