Honestly mate you're absolutely clueless if you think Carvalho is the same kind of passer as those three.
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William Carvalho
- Thread starter BlueMoonz1977
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Shaelumstash
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He's nothing like Fernando. His main strength is his passing ability and that is why Pep would be interested in him as he's suitable to play in the pivot role.
@BigOscar
I heard the same thing about Javi Garcia and Fernando before we signed them. Based on what I'd seen of them, I didn't think they were incisive or ambitious enough in their passing to make it for us. I think we'd all agree that's proven to be the case.
With Carvalho I haven't seen a great deal of him, but what I have seen, he overwhelmingly chooses the safe, easy pass backwards or sideways. Perhaps you've seen dozens of games that disprove that and I've been unlucky with the ones I've seen.
If we sign him, I really hope you end up being right and I end up being wrong. But from what I've seen, he is light years away from being Yaya's standard on the ball.
Shaelumstash
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Honestly mate you're absolutely clueless if you think Carvalho is the same kind of passer as those three.
I'm certainly not clueless, pal. Did you watch the Russia game? His performance in possession was exactly the same as you'd expect from Fernando and Javi Garcia. Lethargic and passed it 5 yards sideways or backwards every single time. If you think his passing range is in the same bracket as Yaya, Xabi Alonso and Busquets then I can only assume you're on heavy hallucinogenic drugs.
If you heard Fernando or Javi Garcia were expansive passers of the ball then people were lying to you. No one thought that about them, at all. Garcia was a very safe, consistent passer of the ball and Fernando was average a best with the ball at his feet, that was never his game. I don't recall either of them ever having a reputation for being able to pick a pass more than about 10 yards.I'm certainly not clueless, pal. Did you watch the Russia game? His performance in possession was exactly the same as you'd expect from Fernando and Javi Garcia. Lethargic and passed it 5 yards sideways or backwards every single time. If you think his passing range is in the same bracket as Yaya, Xabi Alonso and Busquets then I can only assume you're on heavy hallucinogenic drugs.
William Carvalho on the other hand has a fantastic range of passing, just because he doesn't attempt Charlie Adam Hollywood passes every time doesn't mean he can't pass. He takes the best option, which in that position is frequently the safe option, which Yaya, Busquets and the like also constantly do, but if the lane opens up for a pass into the forwards he takes it, or the option opens up to swing a long diagonal up to a winger in space.
I did watch the Russia game and thought he was very tidy. Passed the ball well to the forward players when it was on, but if it wasn't he just moved it on. Exactly hat you'd want from someone playing that position. I don't know what Busquets you've been watching if you think he's constantly spraying passes about, he's an incredibly safe passer of the ball, as is his job.
Shaelumstash
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If you heard Fernando or Javi Garcia were expansive passers of the ball then people were lying to you. No one thought that about them, at all. Garcia was a very safe, consistent passer of the ball and Fernando was average a best with the ball at his feet, that was never his game. I don't recall either of them ever having a reputation for being able to pick a pass more than about 10 yards.
William Carvalho on the other hand has a fantastic range of passing, just because he doesn't attempt Charlie Adam Hollywood passes every time doesn't mean he can't pass. He takes the best option, which in that position is frequently the safe option, which Yaya, Busquets and the like also constantly do, but if the lane opens up for a pass into the forwards he takes it, or the option opens up to swing a long diagonal up to a winger in space.
I did watch the Russia game and thought he was very tidy. Passed the ball well to the forward players when it was on, but if it wasn't he just moved it on. Exactly hat you'd want from someone playing that position. I don't know what Busquets you've been watching if you think he's constantly spraying passes about, he's an incredibly safe passer of the ball, as is his job.
As I say, I've not seen an awful lot of Carvalho, so if you're saying he's got a terrific passing range, I'll have to take your word for it.
But if you thought his passing was good against Russia, we've clearly got different views about what good passing is in that position. He constantly looked sideways or backwards when there was a forward pass on. His choice of pass was exactly the same as Fernando or Javi Garcia would have chosen in that game, no doubt about that.
The Busquets I've been watching doesn't play 50 yards Charlie Adam passes when they're not needed. What he does do is play an early, incisive pass in to the feet of the players in front of him, usually under pressure. It's kind of what he's built his career on, so I'm not sure where you've got this misguided idea that he just plays square and backwards, he's much better on the ball than that.
Tugay One Cup
Well-Known Member
@BigOscar
I heard the same thing about Javi Garcia and Fernando before we signed them. Based on what I'd seen of them, I didn't think they were incisive or ambitious enough in their passing to make it for us. I think we'd all agree that's proven to be the case.
With Carvalho I haven't seen a great deal of him, but what I have seen, he overwhelmingly chooses the safe, easy pass backwards or sideways. Perhaps you've seen dozens of games that disprove that and I've been unlucky with the ones I've seen.
If we sign him, I really hope you end up being right and I end up being wrong. But from what I've seen, he is light years away from being Yaya's standard on the ball.
That's a fairly thought through and considered post. It's refreshing to see a forum member admitting they might be wrong and not acting like the one performance they've seen of a player is enough to judge his ability.
I'm certainly not clueless, pal. Did you watch the Russia game? His performance in possession was exactly the same as you'd expect from Fernando and Javi Garcia. Lethargic and passed it 5 yards sideways or backwards every single time. If you think his passing range is in the same bracket as Yaya, Xabi Alonso and Busquets then I can only assume you're on heavy hallucinogenic drugs.
As you were.
I don't think Busqeusts only passes it sideways and backwards, I think he passes it in a very similar way to Carvalho. A lot of short, safe passes sideways and backwards, some short forwards and occasional longer balls out to people on the wing or to a forward who's made space in the hole. Although I'm not a massive fan of them, the stats will back this up they are very similar in the way they pass the ball.As I say, I've not seen an awful lot of Carvalho, so if you're saying he's got a terrific passing range, I'll have to take your word for it.
But if you thought his passing was good against Russia, we've clearly got different views about what good passing is in that position. He constantly looked sideways or backwards when there was a forward pass on. His choice of pass was exactly the same as Fernando or Javi Garcia would have chosen in that game, no doubt about that.
The Busquets I've been watching doesn't play 50 yards Charlie Adam passes when they're not needed. What he does do is play an early, incisive pass in to the feet of the players in front of him, usually under pressure. It's kind of what he's built his career on, so I'm not sure where you've got this misguided idea that he just plays square and backwards, he's much better on the ball than that.
As for having to take my word on Carvalho having a good passing range, you could just watch pretty much any video of him and you'll see him ping at least a couple of lovely balls out to the winger each game. Even a highlights video of him at the Euro's last year where he was far from at his best and asked to play a far less expansive game would still show him make at least a dozen passes that Fernando or Garcia wouldn't make in an entire season.
There are things to criticise about Carvalho, but his passing range or ability isn't one of them.
Joe Hart's Dandruff
Well-Known Member
Why has this guy cropped up again? Anything of substance?
nmc
Well-Known Member
Why has this guy cropped up again? Anything of substance?
I think the links are coming from the Portugal end - think Sporting want to sell him to us. Not sure there's much from City's end apart from some generally positive comments from Pep a few months ago.
Manchester_lalala
Well-Known Member
You're going to have to get used to it, because we're not going to bring in some enforcer just to make you feel more confident in the midfield. Pep knows his way is successful, so the pivot will either be Yaya or Gundogan, or maybe Carvalho if he comes.
Fernandinho might come in for a 3241 but that's not necessarily more defensive.
I know that, I think it will work better this season with a better defence.