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Religion
- Thread starter idahoblues
- Start date
Cheers. For me its quite simple. Am just witnessing @tonea2003 slowly losing a fight with him/herself without him/her realising that this is what is actually happening, let aloneYou keep digging away but offer none of your beliefs in return. If I was @arfurclue I'd have fucked you off several pages back.
how this might be coming about or how they he/her might find a way through it. In this sense, I'm not really doing anything all, save sharing a few words from I have experienced
Cheers. For me its quite simple. Am just witnessing @tonea2003 slowly losing a fight with him/herself without him/her realising that this is what is actually happening, let alone
how this might be coming about or how they he/her might find a way through it. In this sense, I'm not really doing anything all, save sharing a few words from I have experienced
i'd love to know what fight i'm having so at least i could determine whether i losing or not
St.Pauli support
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- 17 Feb 2010
- Messages
- 5,839
Wonderful. It seems on this thread I am the devil incarnate for suggesting that there is an unconditional love within each being that has written - whether they like it or are aware of it or not. By unconditional love I mean more a Love that is 'before' the conditioning (beliefs/theories/cultural identity etc) of the mind - rather than a mind that is unaware of this and then tries to love 'unconditionally'...according to what its conditioning says is love. That might not be so much fun. So a mind that allows itself to be a 'servant' of this Love and thus allows its thoughts to come more into alignment, letting go of false ideals...perhaps little by little... moment by moment. That might describe what I have experienced along with a few battles and tantrums along the way. And the funny thing is, we might sit here creating the conditions of intellectual war between us yet this love - being 'before' these conditions - will not be at all affected just perhaps unknown for a little while longer, gently waiting for an invitation...
Does such an unconditional love have a biological function? Which one?
What's the source, divine or evolutionary?
Does it exist only in humans or generally in any living organism?
Does such an unconditional love have a biological function? Which one?
What's the source, divine or evolutionary?
Does it exist only in humans or generally in any living organism?
be careful mate you might get called a **** for asking questions :-)
yep
Well-Known Member
This judgement is of no value without adequate and sufficient reasons , i.e proof, or it is just your belief!and that is the same how?
one is between 2 real people and one is between one real person and one we have no idea if is real
feelymcfeel
Well-Known Member
and that is the same how?
one is between 2 real people and one is between one real person and one we have no idea if is real
A religious relationship is more like an abusive one.
"I'm only doing this because I love you"
"You brought this on yourself"
"Don't love anyone else"
"If you don't love me I'll punish you"
"I know what's best for you"
etc. etc.
Mad Eyed Screamer
Moderator
How do I join?The Wee Free’s Presbyterian are our version of the psychos. They hate everything, totally bigoted and full of hate. They abhor the drink, sex, homosexuality, catholics, Muslims, in fact every other **** not in their cult.
They’re a right laugh.
yep
Well-Known Member
Based on experience, I presume, otherwise pure supposition!A religious relationship is more like an abusive one.
"I'm only doing this because I love you"
"You brought this on yourself"
"Don't love anyone else"
"If you don't love me I'll punish you"
"I know what's best for you"
etc. etc.
Mad Eyed Screamer
Moderator
Wow crazy!Lancaster County, where the Amish live, is dry. Did manage to find a crate of Stella in a beer shop 20 odd miles away though. Was a nice evening, sitting on a porch, in a rocking chair, in Intercourse, supping from a bottle whilst the Amish drove their carriages down the main street.
Was in Idaho in August and due to the Mormon nature of the place drinking beer is frowned upon. There was a liquor store and 1 pub in Preston, where I was based. They also sold beer in the local supermarkets but it was buried in the far corner in a special room. My Uncle and Auntie are both Mormon and were quite happy to let me drink in their house until a few of their friends came round for dinner. I was asked politely not to drink when they were about. Their house, their rules so i went along with it. Funny lot the Mormons. The lady in the liquor store said they still come in her store but via the back door. Double standards. Went to a rodeo which was dry. A little weird. You could also buy wine from the garage.
Other parts of Idaho, specifically where @idahoblues lives, has bars a plenty. It's still a Mormon area though.
My Uncle has a lot of weird ideas. The world is only 4000 years old. Dinosaurs and Man existed at the same time. Dragons existed as well. Jesus visited the US in his lifetime, all of the UK are of Jewish decent, the Arc of the Covenant is buried in a facility in Northern Ireland but the British government won't let anyone see it...it goes on and on.
Whilst travelling around Yellowstone Park he would see a sign saying "Yellowstone has had native Americans living in it for over 11000 years" and point out how wrong it was, even to the park rangers who looked quite bemused. The same thing happened in Craters of the Moon. Absolute belief in his and the Mormons stance about the world being 4000 years old.
We went to their church on one Sunday, just to see what was what. very very different. No crosses for one. Men take the main jobs as women don't understand/ or know the finer details about the religion and so are expected to do the family stuff, bringing up kids, looking after the home etc etc. My missus bit her tongue a few times. Still, they had a great ethic about looking after their neighbours/ friends etc. When my uncle moved to the area 20 people turned up to help them move in. A nice touch.
When I moved to Boston 7 years ago, the small town I lived in outside Boston was dry except for 4 liquor stores. Supermarkets couldn't sell beer or wines.
There were 2 restaurants where you could have alcohol only if you had a meal. Other eateries were dry.
i wrote a letter to the local paper that was published saying how much revenue the town is losing when everyone from the town has to go to neighbouring towns for a night out and also missing out on visitors coming into the town at night and spending money.
This was a Wesley influenced town from centuries ago.
A year later they allowed one of the restaurants that could serve beer to have a separate bar area for people just wanting a drink and then they allowed a pub to open! Heady days!
Scottyboi
Well-Known Member
Wow crazy!
When I moved to Boston 7 years ago, the small town I lived in outside Boston was dry except for 4 liquor stores. Supermarkets couldn't sell beer or wines.
There were 2 restaurants where you could have alcohol only if you had a meal. Other eateries were dry.
i wrote a letter to the local paper that was published saying how much revenue the town is losing when everyone from the town has to go to neighbouring towns for a night out and also missing out on visitors coming into the town at night and spending money.
This was a Wesley influenced town from centuries ago.
A year later they allowed one of the restaurants that could serve beer to have a separate bar area for people just wanting a drink and then they allowed a pub to open! Heady days!
Imagine you was the one who opened the pub be wiping your arse with 50s.
This judgement is of no value without adequate and sufficient reasons , i.e proof, or it is just your belief!
the first part, the second or both?
the first part i think you would agree is pretty much sound
the second part one half is sound(the human) the other half the burden of proof is not on me, i have no idea whether it is real or not, but i am willing to listen to someone who thinks they do
Ok. Will have a go at answering the best I can. It may not directly answer your questions but may give you a feel for where I am coming from, for now.Does such an unconditional love have a biological function? Which one?
What's the source, divine or evolutionary?
Does it exist only in humans or generally in any living organism?
There might be said to be a kind of 'love' that is only of arfur. In this way I might see my love as better than some other people's love and worse than others. By nature
this love might be said to be limited.
Then there might be said to be a Love that can be expressed through arfur but is not of him. This Love is of our shared essence. Some might call this divine, infinite and a Love
in which all conditions exist - nothing outside of it.
For me it might be said that I see my relationship with the latter Love as one that has two aspects to it. One might be called the horizontal plane and is where I try to allow this Love into more aspects/areas of my life. The second might be called the vertical plane and is a felt deepening of the experience. I am still learning to open to this and at times I can only go so far until, frankly, I get scared and run back to the mind. So some of the questions asked are still beyond my own known direct experience - I could only point to some folk I respect and say that 'here is an answer they might suggest.'
Beyond that, part of my journey has been trying to come to terms with the notion that my intellect cannot understand - and thus control - this deeper Love but I can slowly allow it to be of service to this Love. Again this too is an ongoing process - areas where perhaps I would still rather trust 'cleverness' over wisdom. In this way too it comes to feel that it is not so much that there is one thought model/ideology/that is 'the best' as such, more that there can be a way of thought that best helps each being open to this Love, in each moment. For each being this might be different, indeed it might be that the model that is best suited to each being changes over time.
Your own true nature. If you do not know seemingly even the slightest of what I speak of then is it fair enough to suggest that you might be in a state of resistance?i'd love to know what fight i'm having so at least i could determine whether i losing or not
Or another way of putting this is saying that you are fighting against the awareness of your being that is Love. Is quite funny, no? Especially when one realises
that the clever arguments we use in order to 'win' are actually the same arguments with which we lose the Presence of Inner Love. Not so intelligent after all perhaps?
Working so hard to avoid remembering our own joyous nature is maybe also a bit nuts?
yep
Well-Known Member
It is a relationship not a set of rules.If you are seeking then it will be your relationship.It is up to the "hound of heaven".the first part, the second or both?
the first part i think you would agree is pretty much sound
the second part one half is sound(the human) the other half the burden of proof is not on me, i have no idea whether it is real or not, but i am willing to listen to someone who thinks they do
Magicpole
Well-Known Member
How do I join?
Send me your CV of you’re intolerances and I will see if you’re deranged enough.
They have a high bar so don’t get your hopes up.
I’m a right **** and they never took me.
Your own true nature. If you do not know seemingly even the slightest of what I speak of then is it fair enough to suggest that you might be in a state of resistance?
Or another way of putting this is saying that you are fighting against the awareness of your being that is Love. Is quite funny, no? Especially when one realises
that the clever arguments we use in order to 'win' are actually the same arguments with which we lose the Presence of Inner Love. Not so intelligent after all perhaps?
Working so hard to avoid remembering our own joyous nature is maybe also a bit nuts?
i've worked quite hard to stay with you mate, but i think you may have me here
i not resisting, i'm not arguing, how can i if you won't answer or certainly not in a language one can understand
It is a relationship not a set of rules.If you are seeking then it will be your relationship.It is up to the "hound of heaven".
what is not a set of rules? who said anything about rules
i've worked quite hard to stay with you mate, but i think you may have me here
i not resisting, i'm not arguing, how can i if you won't answer or certainly not in a language one can understand
Ok. Would it be fair to say that you are wanting me to make 'my language' more understandable to you? What if I can't - solely for the reason
that it's not meant to be? What I am pointing at is the idea that as, and if, you are willing to open to that which is within, then you will
find your own 'language' that best suits you in this moment. In this way, might it be the case that instead of trying to understand my language
and either being unable to do so and thus dismissing it, or being able to understand but only to the point of just repeating it parrot fashion - instead you have
a relationship with this language with brings an inner, felt, intuitive understanding with 'aha!' moments, epiphanies if you want. The latter feels
more enjoyable for me - what about you?
So what language for you? I don't know. Some try yoga, martial arts, painting, poetry and/or dance. Some might look at a hindu jnana/neti neti approach,
others taoism, mystic christianity or zen. Some might go for a more secular way of mindfulness, the science of consciousness, the study of presence and/or philosophy.
Others have been known to use tea ceremonies, flower arranging, intimate relations or even walking around in circles so as to recognise the essence of each practice
as the same thing. Maybe a mixture of the above or even none of them. I don't know but, from experience, it would seem that finding one's own language goes hand in hand with the willingness to open.
How to choose - again I can't stay for sure...it might take trying a bit of this or a bit of that - if you want - until somehow you find a language that 'just feels right.' Or maybe a teacher or a fellow student of this language will come your way. Have you ever met someone and for some 'unknown reason,' it is like there is something about them... maybe they feel kindhearted, maybe there is a light in their eyes, or a way of moving or even just they remind you of something inside? But again coming to know and trust these decisions could be said to be part of the process. If you choose to go with this or this has been at all helpful, then great. If not, well I gave it a go the best I can, as honestly as I can - and that brings a sense of peace inside. Cheers.
whp.blue
Well-Known Member
Thank you. The original post deserved nothing less.a cultured reaction no doubt.