Prorogation - Judgment Day:10.30am Tuesday 24/9/19

M18CTID said:
Bercow made it clear that politicians on all sides should calm their language. Now I'm not defending Johnson's behaviour the other night - in fact, I think he should've resigned in the wake of the Supreme Court judgement the other day - but it appears to me that while his use of words was clumsy, some are trying to twist it as him disrespecting Jo Cox. Firstly, it was a Labour MP who brought up Jo's murder. Secondly, Johnson was responding in relation to that. Thirdly, I read his comment about Jo and "getting Brexit done" as a nod to honouring the public vote, and while Jo was a Remainer she would've respected the vote. Fourthly, Jo's husband - while critical of Johnson's comments - felt that it was sloppy as opposed to anything more sinister, and echoed Bercow's words that politicians on all sides should refrain from using inflammatory words. Fifthly, and despite this request, Jeremy Corbyn then went and used Jo's murder to score points against Johnson.

For me, all sides are as guilty as each other in using inflammatory language and none of them are coming across well at all.
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Very much this.
 
George Hannah said:
In the extremely unlikely event it ever happens, Brexit will be a disaster for the SNP. The fiction that the EU would welcome an independent Scotland will be a fitting inscription for their memorial monument. It's testimony to the good sense of the Scots population that they would never swallow the absurd idea that undoing 300 years of UK integration would benefit their country in any way. Especially when they see what's needed to extricate ourselves from just 40 years' worth of much less complex trading relationships. It's the old story, who else but us would want them? Bit like who else would want the responsibility for solving the intractable issues in NI - for demographic reasons the GFA has ensured a United Ireland is inevitable but there is an increasing reluctance voiced in the Republic for them to take on its consequences.
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Interested to know who you are talking about there George.
The only reluctance I would be aware of is to be forced prematurely into a situation where a referendum on the matter North and South is rushed as some consequence of a Brexit mess, or the likes. Northern Ireland needs to evolve naturally. All things being equal, I would say the Republic would never turn down a United Ireland, regardless of the economics of the undertaking, but also there is a sizeable majority down here that have moved on from the past and would not have people of the North forced undemocratically into such a Union without consideration for their heritage and aspirations of future identity.
 
blueinsa said:
No U.K. mainstream politician is a fascist, not a single one.

All democratically elected, as was Johnson for leader of the party and thus PM in the exact same way Swinson was and Corbyn was and if they held a majority or had been the parties of power now they too would have been PM.

See....not a fascist in sight anywhere.
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Hitler was democratically elected, it’s what one does once they get in power and to say Johnson is abusing his power, would be an understatement.
 
Ban-jani said:
Hitler was democratically elected, it’s what one does once they get in power and to say Johnson is abusing his power, would be an understatement.
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Johnson has no power.

Literally none.

He is a lame duck PM.

He is not a fascist.
 
mancity2012_eamo said:
Interested to know who you are talking about there George.
The only reluctance I would be aware of is to be forced prematurely into a situation where a referendum on the matter North and South is rushed as some consequence of a Brexit mess, or the likes. Northern Ireland needs to evolve naturally. All things being equal, I would say the Republic would never turn down a United Ireland, regardless of the economics of the undertaking, but also there is a sizeable majority down here that have moved on from the past and would not have people of the North forced undemocratically into such a Union without consideration for their heritage and aspirations of future identity.
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This recent article discusses the brutal economic issues being increasingly raised
https://www.irishtimes.com/business...o-northern-ireland-than-brexit-does-1.4016373
 
Ban-jani said:
Hitler was democratically elected, it’s what one does once they get in power and to say Johnson is abusing his power, would be an understatement.
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Not really, it wasn't a legitimate ellection given all the electoral medling. The facist movement of Hitler simply had more than enough defacto control of what happened on the ground level that they could tottally forge it. Besides that Hitler tried a coup d'etât before he tried trough parliament, that beer hall putch in 1923 that landed him in prison.
 
Fascism will arise from outside parliament.

Disaffected voters will rally round people like Robinson and it won't be long before an overtly fascist politician is elected.

It can happen. It has happened.
 
George Hannah said:
This recent article discusses the brutal economic issues being increasingly raised
https://www.irishtimes.com/business...o-northern-ireland-than-brexit-does-1.4016373
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The economic figures are sobering alright.
Brexit is going to hit us hard, one way or the other. The break up of the UK wouldn't help ease that burden on NI.
Pretty much why, in my response, I said that we wouldn't like a reunification referendum forced prematurely by events around Brexit.
The GFA was a wonderful achievement, but the future of NI was supposed to evolve naturally.
A lot of people in England in particular, either don't understand or underestimate the full significance of any actions taken now in haste, with regard to NI/Ireland.
 
robbieh said:
Fascism will arise from outside parliament.

Disaffected voters will rally round people like Robinson and it won't be long before an overtly fascist politician is elected.

It can happen. It has happened.
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I just popped out for some marmalade, when did this happen? ;-)

Disaffected British voters, by their name, tend not to vote at all, let alone march to the polling station for someone such as he. Indeed, historically, the more radical a party becomes, in either direction, the less attractive it appears. The lot of the extremist is not helped by the fact that our UK electoral system is skewed in such a way that it keeps our 'extremists' outside of Parliament. Whether that has been a good thing is debatable, however.
 
Gabriel said:
I just popped out for some marmalade, when did this happen? ;-)

Disaffected British voters, by their name, tend not to vote at all, let alone march to the polling station for someone such as he. Indeed, historically, the more radical a party becomes, in either direction, the less attractive it appears. The lot of the extremist is not helped by the fact that our UK electoral system is skewed in such a way that it keeps our 'extremists' outside of Parliament. Whether that has been a good thing is debatable, however.
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Was referring to Oswald Mosley.
 
robbieh said:
Was referring to Oswald Mosley.
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Mosley had already sat as Conservative, Independent, and Labour MP, respectively, before he formed his New Party, following which his popularity declined and he lost his seat in '31, so while he was in the House, he was never elected to it as a fascist.
 
Gabriel said:
Mosley had already sat as Conservative, Independent, and Labour MP, respectively, before he formed his New Party, following which his popularity declined and he lost his seat in '31, so while he was in the House, he was never elected to it as a fascist.
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No he wasn't you're quite correct but there was a movement outside of Parliament that was fascist. Plenty of the aristocracy were impressed by Hitler. Edward VIII too. Ffs even the nation's Idol Churchill said a few complimentary things about him.
 
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