Pleased that you're still going to reply to my question. Look forward to receiving your reply.
For my part the only change in your reply should be in response to that bit of my question about what type of Brexit you think will actually happen ( in the light of today's astonishing cut and run u turn). As for what type of Brexit you want and your red lines,that shouldn't change.
As for the assumption that May's announcement today means a harder Brexit is more likely I wouldn't be so sure. There is a groundswell of opinion in the national and social media that this signals a softer Brexit for all kinds of reasons one of which is the strengthening of May's hand against her right wing Brexit loons. The £ rose two cents against the dollar today in anticipation of a softer Brexit. There are other reasons which I won't go into here but I'm sure will fill these pages for months to come.
By the way you say you're from Wokingham, you're not JR are you?
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For my part the only change in your reply should be in response to that bit of my question about what type of Brexit you think will actually happen..."
Mainly correct, I have generally always posted from the viewpoint of how the negotiations will/can be managed and where this will lead us to in terms of outcomes - as you describe what I think will actually happen. Because this is the Article 50 / Negotiations thread.
Others, I think you and Fumble included, post on your personal preferences for how things should turn out - in your ideal world. I see this as essentially still fighting the pre-23/06 fight.
"As for what type of Brexit you want and your red lines, that shouldn't change."
Well yes and no - because, as mentioned above, I do not live in a world where I am expecting the negotiations to be undertaken 'on my behalf' and consistent with my 'red lines'. That is not how it will work - I am not saying my world and how I think things through is right or better - just different.
May does not at this point know what her red-lines are - she will not be (allowed) to be stupid enough to set out such constraints on the negotiations. Yes there will be firm objectives and there will outcomes agreed (in the coming months) with the negotiators which reflect the Ideal, Realistic and Fallback positions in key areas. As the engagement commences and the UK team are able to assess the strengths and weaknesses of the UK and EU positions then a decision will be taken on whether we are shooting for the I, R or F in each key area and governance arrangements put in place to review/update these. These will be strictly confidential between a very small group. There will be no 'running commentary' or any of this bollocks Hilary Benn is banging on about.
So my Red lines will actually not be anything quite so 'crude' and are indeed influenced by the change today. They were also (more) influenced by the defeat of the wrecking amendment to the A50 bill. Because I approach it differently to you.
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As for the assumption that May's announcement today means a harder Brexit is more likely I wouldn't be so sure........"
It is you making the assumption not me. You just class me in a group that you think are looking for a hard-Brexit - that is lazy of you and if you had read my posts more closely you would know that to be the case.
What is important for me is 'definite Brexit' - I have posted in the past about being willing to pay for that - compromise / bend over etc. - so long as it fucking happens and is not a 'fraud'.
I see today's announcement as clearing May's ability to support the negotiations in either/both the ways it might unfold. As much as the result will free them up from Benn's nonsense and Labour, LibDems and SNP's game playing - it also frees them up from the extreme views of Redwood et al. which can also be unwelcome and bring forward unwelcomed constraints.
I always come at this from the viewpoint of how negotiations are managed. Whilst also having my personal aspirations they are tempered.
BTW - I m from Eccles - not Wokingham. I just live there.