Another new Brexit thread

[kevin horlocks wand]

Extra time it is then...

Again , but when do we have penalties to end it. There has to be an end to the game at some point

 

[FlemishDuck]

Again , but when do we have penalties to end it. There has to be an end to the game at some point

At this point i think we entered the realm of Tennis. God save us all.

 

[George Hannah]

BBC's Brussells man on the spot - Andrew Fleming just telling us nothing is true until the Germans say it is.

 

[Metal Biker]

Well thanks for that tidbit. I think a point to make is "the grounds upon which Scotland innitially joined the Union". It came about because of royal claims right? Or to put it in a modern context, it's not like it came about trough an expressed desire of the scottish people trough self determination which in contemporary terms would present a better legal basis. My confusion can be accepted given that the name UK still refers to the basis upon which the union was found, just that the name doesn't nessecarily reflect so specificly what the politics of the country is.

Change it to "the parliament and peoples of Britain .. SPQB?

King James I united the kingdoms, but not the Parliaments. When England had it's revolution, the "Divine Right of Kings to Rule" was abolished, so the monarchy had no claim to power. England became a constitutional monarchy and that changed again in 1707 with the Act of Union, something nobody in either country wanted, but Scotland was kneedeep in debt (don't ask how...) and needed the English to help them out a smidge and as a compromise they combined their Parliaments but the English insisted that Parliament be held at the Palace of Westminster.

If you're wondering where Wales fits into all this, back when the Union was formed, Wales was just regarded as part of England, like Lancashire or Yorkshire, which is why there's no feature on the Union Jack to represent Wales; technically Wales are 'represented' by the St George's Cross.

 

[kevin horlocks wand]

I don’t think a general election now solves anything as even if Boris gets an overall majority it just gives him the power to come out with no deal, which I just don’t think there is any (much) appetite for.

It seems we are back to mays deal or revoke ?

 

[carlosthejackal]

I thought it was going to be the easiest deal in history and the EU would roll over !!! After all according to Gove we hold all the cards .

 

[BobKowalski]

BBC's Brussells man on the spot - Andrew Fleming just telling us nothing is true until the Germans say it is.

Sky also casting some doubt on the terminology used...

‘EU countries are a bit baffled about this account of the Johnson-Merkel meeting. “It doesn’t sound like Merkel”, says one. diplomat.
Suggestions Berlin are mulling putting out their account of the conversation soon’

 

[Metal Biker]

Again , but when do we have penalties to end it. There has to be an end to the game at some point

It will when BoJo steps up, needing to score and then skies it over the bar.

 

[kevin horlocks wand]

Sky also casting some doubt on the terminology used...

‘EU countries are a bit baffled about this account of the Johnson-Merkel meeting. “It doesn’t sound like Merkel”, says one. diplomat.
Suggestions Berlin are mulling putting out their account of the conversation soon’

You mean Boris has lied again, well I never

 

[George Hannah]

Sky also casting some doubt on the terminology used...

‘EU countries are a bit baffled about this account of the Johnson-Merkel meeting. “It doesn’t sound like Merkel”, says one. diplomat.
Suggestions Berlin are mulling putting out their account of the conversation soon’

The point in the comments about Germany and Greece was well made. Hostility on both sides is ramping up - dangerous days ahead when the real motives of the principal member states are revealed in stark clarity.

 

[Metal Biker]

You mean Boris has lied again, well I never

Merkel; "It is imperative we find a satisfactory deal, as it's impossible for things to continue as they are without one"

BoJo to press "Merkel said a satisfactory deal is impossible and they'll continue as they are without one!"

 

[Saddleworth2]

It is not anti-Scots rhetoric at all. Surprised you stoop to the tactics of others on here that have a need to suggest that discussion on the subject of Scotland's continued place in the Union equates to us wanting Scotland out.

Such tactics are just distraction and deliberately argumentative - in the absence of being able to discuss/debate probably. I am going to continue to assume that you are better than that

In the main it is opening up the discussion as to what will happen if there is an indyref2 and the timing of that (i.e. before or after the UK has left the EU). If the UK in still in the EU - likely a 'YES' vote - if not then it will be almost certainly a 'NO' vote.

This has a lot of significance on the subject of Brexit.

Anyway, we hear so much in support of Scottish and Irish nationalism is not a bit of balance welcomed.

We hear so much about the border issues between Ireland and the UK - is it not good to consider the issues that a indyref2 vote to Leave would present?

I’m not going to go back and quote all of the anti Scottish rhetoric over the last few days but there is a shed load. Balanced discussion is welcome but generally the Scottish situation is painted with a very broad brush and little nuance. And I’m not ‘stooping to tactics’ nearly reflecting on what I read.

 

[blueinsa]

Sky also casting some doubt on the terminology used...

‘EU countries are a bit baffled about this account of the Johnson-Merkel meeting. “It doesn’t sound like Merkel”, says one. diplomat.
Suggestions Berlin are mulling putting out their account of the conversation soon’

Hang on Bob.

You tell us this is what will happen, Merkel confirms it and then you say she didnt?

Backstop was a trap and was always Dublins and the EU's plan to effectively annex Northern Ireland.

Not interested in a deal and they couldnt give a rats arse about the GFA either.

 

[Saddleworth2]

There are no "Scottish MP's" there are MP's from the region of Scotland who serve in the British Parliament.

You're certainly presenting nationalist sentiments by refering to Scotland in the manner that you are.

I’m far from being a nationalist mate. Simply reflecting that Scotland is leaving the Uk against its democratic will.

 

[mcfc1632]

They are just a wrecking mob, like the Brexit MEPs - following a one club separatist agenda for which they have no mandate. When and if Scotland votes for independence good luck to them but until then these republicans should be honest about their allegiances and stay away like Sinn Fein. (Although then going on to wreck their own devolved government like SF is not to be encouraged.)

I take the view that they are elected and therefore they should represent until not elected - whether they attend parliament or abstain like SF is a matter for their own policies.

But you make a good point in your comparison with the BP MEPs - that is a pretty exact comparision.

 

[Saddleworth2]

There are no "Scottish MP's" there are MP's from the region of Scotland who serve in the British Parliament.

You're certainly presenting nationalist sentiments by refering to Scotland in the manner that you are.

I apologised to George. Pretty rare on here don’t you think?

 

[George Hannah]

It will when BoJo steps up, needing to score and then skies it over the bar.

Cummings is on VAR though - 'penalty award pending.....'

 

[blueinsa]

I’m not going to go back and quote all of the anti Scottish rhetoric over the last few days but there is a shed load. Balanced discussion is welcome but generally the Scottish situation is painted with a very broad brush and little nuance. And I’m not ‘stooping to tactics’ nearly reflecting on what I read.

Still no answer on your subservient claims?

 

[Metal Biker]

I’m far from being a nationalist mate. Simply reflecting that Scotland is leaving the Uk against its democratic will.

Did you mean to put "EU" there?

Scotland is not a separate entity. It'd be the same as those in London saying "London is being taken out of the EU against it's will. The "will" of Scotland is connected to the will of the other parts of the Union. Refering to Scotland as a separate entity would be no different to me talking about England all the time, and I assure you, i'd be accused on here of being a "Little Englander" or "English Nationalist" for doing so.

 

[Gelsons Dad]

What baffles me in all this is the emphasis on the Belfast agreement. Whenever anyone claims you can’t do something because it breaks the Belfast agreement what they are really doing is making a tacit threat of terrorism.
Why this has been allowed to colour the negotiations is beyond me.