Another new Brexit thread

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

You mean when the U.K. Govt negotiated a legal means to leave the EU and thereby fulfill the mandate of the referendum and Brexit MPs went full Pol Pot, shat all over it and declared that the North Korean model not Norway was now their preferred option on Brexit?

Personally I think Parliament now has a duty to the country to fuck Brexit off. Brexiteers had their chance, didn’t take it so they can fuck off. Preferably to North Korea.

This is probably not a realistic option. You make a good point about a means to leave the EU having been negotiated but it seemed sadly to be so poor as to be unacceptable to both leave and remain people. This is interpreted by Remainers as signifying that we have no sensible option other than to remain, and by brexiteers as we have no other option than no deal. Both positions have their merits, but of course the 'deal' was not the issue of the referendum, and although it of course is worthy of debate, to reframe the debate as being dependent upon the nature of the deal is to deny the referendum result. One of the things I most admire in the remain lobby is their success post-referendum in re- framing a binary yes/no in/out question in conditional terms based upon a 'deal'.

 

[Vic]

You make an excellent point, but the fact that (most) remainers do not feel betrayed by the attempt to implement brexit since the vote perhaps casts some light on the dubious manner in which implementation of the referendum result has so far been conducted?

I feel betrayed by the Leaver politicians who promised that even if my side "lost" the vote we'd still be in a free trade zone from Iceland to the Russian border. Yet a lot of Leave voters now say they'd feel betrayed by a deal that wouldn't even offer that. "No deal is better than a bad deal" is a post-vote Leaver invention.

 

[Ancient Citizen]

Yes, it would be much fairer to charge countries more, the worse their economies were doing.

Well, if we manage to quit this club, they'll have no choice, all those presidents need feeding.

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

I feel betrayed by the Leaver politicians who promised that even if my side "lost" the vote we'd still be in a free trade zone from Iceland to the Russian border. Yet a lot of Leave voters now say they'd feel betrayed by a deal that wouldn't even offer that. "No deal is better than a bad deal" is a post-vote Leaver invention.

I can't really help you there as I wasn't aware that any deal was on offer in 2016. Indeed the only one I'm aware of is the deal brokered by Mrs May and rejected by parliament. If there was another deal, then please excuse my ignorance.

 

[hgblue]

Well, if we manage to quit this club, they'll have no choice, all those presidents need feeding.

The booze bill should be dramatically reduced though ;)

 

[George Hannah]

Checked again and nope not feeling the slightest bit betrayed. It’s possible you may be projecting your own feelings onto others. Kindly desist.

Sadly, you have been betrayed twice, by your feelings and your government.

 

[gordondaviesmoustache]

Well, if we manage to quit this club, they'll have no choice, all those presidents need feeding.

I reckon our PM will be the fattest **** of the lot, mate. Good job we'll be self-sufficient in potatoes.

 

[BobKowalski]

This is probably not a realistic option. You make a good point about a means to leave the EU having been negotiated but it seemed sadly to be so poor as to be unacceptable to both leave and remain people. This is interpreted by Remainers as signifying that we have no sensible option other than to remain, and by brexiteers as we have no other option than no deal. Both positions have their merits, but of course the 'deal' was not the issue of the referendum, and although it of course is worthy of debate, to reframe the debate as being dependent upon the nature of the deal is to deny the referendum result. One of the things I most admire in the remain lobby is their success post-referendum in re- framing a binary yes/no in/out question in conditional terms based upon a 'deal'.

The WA may have been sub-optimal but given we had no plan or consensus it was the best we could probably get and on a technical level not a bad effort. The fact is it was a legal mechanism to leave the EU and provided protection to the economy from short term shock. The only reason Brexit MPs blocked it was the realisation that they were being dictated to by a country like Ireland and other, god forbid, Europeans.

The referendum result was delivered by the WA. That Leavers had a hissy fit isn’t anyone’s problem but theirs and I see no reason why the rest of us should tolerate this shitshow when they had their chance to deliver the referendum result and blew it.

Once we sailed past the 29th March leaving date the fight moved on. The fight is now to revoke A50. Brexiteers had their shot. They missed.

 

[BobKowalski]

Sadly, you have been betrayed twice, by your feelings and your government.

But not, thankfully, by my good sense.

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

The WA may have been sub-optimal but given we had no plan or consensus it was the best we could probably get and on a technical level not a bad effort. The fact is it was a legal mechanism to leave the EU and provided protection to the economy from short term shock. The only reason Brexit MPs blocked it was the realisation that they were being dictated to by a country like Ireland and other, god forbid, Europeans.

The referendum result was delivered by the WA. That Leavers had a hissy fit isn’t anyone’s problem but theirs and I see no reason why the rest of us should tolerate this shitshow when they had their chance to deliver the referendum result and blew it.

Once we sailed past the 29th March leaving date the fight moved on. The fight is now to revoke A50. Brexiteers had their shot. They missed.

I can't help but notice you credit brexiteers with having 'had their shot' in March and missed, but seem to suggest Remainers didn't miss theirs in 2016? This shows a lack of critical thinking and analysis and rather just shows you are as entrenched in your view as the most extreme brexiteers. That's fine by the way, but bear in mind you are then expressing a dearly held opinion rather than a fact.

 

[gordondaviesmoustache]

I can't help but notice you credit brexiteers with having 'had their shot' in March and missed, but seem to suggest Remainers didn't miss theirs in 2016?

Best of three?

 

[hgblue]

The WA may have been sub-optimal but given we had no plan or consensus it was the best we could probably get and on a technical level not a bad effort. The fact is it was a legal mechanism to leave the EU and provided protection to the economy from short term shock. The only reason Brexit MPs blocked it was the realisation that they were being dictated to by a country like Ireland and other, god forbid, Europeans.

The referendum result was delivered by the WA. That Leavers had a hissy fit isn’t anyone’s problem but theirs and I see no reason why the rest of us should tolerate this shitshow when they had their chance to deliver the referendum result and blew it.

Once we sailed past the 29th March leaving date the fight moved on. The fight is now to revoke A50. Brexiteers had their shot. They missed.

What do you think happens in the GE that would follow?

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

Best of three?

Indeed, maybe if leavers lost they would start arguing about what type of remain we were promised or voted for ;-)

 

[George Hannah]

But not, thankfully, by my good sense.

This whole grotesque fiasco, starting with Cameron's stupidity in calling a referendum and then the installation of Corbyn, May and now Johnson, needs to be ended with a revocation. For the GE that follows we need a new Excluded Middle Party led by a triumvirate of Rory Stewart, Andrew Neil and David Attenborough.

 

[gordondaviesmoustache]

Indeed, maybe if leavers lost they would start arguing about what type of remain we were promised or voted for ;-)

Lamentably, pretty much everyone lost.

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

Lamentably, pretty much everyone lost.

Or won - depending upon your point of view of course.

 

[gordondaviesmoustache]

Or won - depending upon your point of view of course.

Who the fuck has won out of this sorry fiasco?

 

[Blue Hefner]

Or won - depending upon your point of view of course.

Won what, exactly? Or even what are they likely to win in the next 5 years?

 

[BobKowalski]

I can't help but notice you credit brexiteers with having 'had their shot' in March and missed, but seem to suggest Remainers didn't miss theirs in 2016? This shows a lack of critical thinking and analysis and rather just shows you are as entrenched in your view as the most extreme brexiteers. That's fine by the way, but bear in mind you are then expressing a dearly held opinion rather than a fact.

Remain lost the 2016 referendum. Remainers ‘missing their shot’ would be a fucking understatement. Not sure pointing out the fucking obvious is a lack of critical thinking so much but more about I can’t be arsed to point out the fucking obvious.

Also props for trying but don’t teach your Daddy how to fuck.

 

[BobKowalski]

What do you think happens in the GE that would follow?

A hung Parliament with Labour as the biggest party by a thin margin.