Does Pep need to be more pragmatic away from home in Europe?

daztrueblue91 said:
Equally we could have allowed Liverpool to have all of the ball and got spanked as well. Our players aren't used to playing in the manner you have suggested.

Both times at Anfield this season we have given away sloppy goals and then lost all sense of composure. Just look at the three goals we conceded and then make a straight face and say that there were nothing to do with mentality.

Goal 1 - Sane plays a pass that is never available and leaves us short at the back, Walker then has an opportunity to clear it but tries to control it instead and loses the ball.
Goal 2 - Otamendi goes walkabouts with the ball instead of clearing it, Gundogan then bottles out of a 50/50 challenge.
Goal 3 - Laporte shows Salah onto his stronger foot.

None of those goals are outright tactical mistakes. It's just normally composed players making the wrong decisions at the wrong time.
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This! +1, I genuinely can't comprehend some of these posts, some of these guys must be trolls.
 
Every manager has a system of playing, signs players to play that system and trains that system. You can tweak it but City are not capable of playing the system United play which invariably beats Liverpool.
 
City_Sean said:
That's my thoughts. I think he changed too much and it ended up in players looking uncomfortable with their roles. I think the Gundogan experiment left Walker completely exposed. It happens though, but I find it hilarious that people think we should adopt Mourinho like tactics.
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+1
 
ak93city said:
Every Liverpool defeat this season across all competitions have come in games where they've dominated the ball (65%+ possession). If you haven't already figured out, Klopp isn't good in possession.

So yeah, letting them have the ball would certainly be MUCH more effective than what Pep's been trying to do I imagine. Whether he'll do that or not is a separate issue.
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If only was as simple as flicking a switch and allowing us to play like West Brom. The lesser sides who have beaten Liverpool are used to parking the bus and also relied on a huge amount of luck and poor finishing from Liverpool in those games. We got none of that last night.

Also, the likes of United, Spurs and Chelsea all have a target man who can bully the Liverpool CBs and retain possession, something which we don't have. Jesus was non-existent last night and didn't have a sniff throughout the match.
 
cadds92 said:
If we score in the first in 5-10 minutes then the atmosphere will probably rocket and give the players belief.

If they score first we might as well all go home.
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lol - It's easy to say mate but we will continue to improve under Pep.
 
I actually think he was trying to be pragmatic last night and the same last season v Monaco. He spoke quite frequently last year about the need to attack yet spent the entire first half without a single shot. Like last night we ended up in a halfway house where we weren’t set up defensively but completely lost any attacking edge. Basically offered nothing and ended up like lambs to the slaughter. The players aren’t blameless for last night however I will say Pep got it totally and utterly wrong like he did last year. He deserves so much praise for this incredible season but the criticism is quite rightly being pointed at him today.
 
The Basel away game I watched with a friend and told him depsite we won easily we still gave them way too many good chances and while some Basel wingers and attackers did not punish us those mistakes any half decent would and someone like Mane, Salah surely not even mentioning the CR, Messi, Benzema, Suarez, Lewandowski, Müller type of attackers surely would run riot if we commit those mistakes.

In the CL you need to be clever in later stages.

Pep wasnt very clever yesterday. With him mixing up the formation, bringing Laporte in, I think he just mixed the heads of the players. And then failed to stop Liverpool go up to 3-0, after 1-0 we should have hold onto to being 1-0 down as we knew Pool can really have immense 20-30 minute period during the game. They had in in the 4-3 loss. Now they had in first 30 minutes.

Biggest surprise to me lack of good shots. After 5-0 and 4-3 we didnt test Karius. It means Klopp outplayed him tactically not just scoring some goals but restricting us to failed crosses and some bad shots. And then punish us quickly when we lost the ball.

In these stages you need to be clever with the plan.

Monaco away game still hurts a lot, went there with 5-3 up and managed to lose 3-1. We needed a draw there or a small loss.
 
Pep: "I know the way we play is perfect for Liverpool."

Also Pep: "No, I'm never changing my overall approach to a game."

So the only 2 ways I see us winning vs Liverpool is either they have a poor game, or they get a player sent off, or we get an offside goal incorrectly allowed etc. All depends on random luck rather than what we can do strategically it seems.
 
ak93city said:
Pep: "I know the way we play is perfect for Liverpool."

Also Pep: "No, I'm never changing my overall approach to a game."

So the only 2 ways I see us winning vs Liverpool is either they have a poor game, or they get a player sent off, or we get an offside goal incorrectly allowed etc. All depends on random luck rather than what we can do strategically it seems.
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I think we needed to be a bit more direct. It seems to me Liverpool allow you to play it around a bit and edge closer with each pass then pounce. I just thought we needed to try longer balls through the middle. Maybe let Ederson launch a few long balls for Gabby to run onto. Short corners? What happened to them? I just think we were poor but Pep didn’t try to change it enough. You could have hooked any player at half time.
 
aguerrrroooooooooooo said:
Before I start I want to state I am a Pep fan and think he's doing a great job for us, I hope he stays for as long as possible. However this is something that has been on my mind for a while. We have had what I'd consider 4 big away games (Barca, Monaco, Napoli and Liverpool) in Europe under pep and have conceded a staggering 12 goals in those games, an average of 3 goals per game.
At home we are a different animal and haven't lost a big European game at home under him.
We seem to have an approach which doesn't differ from at home and seems to be far too costly against good opposition when we travel away, do you think it would be of benefit to perhaps a slightly more cautious approach away in Europe?
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Yes, There is following your ethos and own style and there is stubornness to the point of detriment. I see he wants us to bulldoze down this sticking point away in Europe but you do not have to be attack attack attack all game. Like others have said just soak up the Liverpool press for the first 30m. You do that then 90% of teams have a chance against them as they run out of steam, heads drop a bit. Meanwhile we are still fresh mentally and can start our game then with them questioning themselves.

Doing that imo does not contact Peps style at all.
 
ak93city said:
Pep: "I know the way we play is perfect for Liverpool."

Also Pep: "No, I'm never changing my overall approach to a game."

So the only 2 ways I see us winning vs Liverpool is either they have a poor game, or they get a player sent off, or we get an offside goal incorrectly allowed etc. All depends on random luck rather than what we can do strategically it seems.
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Or our players cut of silly mistakes and the officials do their jobs properly.
 
TCIB said:
Yes, There is following your ethos and own style and there is stubornness to the point of detriment. I see he wants us to bulldoze down this sticking point away in Europe but you do not have to be attack attack attack all game. Like others have said just soak up the Liverpool press for the first 30m. You do that then 90% of teams have a chance against them as they run out of steam, heads drop a bit. Meanwhile we are still fresh mentally and can start our game then with them questioning themselves.

Doing that imo does not contact Peps style at all.
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Precisely. Last season against Barcelona we did this perfectly and quite frankly murdered them.
Had we played a similar system last night I have no doubt we would not be 3 goals down, we might not have won but I thoroughly believe we'd have been in this tie
 
pep believes in the way he prepares the team ,he has said it time and time again he will not change ,his record speaks for itself , cut out stupid balls that leave us open to the counter attack and there's no problem.

I actually believe he was pragmatic( his version) last night and that was the problem, gunda for sterling.

I sound a bit different to last nights posts :)
 
Yesterday cried out for Laporte and DeBruyne long diagonal crosses over Liverpools press to our pacey wingers/lone striker. We were dumb not to try. Not sure if Pep will ever change his style but he needs to as other managers will copy Klopp and he's shown you don't need great players to do it!
 
aguerrrroooooooooooo said:
Well until we can beat some of Europe's best at the high press through passing through their team and eradicating mistakes we will not win the champions league
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Honestly I think it'll be 5-10 years before we win the champions league. The Silva, Kompany generation just can't get past that mental fragility. It'll take a new spine to the team.

I don't rate that as a huge criticism though, it takes a long time to build pedigree in that competition.

If we make the final 8 year after year that's something to be proud of.
 
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