The Conservative Party

Ancient Citizen said:
The Conservatives, in the last election, received more votes from the electorate than Labour.
I think it's also the most votes for any party in history, but haven't checked, no doubt someone will.
https://www.bbc.com/news/election/2017/results
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Total votes is a very binary measure. It doesn't factor in the growth in voting population, turnout issues or any regional splits etc. Vote share is a better measure but then that doesn't account for turn out. All sorts of ways at looking at the results - the number of seats is what counts but even that is far from perfect when you look at how many seats the SNP get given the amount votes etc.
 
Gaudion M said:
Total votes is a very binary measure. It doesn't factor in the growth in voting population, turnout issues or any regional splits etc. Vote share is a better measure but then that doesn't account for turn out. All sorts of ways at looking at the results - the number of seats is what counts but even that is far from perfect when you look at how many seats the SNP get given the amount votes etc.
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I agree, I was merely quoting a factual event, but your analysis is correct.
The only thing I'm against is PR, which I've mentioned, but that was killed off decisively with the AV referendum.
(yes,I know it's not exactly the same, but it was viewed as such, and flopped badly).
 
Just got home and listened to her speech. I see she’s as deluded and vile in resignation as she was during term. Her failures as Home Secretary and PM will take a monumental effort to surpass, although if Bungle gets the nod anything is possible.
 
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Bad day for the country. May's exit is bound to bring in someone far worse than her. I hope the Labour 'centrists' who voted down her centrist deal are happy with themselves when the country is being run by someone with the same values as Ebeneezer Scrooge, proposing a far worse deal that crashes our economy, eschewing the Taylor Review reforms on workers' rights, slashing the £20billion that was promised to the NHS, and back to allowing energy companies rip off the most vulnerable in society (more than they already do now).
 
Bigga said:
When she had short hair, not grey and not the 'witch' look as Home Sec!

I'm on drugs at the moment, though...
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Urrrgghhh?!!
Not for me Bigga, and I'm surprised at your barely concealed lust, considering the wondrous arses you used to
put up. Are they banned from on here now by the way?
 
Proud to serve your 'country'?
No you didn't Mavis, you put your party first above your country.
And as for claiming some kind of credit over action post Grenfell. Jesus wept.
No sympathy for her.
 
TheRemainsOfTheDave said:
In your opinion she should have gone but democracy is about the sum of everyone's opinion, not just those that disagree, alongside the rules that are in place. From outside the Tories, there's next to nothing you can do. And even if you could, the alternative options were not very appealing (judging by the votes cast in the GE). From inside the Tories you can launch a challenge, but no-one did. Therefore her position was legitimate.

I'm no Tory by the way, voted Labour all my life (but won't next time).
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What I’ve been particularly surprised by is the lack of noise about the democratic will of the Conservative party MPs last December being undermined because people have changed their minds. Not only that, but they’ve rewritten their own rules because it stopped them doing what they wanted.
But to suggest ‘normal’ people MIGHT have changed their minds brings accusations of being anti-democratic and traitors.
We are living through very interesting times......
 
Scottyboi said:
How would a general election help right now? I don't see huge support for Labour whilst Jezza is in charge, it will just be the same outcome as last time. If anyone can convince me otherwise then I am all for it, but it looks like a waste of time and money right now.
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Politicians should look at GE's, mid term, as a last resort - the general public expects politicians to get on with the job and the idea that they can't so they must have a GE just confirms that they are collectively incapable. I'd like to see an election limit on candidates and that way, assuming you could only stand / serve 3 or 4 times they would think long and hard about calling a vote.

There is very clear scope for massive reform - I'd have some other system than FPP. I quite like the Australian system:- List candidates in order of preference, 1st choices are counted and seat awarded if a candidate has 51% or more, if not the lowest supported candidate drops out and the first votes for them replaced with the 2nd pref on there ballots.

This system limits tactical voting so you can vote for a small party knowing that your 2nd pref will probably be used. It means the voters outside the main 2 candidates / parties tend to decide the winner on there 2nd votes. In theory it further encourages moderate politics.

The Aussy system also has compulsory voting and fines but I'm not that keen on that. At the end of the day some people can't be arsed and forcing them to vote is only likely to increase the number of votes for bad / unsuitable candidates. I would prefer voting at 16 and education and voluntary voter registration in schools. All kids should leave school having been taught how our system works and how to register themselves on the role.
 
TheRemainsOfTheDave said:
In your opinion she should have gone but democracy is about the sum of everyone's opinion, not just those that disagree, alongside the rules that are in place. From outside the Tories, there's next to nothing you can do. And even if you could, the alternative options were not very appealing (judging by the votes cast in the GE). From inside the Tories you can launch a challenge, but no-one did. Therefore her position was legitimate.

I'm no Tory by the way, voted Labour all my life (but won't next time).
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This is dancing on the head of a pin stuff.

May legitimately headed a majority government until the 2017 election, then she legitimately headed a minority government until she legitimately resigned and her successor, elected by Tory members, will legitimately be Prime Minister.

Seems legitimate is what ever those in power say it is, which of course is a nonsense.

Every Prime Minister who holds office as May did, seeks the endorsement of the electorate, to return the government they head with an outright majority, without it there is always an asterisk against their legitimacy.

You can deny it if you want but that is the political reality of it.
 
Everyone saying you vote for an MP not a PM, do you really believe after this debacle some of the present sitting MPs have the confidence of their constituncy(no matter the party) or if god forbid mcvey of johnson get in some people wouldn't have voted differently locally in marginals to keep either of them from No10 if they were leader at the last GE?
 
The Light Was Yellow Sir said:
What I’ve been particularly surprised by is the lack of noise about the democratic will of the Conservative party MPs last December being undermined because people have changed their minds. Not only that, but they’ve rewritten their own rules because it stopped them doing what they wanted.
But to suggest ‘normal’ people MIGHT have changed their minds brings accusations of being anti-democratic and traitors.
We are living through very interesting times......
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Notwithstanding the committed brexiteers taking different views on what brexit is. If Gove, Leadsome and Fox can vote for one brexit yet Boris, IDS and JRM describe it as being a vassal state then what exactly was the 51% majority a mandate for....
 
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The perfect fumble said:
Look on my works, ye Mighty, and despair!

as-comp-tory-leadership.jpg


Nothing beside remains: round the decay
Of that colossal wreck, boundless and bare,
The lone and level sands stretch far away.
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More like this

55875404_813128805717784_2321236773297979392_n.jpg
 
urban genie said:
Everyone saying you vote for an MP not a PM, do you really believe after this debacle some of the present sitting MPs have the confidence of their constituncy(no matter the party) or if god forbid mcvey of johnson get in some people wouldn't have voted differently locally in marginals to keep either of them from No10 if they were leader at the last GE?
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If Boris wins this on a hard brexit ticket - what mandate does he have to progress on that basis? He will have less than 100k Con member votes for him, almost all from middle / southeast England. A party with no majority. A brexit referendum result from over 3 years ago where he himself described a brexit that involved a free trade deal.

What will get him the role of PM has no change of getting through the HoC and quite rightly. Being the snake he is I suspect he knows this and I do wonder if he might have some sneaky plan. Ultimately a hard brexit v remain 2nd ref would surely kill it off and leave Boris where Cameron thought he would be PM and leader of the Cons with brexit put to bed...
 
Ancient Citizen said:
Urrrgghhh?!!
Not for me Bigga, and I'm surprised at your barely concealed lust, considering the wondrous arses you used to
put up. Are they banned from on here now by the way?
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This site became a travesty when we weren't allowed to explore such features again!

As for my taste, it's quite eclectic! I never know myself, what'll do it for me!!
 
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