The Labour Party

[Rascal]

I like him,he reminds me of the tramp Michael foot

The power of propaganda.

 

[bronco]

Don't think I've ever seen anyone on here come across as arrogant as you do.

Really ? Perhaps you need to pay more attention ?? Personally I would take arrogance over ignorance any day of the week !!

 

[bronco]

And here we see a fine example of the persuasive hard-lneft representative seeking to secure votes for Labour in action

Not really , just frustrated when we all have facts at our fingertips, yet most still choose to swallow mainstream media BS without question .

 

[Rascal]

Whilst we don’t agree on Brexit, I do agree with large parts of what is a very thoughtful post imo. How the Tory party still manages to lead current opinion polls is simply astonishing. I don’t think JC is a good leader but would rather see him as PM than absolute complete and utter c**ts Johnson and Hunt.

Thanks for that, its nice that a thoughtful post is acknowledged.

Why don't we agree on Brexit btw? I don't hold a particular position as the debate currently stands

 

[Cheesy]

Really ? Perhaps you need to pay more attention ?? Personally I would take arrogance over ignorance any day of the week !!

Fucking hell, I've just laughed out loud.

If ever there was a post proving a point that was it :-D

 

[Saddleworth2]

Thanks for that, its nice that a thoughtful post is acknowledged.

Why don't we agree on Brexit btw? I don't hold a particular position as the debate currently stands

Because I believe there is no ‘good’ Brexit and I took from your post you may support a Light Brexit ‘Lexit’. Maybe I am misunderstanding though. Apologies if I did.

 

[Rascal]

Because I believe there is no ‘good’ Brexit and I took from your post you may support a Light Brexit ‘Lexit’. Maybe I am misunderstanding though. Apologies if I did.

No problem pal, I am certain a right wing led Brexit will not be in the interests of the working class, I am against that, I would countenance a LEXIT option, but am not totally convinced, nor am I convinced the status quo remain is any better than any Brexit option. My preferred option was not on the ballot paper such was the mindless idiocy of those who set the referendum. A referendum designed for one purpose and one alone, which was to keep Cameron in power by sating the appetites of the hard right factions in that party. First and foremost though I am a believer in democracy and whichever way it is dressed up, I do think the vote should be respected, despite my preferred option being further away than ever. For the record, my preferred option is a fully federal EU with a democratically elected President run on similar lines structurally to the USA. I acknowledge my view is a minority one, it will be dismissed as being globalist or some loon will invoke the Kalergi plan or Protocols of Zion to try and make it look unworkable, but so be it, the EU has a strong Social Democrat tradition and it could be built upon to create a Socialist EU. I know the thought of that will horrify those who believe in British exceptionalism and the nation state, but I don't care, I believe in equality of opportunity and have faith in humanity, not the unfettered ills of a rampant free market capitalist state.

 

[smudgedj]

Tom’s going to ‘break up’ Amazon.

 

[The perfect fumble]

Tom’s going to ‘break up’ Amazon.

Tom's triangulating for shits and giggles.

The politics of triangulation is the ace in the hole for third wayers, they love it, and it confuses the hell out of anyone gullible enough to take it seriously

There's one thing I can guarantee, if Labour win the next election, he'll be off to the back benches faster than a very fast thing.

 

[Saddleworth2]

No problem pal, I am certain a right wing led Brexit will not be in the interests of the working class, I am against that, I would countenance a LEXIT option, but am not totally convinced, nor am I convinced the status quo remain is any better than any Brexit option. My preferred option was not on the ballot paper such was the mindless idiocy of those who set the referendum. A referendum designed for one purpose and one alone, which was to keep Cameron in power by sating the appetites of the hard right factions in that party. First and foremost though I am a believer in democracy and whichever way it is dressed up, I do think the vote should be respected, despite my preferred option being further away than ever. For the record, my preferred option is a fully federal EU with a democratically elected President run on similar lines structurally to the USA. I acknowledge my view is a minority one, it will be dismissed as being globalist or some loon will invoke the Kalergi plan or Protocols of Zion to try and make it look unworkable, but so be it, the EU has a strong Social Democrat tradition and it could be built upon to create a Socialist EU. I know the thought of that will horrify those who believe in British exceptionalism and the nation state, but I don't care, I believe in equality of opportunity and have faith in humanity, not the unfettered ills of a rampant free market capitalist state.

I would far rather have a federal EU than a right wing Tory government that harms those of its citizens that most need protection. My (unpopular) view is that the referendum was corrupted to the extent the result should have been set aside. Indeed if it had been a binding referendum that is exactly what would have happened. Most of the problems the U.K. has in terms of social inequality are entirely of our own making and nothing to do with the EU which in my view (whilst imperfect) has mainly been a force for good. If we carry on down this path we will have a Tory/Brexit party coalition government and a breakup of the U.K. within 3 years. If Labour doesn’t quickly get its act together it will continue to hemorrahge votes to Lib Dem’s and Greens and let the Tories in again.

 

[George Hannah]

Tom’s going to ‘break up’ Amazon.

He'll stop them selling Jezzer's instruction manual

 

[Rascal]

I would far rather have a federal EU than a right wing Tory government that harms those of its citizens that most need protection. My (unpopular) view is that the referendum was corrupted to the extent the result should have been set aside. Indeed if it had been a binding referendum that is exactly what would have happened. Most of the problems the U.K. has in terms of social inequality are entirely of our own making and nothing to do with the EU which in my view (whilst imperfect) has mainly been a force for good. If we carry on down this path we will have a Tory/Brexit party coalition government and a breakup of the U.K. within 3 years. If Labour doesn’t quickly get its act together it will continue to hemorrahge votes to Lib Dem’s and Greens and let the Tories in again.

I cant argue with this mate, it just strikes me that it is a real shame for democracy when you have to vote or support the least worst option.

Brexit has sucked the life out of politics, considering it wasn't that much of an issue in peoples minds before the referendum was called it has certainly damaged for good or for ill the nature of politics in this nation.

The real issues the nation faces have become secondary and I believe a case could be made that the calling of a referendum was actually a cover for the policies that have had imho a real negative effect on society. People have become so entrenched in Brexit, its allowed the government to do virtually nothing about anything else. We are a nation in limbo, waiting for the finale. Everything is viewed through the Brexit prism and I am not surprised at all that it suits some to prolong the outcome. It is perfect cover for restructuring the state into a far more laisez faire society. Each and every time the Labour party has called for a GE it is rounded upon as being unimportant, but it is what we need and we need it quickly. Its a ridiculous state of affairs that a minority government backed by an extremist sect like the DUP are calling the shots and riding roughshod over parliament. Thank fuck Bercow is trying to keep the primacy of Parliament intact.

Leave or remain, I am certain that in 100 years time Historians will look back on this period of UK politics and conclude the nation was on crack cocaine.

 

[Saddleworth2]

I cant argue with this mate, it just strikes me that it is a real shame for democracy when you have to vote or support the least worst option.

Brexit has sucked the life out of politics, considering it wasn't that much of an issue in peoples minds before the referendum was called it has certainly damaged for good or for ill the nature of politics in this nation.

The real issues the nation faces have become secondary and I believe a case could be made that the calling of a referendum was actually a cover for the policies that have had imho a real negative effect on society. People have become so entrenched in Brexit, its allowed the government to do virtually nothing about anything else. We are a nation in limbo, waiting for the finale. Everything is viewed through the Brexit prism and I am not surprised at all that it suits some to prolong the outcome. It is perfect cover for restructuring the state into a far more laisez faire society. Each and every time the Labour party has called for a GE it is rounded upon as being unimportant, but it is what we need and we need it quickly. Its a ridiculous state of affairs that a minority government backed by an extremist sect like the DUP are calling the shots and riding roughshod over parliament. Thank fuck Bercow is trying to keep the primacy of Parliament intact.

Leave or remain, I am certain that in 100 years time Historians will look back on this period of UK politics and conclude the nation was on crack cocaine.

Again, a very unpopular view on here but I genuinely believe that years of an austerity government and a general growing divide between politicians and their constituencies caused a massive protest vote as part of the referendum. Of course many voted to leave because they had genuine concerns about the EU but many didn’t, they voted to poke the government and call me Dave hard in the eye. The fact that there were multiple versions of leave exacerbated the situation. Everything is paralysed whilst this plays out, and this at a time when the UN report that the U.K. have a very serious poverty issue that is being exacerbated by the roll out of universal credit. The current government are in complete denial about the problems the country face
Poverty, the health service, education, knife crime, inward investment, the inequality between English regions and London. A general election is needed but I would not be optimistic about the outcome.

 

[Rascal]

Again, a very unpopular view on here but I genuinely believe that years of an austerity government and a general growing divide between politicians and their constituencies caused a massive protest vote as part of the referendum. Of course many voted to leave because they had genuine concerns about the EU but many didn’t, they voted to poke the government and call me Dave hard in the eye. The fact that there were multiple versions of leave exacerbated the situation. Everything is paralysed whilst this plays out, and this at a time when the UN report that the U.K. have a very serious poverty issue that is being exacerbated by the roll out of universal credit. The current government are in complete denial about the problems the country face
Poverty, the health service, education, knife crime, inward investment, the inequality between English regions and London. A general election is needed but I would not be optimistic about the outcome.

Not unpopular with me, the vote was framed as between leave and remain, although remain was in fact status quo. In that instance only leave offered change, remain (status quo) offered nothing new but more of the same. In desperation people voted for change, I don't blame anyone for that, life is hard and austerity made it untenable for many. Leave offered hope, maybe a romantic version of hope, but hope nonetheless.

 

[Ancient Citizen]

Apparently,Labour's poll rating of 18% is the lowest ever for an opposition, Corbyn's ratings are minus 58%,
the worst in history for an opposition leader.The 'Oh, Jeremy Corbyn' chants were very sparse at Glasto,
only 43% who voted Labour would do so again, and the membership is declining, all only polls of course, but
even so, it's some fall. The Tories, believe it or not climbed 1 point above Brexit, Labour is 4th in the list behind
the Libs. Then, there are apparently only 25% of remainers who would back Labour, most have obviously switched to the Libs,
leavers backing Labour, unsurprisingly are at just 8%.
Anyone got any thoughts on a GE result, if there is one?

 

[Saddleworth2]

Not unpopular with me, the vote was framed as between leave and remain, although remain was in fact status quo. In that instance only leave offered change, remain (status quo) offered nothing new but more of the same. In desperation people voted for change, I don't blame anyone for that, life is hard and austerity made it untenable for many. Leave offered hope, maybe a romantic version of hope, but hope nonetheless.

'The miserable have no other medicine, but only hope'
(William Shakespeare/Measure for measure)

 

[Metal Biker]

Apparently,Labour's poll rating of 18% is the lowest ever for an opposition, Corbyn's ratings are minus 58%,
the worst in history for an opposition leader.The 'Oh, Jeremy Corbyn' chants were very sparse at Glasto,
only 43% who voted Labour would do so again, and the membership is declining, all only polls of course, but
even so, it's some fall. The Tories, believe it or not climbed 1 point above Brexit, Labour is 4th in the list behind
the Libs. Then, there are apparently only 25% of remainers who would back Labour, most have obviously switched to the Libs,
leavers backing Labour, unsurprisingly are at just 8%.
Anyone got any thoughts on a GE result, if there is one?

Con 'win', coalition with the Lib Dems or Brexit Party to form a Government.

 

[Ancient Citizen]

Con 'win', coalition with the Lib Dems or Brexit Party to form a Government.

Con win with Brexit in tow for me, don't forget, the Libs have literally trashed any chance of getting any
leaver votes, the BP will get their's from the Cons mostly, but also more than a few from Labour.
I'd go with the Libs as runners up though, with far more seats than they've ever had.

 

[George Hannah]

For the record, my preferred option is a fully federal EU with a democratically elected President run on similar lines structurally to the USA.... the EU has a strong Social Democrat tradition and it could be built upon to create a Socialist EU..

Despite their rise being checked in some countries at the last EU elections the right wing parties of Gauland, Le Penn, Salvini, Strache, Ortega Smith, Orban, Akesson, Hallaho, Helme, Janez etc etc make a Federal Republic of Europe less likely to resemble the Soviet Union than the Third Reich.

 

[Rascal]

Despite their rise being checked in some countries at the last EU elections the right wing parties of Gauland, Le Penn, Salvini, Strache, Ortega Smith, Orban, Akesson, Hallaho, Helme, Janez etc etc make a Federal Republic of Europe less likely to resemble the Soviet Union than the Third Reich.

What are you wittering on about with Soviet Union and Third Reich?