West Ham United (A) | PL | Post Match Thread

[SomeMightSay]

Gonzalez is awful and gives the ball away far too much. I don’t know what some people see with him.

Faster football

 

[Blue2112]

not really mate we are second only to arsenal by one, yesterday we couldn't break down the massed ranks of their back 10, did feel a bit of a lack of urgency

There was a situation after 90mins with about 2 to play where three of our players all had the opportunity to put the ball in the middle. They each passed it around amongst themselves until Nunes delicately floated one into the mass of bodies. It was like one of those light footballs you had when you was a kid. Just float it in and watch it go anywhere and nobody can do anything with it because there is no pace on the cross. It's an awful feature of our game.

 

[jrb]

The toxicity and self entitlement on here, I assume from many fans who have started supporting City the last 15 years, such have never known anything but success and winning, is as breathtaking as it is depressing. Having spent almost 50 years following City and seeing the darkest of dark days and wallowing in the lower leagues, I never gave a thought to ever finishing 2nd in the PL, going back to Wembley - for the 30th time this century - or being close to playing in the CL never mind winning it. In life you win and you lose. The losing makes the winning even more enjoyable and if we won every match and every trophy then it would become devalued and diluted. For those calling to sack Pep... be careful what you wish for. Look at our past not to mention the mob across town, Spuds, Chelsea,Leeds and any one of many clubs who churn through managers. It’s a young team with some real talent that maybe needs a couple of more additions - Elliot Anderson / Liveramento - for it to be genuine title contenders. Our job is to support the team, not to have emotional breakdowns because we draw or god forbid lose a match. Liverpool have won 2 titles in about 30 years, Arsenal none in 20 + years and United 13 years and counting, yet some fans on here think we should win every year. In short, calm the fck down...

Thanks for the advice.

But most of us want to watch attacking and exciting football, not mind numbing walking football, passing sideways and backwards for 90 minutes + injury time. Believe it or not, Pep used to get his teams to play exciting and fluid football, whilst retaining the ball and also wining the ball back that won us numerous trophies. Now it’s all about keeping the ball, passing it around aimlessly throughout the match, hoping against hope of breaking down a packed 10 men defence camped in and around the 18 yard box , and doing next to nothing with free kicks and corners.

 

[come-on-barney]

Has Semenyo removed them lead boots hes had on for last couple of game

But a player who’s ripping it up at Bournemouth, play him in a different position and wonder why we don’t get the same results. Baffling.

 

[waspish]

Thanks for the advice.

But most of us want to watch attacking and exciting football, not mind numbing walking football, passing sideways and backwards for 90 minutes + injury time. Believe it or not, Pep used to get his teams to play exciting and fluid football, whilst retaining the ball and also wining the back, that won us numerous trophies. Now it’s all about keeping the ball, passing it around aimlessly throughout the match, hoping against hope of breaking down a packed 10 men defence down camped in and around the 18 yard, and doing next to nothing either free kicks and corners.

Need tweaking sure but possession football is why we have been the best team in premier last 10+ years! Just think teams know now how to counteract it more! Last night yep we had a lot of possession but we did miss 3/4 good chances we score 2 we win that game!

 

[jrb]

But a player who’s ripping it up at Bournemouth, play him in a different position and wonder why we don’t get the same results. Baffling.

I knew it would happen. It didn’t take long for Pep and his tactics to suck the attacking life out of Semenyo already. Just like it happened with a Grealish after he signed from Villa. Stay out wide Jack, and just pass the ball inside and backwards.

 

[dajd1984]

For me it isn’t the way we play that is the issue as we have 10 years of showing that that style works.

The issue for me is that the management of the club have spent three seasons signing players who cannot play a possession style of football for a manager whose entire career in football has been based on the total football, Cruyff style of football.

I truly wonder what Guardiola must honestly think when he watches a team he manages with players like Haaland, Semenyo, Marmoush, Donnarumma who cannot string 2 passes together. These players go against everything he has stood for in his entire career.

It’s a very strange situation because the club has been so connected and all pulling in the same direction for so long yet now we have built a squad of players that is completely unsuitable to the manager we have in charge and the style he wants to play.

It’s depressing and I’m sure this will upset a few people but by Easter Sunday we will likely be out of every competition the way we are playing.

I almost completely disagree.

Teams will adapt to systems and styles, you can’t keep the same way of playing forever ‘because it works’, or because it used to work.
It needs adapting, like we have done before, with a false 9, or wingers who cut inside, or invested full backs. We have nothing new atm and I think that is a problem.

We won the treble with Haaland.
We have a possession based keeper in Trafford, who will mar far more mistakes than Donnarumma, so if you don’t like Donnarumma (who I think has been incredible!) then who else was going to replace Ederson?

We have bought lower quality players, but we’ve had to operate on a tighter budget. We can’t complain about ticket prices/strategies and about lack of spending at the same time

 

[jrb]

Need tweaking sure but possession football is why we have been the best team in premier last 10+ years! Just think teams know now how to counteract it more! Last night yep we had a lot of possession but we did miss 3/4 good chances we score 2 we win that game!

There’s no point in possession football if there is no end product. It’s been like this for the last 2 seasons. We all thought last season was bad. Is this season any or much better?

 

[waspish]

There’s no point in possession football if there is no end product. It’s been like this for the last 2 seasons. We all thought last season was bad. Is this season any or much better?

There was end product! You saying we make chances we miss chances is not an end product! That chance has to go in for end product if so that’s being pedantic

 

[dajd1984]

There’s no point in possession football if there is no end product. It’s been like this for the last 2 seasons. We all thought last season was bad. Is this season any or much better?

There have been elements of that for 10 years tbf.

 

[East Level 2]

Marmoush, Reijnders, Doku, Savinho, Nunes

There's five I'd fuck off in the summer with only Nunes having the saving grace of accepting not being a RB anymore

But they are young, and have talent, and we aren't allowed to criticise even though they show zero likelihood of being anywhere near as good as the players they are replacing.
Marmoush might be OK as a squad player as he's never going to get regular games alongside Haaland.
Reijnders looks skilful but disappears too often and misses too many chances.
Doku scares defenders but loses the ball far too often trying to go through gaps that aren't there. And a few good games every so often is not acceptable for the level we want to be at. He is a vast downgrade on Sterling.
Savinho looks like he needs an extended run in the team but isn't good enough to warrant risking giving him one.
Nunes is a good winger turned full back, but why didn't we just buy a proper full back to replace Kyle Walker?

Have we been spoilt by watching players produce good performances from day one or are we suffering from poor recruitment?

 

[CityPar]

Got a ticket for Madrid game (I know I should have waited until after the1st leg!) and was looking for inspiration last night as to whether I bother to use it. After all it's a 600 mile round trip for me. Petrol, food, accomodation it all adds up. Did the boys give me insipration? Did they f#*k! Walking football in the 1st half. Who'd know the title was on the line! Second half not much better. They only created chances when....wait for it....they upped the pace at the end. But for Bernies fluke it would have been so much worse.

 

[come-on-barney]

They maybe good goal scores but semenyo and marmoush are god awful footballers.

You cant have two of them starting at the same time.

So’s Salah, but scores goals. You can’t buy a player ripping it up in one position and play him in a different position you bought him for. Semenyo looked great in his normal position first few games. The lads a goal scorer, then we start playing him out of position.

 

[rice10]

I almost completely disagree.

Teams will adapt to systems and styles, you can’t keep the same way of playing forever ‘because it works’, or because it used to work.
It needs adapting, like we have done before, with a false 9, or wingers who cut inside, or invested full backs. We have nothing new atm and I think that is a problem.

We won the treble with Haaland.
We have a possession based keeper in Trafford, who will mar far more mistakes than Donnarumma, so if you don’t like Donnarumma (who I think has been incredible!) then who else was going to replace Ederson?

We have bought lower quality players, but we’ve had to operate on a tighter budget. We can’t complain about ticket prices/strategies and about lack of spending at the same time

We have bought a much lower standard of player I completely agree. I also agree with you that we won a treble with Haaland but Haaland played in a side with 10 other players who were all exceptional at keeping the ball. Now Haaland is in a side with Marmoush, Semenyo, Doku, Savinho, Donnarumma, etc. which now means that when we try to control games we simply cannot do it anymore. You can carry one player but not half a side.

This has led to Pep trying to completely ignore the keeper and defenders in the build up and do everything through Rodri and Bernardo as these are the only players he seems to trust in the build up. See the Leeds game when Rodri and Bernardo literally took the goal kicks just so we could keep the ball.

Also every interview pep still always talks about a thousand million passes so it is clearly what he wants to do he just no longer has players capable of doing it.

Is that Guardiola’s fault for not adapting to the players being signed for him or the club for signing him players who cannot play the style he wants to play. That’s why I find the last three seasons of squad building so baffling.

 

[Saddleworth2]

Thanks for the advice.

But most of us want to watch attacking and exciting football, not mind numbing walking football, passing sideways and backwards for 90 minutes + injury time. Believe it or not, Pep used to get his teams to play exciting and fluid football, whilst retaining the ball and also wining the ball back that won us numerous trophies. Now it’s all about keeping the ball, passing it around aimlessly throughout the match, hoping against hope of breaking down a packed 10 men defence camped in and around the 18 yard box , and doing next to nothing with free kicks and corners.

That was a very hard watch yesterday. As soon as I saw the team, I said, where is the creativity coming from? It was depressingly familiar. Our three most creative players sitting on the bench, one of them a pale shadow of what we know he can be. Subs made on 60 minutes which in Pep world is plan A failed, bloody hell Cherki put Halland in with his first touch when he came on. I love Pep but am being severely challenged not to join the folk that say his time is drawing near. His tactics in too many games are not working, he is not improving players like he used to and those that were first names on the team sheet have dipped. I leave too many games now underwhelmed and frustrated. If I could make him do one thing it would be start Cherki. Second thing would be play your best players in the position they are best at. Its hardly bloody rocket science.

 

[Ken92]

I almost completely disagree.

Teams will adapt to systems and styles, you can’t keep the same way of playing forever ‘because it works’, or because it used to work.
It needs adapting, like we have done before, with a false 9, or wingers who cut inside, or invested full backs. We have nothing new atm and I think that is a problem.

We won the treble with Haaland.
We have a possession based keeper in Trafford, who will mar far more mistakes than Donnarumma, so if you don’t like Donnarumma (who I think has been incredible!) then who else was going to replace Ederson?

We have bought lower quality players, but we’ve had to operate on a tighter budget. We can’t complain about ticket prices/strategies and about lack of spending at the same time

I think there are 2 things you see with great Peps sides, high intensive pressing and winning the ball back quick and high up the pitch and playing out of the back. This teams is pretty poor in both of these things. Pep won´t become Simeone ,thats not the way he sees football. Lack of high football iq and technical ability is the reason this team isnt hitting those heights again for me. Yes teams adapt and Pep has adapted ,but those main principals have always been there ,when he is succesful. Pretty much Bayern is doing all of this atm and they are looking very good.

 

[Man-chester copperpot]

I’ve just realised that they had 1 fucking shot and scored.
We had 24 attempts and scored 1

We should be relegated for this alone
Pathetic

Give me 24 more hours and i will have calmed down. Pissed off

 

[tonea2003]

There’s no point in possession football if there is no end product. It’s been like this for the last 2 seasons. We all thought last season was bad. Is this season any or much better?

i guess the counter argument is we are still in all for comps(just i grant you) we are the second highest goalscorers by one and the second best defence.
had some great results madrid away liverpool away toon away with the second string and some bad spurs at home bodo and madrid away utd away
think we are very much in a transition
we can dig in as we saw at arsenal and were unlucky to concede late on when josko had a brain fart
wish we had done it in some other games like last wednesday for instance, but pep loves his high line and sometimes we pay the price

 

[East Level 2]

Who from out of interest? Enough to keep themselves in a title race or enough to pull the wool over your eyes?

I'm sorry but you can't tell me any one of them showed the courage you'd expect from a team fighting to stay in a title race. The slow lacklustre football is a result of this, not one of them wants to step up and be the one to make the difference.

Hard to get through a West Ham defence who've conceded 55 goals in 30 games? Give me a break. We made it hard for ourselves with the continued slow turgid football we play.

Agreed.
West Ham have the second worst defence in the PL, we only managed to score once and that was a bit fortuitous.
We've dropped nine points against the bottom six (and still have to go to Burnley) yet some fans won't accept something is seriously wrong.

 

[Ken92]

There’s no point in possession football if there is no end product. It’s been like this for the last 2 seasons. We all thought last season was bad. Is this season any or much better?

i´ve said it before that i think it really isn´t any better and thats concerning.