But you* DID state that you'd honour the result of the referendum, and at the time even called out Farage for suggesting a re-run in the event of a close remain win was disgraceful and that after this referendum the matter should be closed.
Of course, that's when all the polls showed a 55%-45% remain victory. Hold another referendum by all means. And then, 3 months later, we'll campaign that the public has "changed their minds on remaining" and demand we hold another referendum. You starting to see the problem here? Compromise on a leave you'd like to see and we can move on, you can even campaign to rejoin at a later date if you so wish. Continue to press for remaining and the matter of brexit, and all the vitriol, anger, resentment and division continues as well.
*you here having the meaning of those remainers who said such things at the time
I think it's the six year interlude that's the real bone of contention. Think GLA think UEFA.I think Johnson bunging some woman he was shagging £125k may have had some influence on the decision.
Personally I hope we never have another referendum about anything. I don’t think it is compatible with our parliamentary system anyway, nor would I want to go directly to the electorate about many topics even if it was.
Just on this one though, I don’t think it should ever have been just one public vote. Not in terms of leave or remain but at the various stage gates post the initial decision being made. The way it was set up and everything about it was just turgid from both sides.
But you're happy to force me and others to accept being in a union we don't want to be a part of?But that would be very few of 'us'.
It might be true of politicians, but very few of those who have had this inflicted on us, agreed to any of it.
We simply had no choice.
If Bozo comes back with May's deal right now, I will accept it. But many 'leavers' won't. I won't like it & I don't recognise the right of any of you, to band together & take away my right to being im the EU. But I will accept the deal.
Plenty of your own 'democratic' brothers in 'leave' won't.
If Corbyn does a Norway deal. I will accept it. Your people won't.
That is how this whole thing is a fucking joke & it has already fucked up the country, not because of 'remainers' but because of Brexit itself.
Brexit is to blame for all of this.
You allow those same people (contestants) to vote for MP's that govern the country, though.Absolutely, totally agree with you.
The only reason I've advocated a second referendum was that it was the only way I could see we could reasonably cancel the previous one. But in reality I don't want any. It's no coincidence that we've had a stable system of democracy the way it is for hundreds of years.
You let people decide who they want to represent them, and then the representatives, who you would hope are of above average intelligence and have more experience and time to debate things, get to work out between them the best course of action in any particular area. The system may be imperfect, but it's the best we have and it works.
What does not work is giving a vote to broader public, many of whom are thick as pig shit, can be easily manipulated and who usually gravitate towards self-interest and short term gain. And I am not talking about Brexit here, nor Brexiter or Remainers. Just generally.
Anne Robinson: How many wheels are there on a unicycle?
Contestant: Er, three?
Why on earth would you trust people like that to make a decision on a complex, very complex, issue? Bonkers.
That's not exactly democratic, is it, removing the electorate from decisions. Because we're not smart enough collectively to get involved?
But we're smart enough to choose those MP's who make those decisions though, right? They govern with our consent, remember. We were taken into the EEC without our consent, and had to hold a referendum to decide if it's what the public wanted. It returned a 65% yes and we stayed in.
The result of THAT referendum was "honoured", for 40+ years. Why not this one?
This is who is running the country now. We are pretty much fucked and like it or not this is what Brexit looks like. There is no left-wing revolution, there is no sunny uplands just good old Nigel front and centre
It's becoming pathetic...You thought that was worth posting again just for the extra line of knife talk.....
Which is fine, because they (the voters) are distanced from the individual complex and nuanced decisions. It's not perfect, I admit. But it's the best we've got.You allow those same people (contestants) to vote for MP's that govern the country, though.
online and offline the hate just keeps being ramped up by the extremists on both sidesIt's becoming pathetic...
Are people out there seriously believing Farage wants to advocate knifing people?
Or that it's just a 'bravado', throwaway line from a ridiculous man.
Bit like a leave with a deal brexit. Not perfect, but the best we've got to avoid the continuation of the matter.Which is fine, because they (the voters) are distanced from the individual complex and nuanced decisions. It's not perfect, I admit. But it's the best we've got.
You allow those same people (contestants) to vote for MP's that govern the country, though.
"We're going to beat them at their own game!"online and offline the hate just keeps being ramped up by the extremists on both sides
Anyone can become an MP, though.That’s true but generally there’s a few options put forward by their parties on the basis of trying to win. With this in mind they quite naturally put forward intelligent candidates and so the system works better than direct democracy.
That said occasionally you do get Dominic Raab types.
Anyone can become an MP, though.
Lord Buckethead, Monster Raving Loony, and we all have the choice, a legitimate choice to vote for them to represent us in Parliament. You can't say* "the public are idiots, and referendums shouldn't happen" in one breath but say "the people should have the final say" in the next lik some remainers have been doing. If people don't trust in referendums, why do they advocate having a "People's Vote" on the issue, when they clearly don't respect the decision we all came to the first time around and agreed to uphold, no matter what the result was?
*disclaimer: not aimed at you personally, but at anyone who agrees with the sentiment
Wasn't aware that CERN held any official powers over the populous to be honest. You may as well have asked on what I felt about holding a referendum on StageCoach upping fares every April, tbh. The two situations don't equate to what i'm saying here. (and it's starting to come off a little condescending)@Mëtal Bikër : Do you know anything about Physics? I know a bit, having graduated in Physics at Imperial College back in the 1980s.
What do you reckon to CERN holding a referendum on what settings we should use for the Large Hadron Collider? Would you think that would be a good idea? Trust the people etc?
I'd say it was an absolutely fucking stupid idea and that the people who do it for their day job, should make those decisions. Maybe we might consider the public electing which physicists should be on a committee making such decisions? That might not be a bad idea. But giving the public the choice on individual settings? Plainly ridiculous.
So what's the difference between this and our political system?
Having observed Parliament these past few years, I cannot agree that MP's with below average intelligence are normally the minority. *disclaimer: jokeYes and MP’s that are below average intelligence are normally the minority and with policies needing a majority, there’s much less risk than a direct referendum.
My argument is that it’s the only way out without causing ridiculous damage, not that that is guaranteed I think we’re fucked anyway.
Now we have made the mistake of going to the public, the only truly fair way out is going to them again to get us out of this mess.
Once Brexit has a clear way through we should never have a referendum ever again.
Havign observed Parliament these past few years, I cannot agree that MP's with below average intelligence are normally the minority.
I absolutely do not agree that we remove the right of referendum from the electorate. That places power solely in the hands of Parliament, making them unaccountable to those they govern.