Another new Brexit thread

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George Hannah said:
I specialize in the bizarre, it helps when trying to understand the intricacies of many of this thread's contributors. Please disabuse me of the impression I gained that you feel it is appropriate for the EU to 'pre-empt' a member state's democratic processes.
Sorry, I was musing in the land of SNP dreams.
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This is what you were answering;
↑
Those SNPs want Scotland out of the UK and in the EU but out of the Euro - they want to use Sterling lol
I await them saying no need for a hard border either.

When you made the remark;
George Hannah said: ↑
Guaranteed - we should abandon our own economic and political interest and stay in the EU solely for the benefit of an independent Scotland and the convenience of 27 other countries, especially the Irish and the Germans.

NI are not looking to leave the UK and are your citizens currently and as alluded to above, will need a hard border, which will be a problem concerning prior arrangements you have agreed to, which isn't the same as Scotland.

I understand a lot of the frivolity and flippancy of some of the remarks made on both sides of this coin, but there's a reoccurring theme here when it comes to ignoring the citizens of the North.
 
George Hannah said:
I specialize in the bizarre, it helps when trying to understand the intricacies of many of this thread's contributors. Please disabuse me of the impression I gained that you feel it is appropriate for the EU to 'pre-empt' a member state's democratic processes.
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And again you state something which is not true, and have it spinning violently to suit your own opinion.

The EU side seems to be being run by adults, and be generally coherent in strategy. I think it entirely appropriate from the EU's perspective to take an action if they think it is best for clarity. The Express (as an example) may disagree, but I don't expect the EU to pay more credence to that paper than to the EU's own interests.

If the EU make such an offer next week (as an example), that is surely better than doing so after Johnson's hiatus, or at the 17/10 meeting? It gives more time for people to think about what it might mean.

"Pre-empting a nation's democratic processes" is a bit rich for a country whose PM has just decided to shut down Parliament, and can't even keep the cabinet from contradicting his guff.
 
Bluemanc100 said:
We've already damaged the economy and certainly our reputation with the piss poor handling of Brexit so far. I have always been a realist (pessimist actually) and maybe it's simply wishful thinking but on Brexit I am actually quite hopeful we can make a success of things once out.

I see no option but to be optimistic, the alternative is far to bloody depressing to contemplate.
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Yes but there’s a far longer way to go to trashing our economy than what we’ve so far done and no deal will achieve that.
 
Ban-jani said:
Yes but there’s a far longer way to go to trashing our economy than what we’ve so far done and no deal will achieve that.
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I agree but there's a long way to go before we resort to WTO... I genuinely feel happy it's a threat and people are shit-scared that Boris might take us down that route

I don't think he has any intention of forcing WTO so I think the outcome is down to the EU

There must be a solution for the backstop, it's 2019 FFS , we just need to find it OR get a transitional backstop deal (we can actually exit from) to buy more time.. there's a two year transition period as I understand it but the TM deal gave us an eternity in the backstop with no exit unless the EU opened the door
 
mancity2012_eamo said:
I'd be interested to hear who the small minority of Irish are.
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I retract no one in Ireland needs to stop looking to the past, they don’t need to sort out stormont or grow up, they haven’t used brexit to for their own gain at all.

I was going to give you the DUP as a starter for 10 but you must be overjoyed with all things Irish. Only the English it seems have self interested tits fucking things up.

Carry on as you were.

Cracking thread
 
George Hannah said:
Complete rubbish.
How can “exit day” be changed?
“Exit day” is defined in primary legislation. Changing it would therefore normally require further primary legislation. However the EU (Withdrawal) Act 2018 specifically contemplated the possibility of an extension being sought and granted, and allows exit day’s definition to be changed in those circumstances by secondary legislation.
Section 20(4) allows a Minister of the Crown to change exit day provided that a draft statutory instrument has been laid before and approved by both the House of Commons and the House of Lords. However, it can only be used:
“to ensure that the day and time specified in the definition are the day and time that the Treaties are to cease to apply to the United Kingdom.”
In practice this means that an extension must first have been agreed to at EU level before any such regulations can be made to change the date. As the Government itself said in a written statement on Friday 15 March:
“It is expected that the EU will use the March European Council on the 21 and 22 March 2019 to consider and reach a decision on a request from the UK to extend the Article 50 period.
As soon as possible following agreement at the EU level we will bring forward the necessary legislation to amend the definition of exit day in domestic legislation. This statutory instrument will be laid, before it is made, under section 20(4) of the EU (Withdrawal) Act 2018.
This legislation is subject to the draft affirmative procedure and so would need to be actively approved in each House. The legislation would give effect to any agreement with the EU on an extension, so would not be laid before Parliament until that agreement had been reached.”
https://commonslibrary.parliament.u...onceptions-about-the-extension-of-article-50/
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My apologies. Not much excuse as I am familiar with the Act (quoted it a few times!) but I was in the cinema trying to post during the adverts.

Yes it would need secondary legislation - for which the issue would be needing a minister of the crown to start the ball rolling.
 
MillionMilesAway said:
And again you state something which is not true, and have it spinning violently to suit your own opinion.

The EU side seems to be being run by adults, and be generally coherent in strategy. I think it entirely appropriate from the EU's perspective to take an action if they think it is best for clarity. The Express (as an example) may disagree, but I don't expect the EU to pay more credence to that paper than to the EU's own interests.

If the EU make such an offer next week (as an example), that is surely better than doing so after Johnson's hiatus, or at the 17/10 meeting? It gives more time for people to think about what it might mean.

"Pre-empting a nation's democratic processes" is a bit rich for a country whose PM has just decided to shut down Parliament, and can't even keep the cabinet from contradicting his guff.
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That's the trouble with lies. Remembering what lies you told. Though in this Trumpian and now Johnsonian world it doesn't seem to matter so much.
 
hilts said:
I retract no one in Ireland needs to stop looking to the past, they don’t need to sort out stormont or grow up, they haven’t used brexit to for their own gain at all.

I was going to give you the DUP as a starter for 10 but you must be overjoyed with all things Irish. Only the English it seems have self interested tits fucking things up.

Carry on as you were.

Cracking thread
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No, just saying the minority you talk about doesn't actually support your argument.
The majority perhaps would. However it is the minority that are the loons that you were suggesting. So you can see my confusion.

And as an aside, I would suggest that that majority have been very forward thinking and the GFA was all about the future and ditching the historical notions of both sides.

Still confused though.
 
Bluemanc100 said:
I agree but there's a long way to go before we resort to WTO... I genuinely feel happy it's a threat and people are shit-scared that Boris might take us down that route

I don't think he has any intention of forcing WTO so I think the outcome is down to the EU

There must be a solution for the backstop, it's 2019 FFS , we just need to find it OR get a transitional backstop deal (we can actually exit from) to buy more time.. there's a two year transition period as I understand it but the TM deal gave us an eternity in the backstop with no exit unless the EU opened the door
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The backstop is the transitional solution deal.
 
mancity2012_eamo said:
No, just saying the minority you talk about doesn't actually support your argument.
The majority perhaps would. However it is the minority that are the loons that you were suggesting. So you can see my confusion.

And as an aside, I would suggest that that majority have been very forward thinking and the GFA was all about the future and ditching the historical notions of both sides.

Still confused though.
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Did the forward thinking stop after the GFA?
 
Bluemanc100 said:
I agree but there's a long way to go before we resort to WTO... I genuinely feel happy it's a threat and people are shit-scared that Boris might take us down that route

I don't think he has any intention of forcing WTO so I think the outcome is down to the EU

There must be a solution for the backstop, it's 2019 FFS , we just need to find it OR get a transitional backstop deal (we can actually exit from) to buy more time.. there's a two year transition period as I understand it but the TM deal gave us an eternity in the backstop with no exit unless the EU opened the door
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That's only true if you believe that there isn't a technological solution on the horizon. Is that all bluff or lies?
I'd be quite happy to put the border down the Irish sea. I'm sure there are solutions but you have to look at your own parliament and how you get them passed.
Stop them telling lies for a start and they might be taken seriously.
 
BobKowalski said:
Really so why is he lying about the reasons for prorogation? If it’s in the best interests of the country and all that.
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That's easy

Bringing this to an end is clearly for best interests of the country cannot be disputed no mater whether Remain or Leave
 
hilts said:
Strange action of someone who holds all the cards and wouldn’t mind too much if we sodded off
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It's not even remotely strange.

The EU has been very clear all along that it would like a deal and that a deal would be beneficial for both sides. What they do not want is a deal which is bad for the EU, one which allows the UK to cherry pick the benefits of membership whilst walking away from the responsibilities and obligations. And neither are they as desperate, nor would be as up shit creek as we would be if we don't get one. Hardly surprising when you consider the % of their GDP exported to us, vs the other way around.

It's really not hard to understand this.
 
Vic said:
You've said that almost as often as I've mentioned the deal we were promised. Except I'm talking about fact not opinion.
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No - you are clinging to a single claim made in a campaign in a David and Goliath environment - your repitition means no more than a Leaver pointing out that Cameron and Osborne were clear about Leaving meant exiting the SM and CU

We get it - you prefer to take comfort from somethings said getting in for 4 years

Some of us prefer to look forward
 
Bluemanc100 said:
I agree but there's a long way to go before we resort to WTO... I genuinely feel happy it's a threat and people are shit-scared that Boris might take us down that route

I don't think he has any intention of forcing WTO so I think the outcome is down to the EU

There must be a solution for the backstop, it's 2019 FFS , we just need to find it OR get a transitional backstop deal (we can actually exit from) to buy more time.. there's a two year transition period as I understand it but the TM deal gave us an eternity in the backstop with no exit unless the EU opened the door
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The trouble is if you don’t think Boris will force it, then Brussels won’t either.

I’m still unsure how this is going to play out, I just hope the economy is still intact by the end of it.
 
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