Why do we keep getting HAMMERED? What is our training regime exactly.

  • Thread starter Thread starter Pam
  • Start date Start date
When our opponent's tails are up, we could do with a player prepared to put one of them into the 6th or 7th row of the Stand. Not with a view to deliberately injure but to show our opponents that we're no pushovers. Makes me sick to my stomach to say this, but a Roy Keane type of player wouldn't half lift our performances. Right, I'm away to projectile vomit.
 
My view, open for debate. After the candlepool game and seeing all there second string in defense, easily mopping up our attacks. It highlighted our complete lack of group cohesion, we lose Kompany and we're in trouble, lose Yaya and distribution suffers. To me it stems from the kids all the way up to first team. How many times have our teams dominated only to be hit by a sucker punch?
Start with the defense, there all in a rush to get to the 18yrd box and hold the offside line, opposition just drop off 3-5 yrds and pick up the ball without a blue in sight happens in every game. To remedy all it takes is a blue to man mark there free man, rest can hold the line.
Our total lack of a challenge in all areas, opposition hoof the ball (or from our goal kicks, throw ins etc..) and have all the time in the world to collect or head on.
We just seem too rigid in our defending, even when we have 2 banks of four, no one picks up a runner or anyone between the banks, this mainly happens right in front of our penalty box. Silva would have a field day playing against us.
Pep will need to look at the system at all levels and remedy the glaring blind spot which is the players role when we don't have the ball. With the ball we are usually ok but way to slow moving it forward.
My views, a bit haphazard in presentation, feel free to comment.

Agreed. It's like when we lose the ball, we have acres of space for the opponents to run into and pass. Currently we have huge gaps between defence, midfield and attack. And this makes us more prone to losing the ball. For our style, this is suicide. Don't know why this happen though. Is this because of tactics? Not enough players moving into intelligent positions to receive the ball? Something to do with fitness? Or not putting enough emphasis on ball retention training (unlikely though)? Or opposition pressing harder? (But we should be skillful enough to pass out of trouble).

Another thing that is baffling is how we press. Thought someone has mentioned that we come close to the opposition player having the ball before stopping at least two yards away from them. Even more baffling is that we showed some very intelligent pressing and proactive defending just last week. So is it due to tactics? Or fitness?

I really don't know the answer, but I suspect it is multifactorial. Tactics, fitness, training and luck all play their parts. And this may even stem from pre-season for we might not have enough fitness training. No one is free from blame, but no one alone should shoulder the blame either. The team currently must be working on all these problems, and let's hope that they would find solutions soon enough.
 
Yo keep saying this and I keep telling you you're wrong but you keep repeating it. I can't deny that some players were extremely unhappy with Mancini but sacking was 90% to do with his attitude towards the executive staff. After we'd beaten Newcastle, he was ordered out to Abu Dhabi to try to resolve the problems he was causing at the top level of the club. I'm not entirely sure whether he saw the Sheikh himself or Simon Pearce but the message to him was clear. The club wanted to work a certain way and he either co-operated with his peers or he would be out on his ear. He seems to have made it clear he wanted full control and that Soriano, Begiristain & Marwood should be sacked. This was clearly unacceptable to Sheikh Mansour/Simon Pearce and the inevitable decision to sack him was taken by the board a few days later, just before the derby.

If he'd been working closely with that executive group then I have little doubt any players not wanting to play for him would either have been given short shrift or any problem would have been resolved.

PB, that's three fairly unaccountable people, who have certainly had more misses, than hits in transfers, post Mancini, then I would agree with Mancini and the powers that be were wrong. There not always right and I doubt the Sheikh came to this opinion without the input of those unaccountable individuals.
 
My view, open for debate. After the candlepool game and seeing all there second string in defense, easily mopping up our attacks. It highlighted our complete lack of group cohesion, we lose Kompany and we're in trouble, lose Yaya and distribution suffers. To me it stems from the kids all the way up to first team. How many times have our teams dominated only to be hit by a sucker punch?
Start with the defense, there all in a rush to get to the 18yrd box and hold the offside line, opposition just drop off 3-5 yrds and pick up the ball without a blue in sight happens in every game. To remedy all it takes is a blue to man mark there free man, rest can hold the line.
Our total lack of a challenge in all areas, opposition hoof the ball (or from our goal kicks, throw ins etc..) and have all the time in the world to collect or head on.
We just seem too rigid in our defending, even when we have 2 banks of four, no one picks up a runner or anyone between the banks, this mainly happens right in front of our penalty box. Silva would have a field day playing against us.
Pep will need to look at the system at all levels and remedy the glaring blind spot which is the players role when we don't have the ball. With the ball we are usually ok but way to slow moving it forward.
My views, a bit haphazard in presentation, feel free to comment.
No its not haphazard at all and it gets straight to the point. The game has been changing at a rapid pace over the last few years but our manager is either unaware of these new developments or is in denial. Certainly we are not helped by the age profile of our squad which has become used to playing in a certain manner for over 5 years now and clearly has difficulty in adapting to a game plan that requires an increase in tempo and workrate. Expect big changes next season with significant departures over the next two summers.
 
I've said this a million times before but watch the opposition when they lose the ball and we attack. Their back four lines up on the 18 yard line and the midfield 4 or 5 about 15 yards in front of them. This gives us no room to play in.

When faced with an opposition attack we, on the other hand, usually have at least one defender miles up-field, central defenders out of position and the midfield ambling around the opposition half around watching what's going on. There's no semblance of organisation or awareness of where anyone should be and when Otamendi has dived in and committed himself, the road to goal is wide open.

Absolutely bang on the money.


My opinion is the game has evolved very quickly over the last three or four years, and we haven't moved with it.


Other teams have worked hard on the discipline of positioning, of what to do/how to act when the ball is lost, what to do/how to act when the ball is regained, the use of a fast counter attack, while ensuring the players have the skill, stamina and fitness to play this style.


We are playing the old style, the Mancini/Italian style of slow build, patient attack, and reliance on a very good final ball in the opposition 18 yard box. Playing this way means it’s just a matter of time before the ball is miss-passed or lost with us high up the pitch, which is where our vulnerability is found. With certain key members of our playing staff lacking the stamina and/or mobility to recover their defensive positions when we lose the ball, we become very vulnerable to the fast counter attack.


I also don’t think this is a recent thing with us, we have been vulnerable like this for a few seasons now (watch the 3-2 against QPR in 2012 to see how vulnerable we were at it even then!) but as our key players have slowed up that few percent with a combination of age, injury and simple loss of form, it has really been brought this problem to light.


My hope (belief!) is PG when he lands will move quickly to address this, almost certainly with a more disciplined, skilled, younger mobile playing staff across the middle of the park, playing to a similar new style, but with a tacticians nous thrown in as well.
 
Did the other night and in the first match also Stoke and Leicester. Anyway you would not expect a team costing many millions to get hammered across 90, 45, 30 or 5 mins by so many teams in one season which is not over yet and probably has 1 o 2 more hammerings to come yet.

As long as one of 'em ain't Villa this Saturday, I think I can cope!
 
PB, that's three fairly unaccountable people, who have certainly had more misses, than hits in transfers, post Mancini, then I would agree with Mancini and the powers that be were wrong. There not always right and I doubt the Sheikh came to this opinion without the input of those unaccountable individuals.
They're not totally unaccountable though. They have to answer to Khaldoon and others in Abu Dhabi and if they don't deliver their objectives, they'll face the same fate as Mancini. I do agree they've got a lot to prove and I've made it clear on here that I'm not happy with the way that Soriano particularly seems to be taking the club.
 
They're not totally unaccountable though. They have to answer to Khaldoon and others in Abu Dhabi and if they don't deliver their objectives, they'll face the same fate as Mancini. I do agree they've got a lot to prove and I've made it clear on here that I'm not happy with the way that Soriano particularly seems to be taking the club.

I wonder if Soriano understand what it is to build a world famous club. Barcelona had had Cruyff, Maradona, Hagi, Ronaldo, Ronaldinho. There will be others of equal quality, the attraction, status and influence on the world existed long before he turned up. I feel that there's little that's holistic about the club and playing success doesn't seem high on his agenda. Liverpool as they did on Wednesday often kicked there way to success, but we're still considered a great team, it's the winning that matters.
 
When our opponent's tails are up, we could do with a player prepared to put one of them into the 6th or 7th row of the Stand. Not with a view to deliberately injure but to show our opponents that we're no pushovers. Makes me sick to my stomach to say this, but a Roy Keane type of player wouldn't half lift our performances. Right, I'm away to projectile vomit.

Never really replaced DeJong did we.....too soft in midfield like Arse now.
 

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