General Election - December 12th, 2019

Who will you vote for in the 2019 General Election?

  • Conservative

    Votes: 160 30.9%

  • Labour

    Votes: 230 44.4%

  • Liberal Democrats

    Votes: 59 11.4%

  • Green Party

    Votes: 13 2.5%

  • Brexit Party

    Votes: 28 5.4%

  • Plaid Cymru/SNP

    Votes: 7 1.4%

  • Other

    Votes: 21 4.1%
  • Total voters
    518
blueparrot said:
Here's the thing though many did vote to leave for the first time or first for a while and I am hearing the opinion it was a waste of time voting and they won't bother this time or again. Obviously it's impossible to put any figure on it but I wonder how many will blame the tories as much as Labour and not bother. Let's be honest the Tories + DUP always had enough numbers to get it through last March if they had voted then for a very similar deal to what they have now.
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I agree that there has been widespread dissatisfaction with politics, from this first time demographic, and indeed Brexit voters
in general, many people, myself included, were saying, fuck it, if they don't respect our vote, they're not getting another again.
However, I don't believe it was the rejection of May's deal that triggered this, as there is country wide acceptance that the backstop
handed the future to the EU, so that deal could have passed, you're right, but nobody was happy with it.
Johnson has completely changed this now by getting the EU to move, and removing the backstop, that works for me,
and every leave voter I know. This is, of course supposition, by us both, you may be right, but I think not.
 
The perfect fumble said:
You've been told to fuck off not because you're not pure enough, but because you're a Tory.
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This typifies the current state of the Labour party, Blair, the most successful labour leader ever, won three elections,
purely because he managed to attract Conservative voters, in fact he attracted them in large numbers.
The current Momentum gripped mob's campaigning strategy seems to be, if they vote Tory, fuck'em.
Somehow, I think that may not go down too well.
 
Bigga said:
Bill, I respect you, but there are no beds because social services that look after people in the community have been cut.

Therefore the people that used to be trained to go rehabilitate those patients who have returned home are no longer available, i.e., district nurses etc.

Who caused that? Your beloved Tories.

You have helped yours and other sufferings and longer Waiting times and the domino of longer stays in hospitals by your choice of vote.

And yet somehow, your best guess is a pop at some almost nonexistent migrant who has taken a bed... somewhere... that doesn't likely affect you in any way, shape or form.

Because those Tories fed you a lie, told you to swallow it and believe what you're told.

Who's a good boy...?
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This is a national thing Scott,not just the Tories ,all opposition parties have peddled the same crap, blaming in other for its struggles.
Its not about politics or race its about the strain on the service.the same with schools,housing and prisons. We are simply bursting at the seams with people,we are a tiny island.
To compound the problem allowing migrants,of any status,from any country, without having paid in is criminal. Services are poor because they are stretched, standards drop, bound to.

The sooner we Brexit the better,deal or no deal.
 
Ancient Citizen said:
I agree that there has been widespread dissatisfaction with politics, from this first time demographic, and indeed Brexit voters
in general, many people, myself included, were saying, fuck it, if they don't respect our vote, they're not getting another again.
However, I don't believe it was the rejection of May's deal that triggered this, as there is country wide acceptance that the backstop
handed the future to the EU, so that deal could have passed, you're right, but nobody was happy with it.
Johnson has completely changed this now by getting the EU to move, and removing the backstop, that works for me,
and every leave voter I know. This is, of course supposition, by us both, you may be right, but I think not.
Click to expand...
The EU agreed to move the backstop once Johnson agreed to drop a UK red line on NI and accept an earlier offer made by the EU (that both May and Johnson had previously ruled out).
He did not get the EU to move, he was forced to accept an offer they made in Dec 2017 which at the time the UK rejected.
 
Len Rum said:
The EU agreed to move the backstop once Johnson agreed to drop a UK red line on NI and accept an earlier offer made by the EU (that both May and Johnson had previously ruled out).
He did not get the EU to move, he was forced to accept an offer they made in Dec 2017 which at the time the UK rejected.
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Keep trying to peddle your preferred interpretations, we've heard them, and ignored them, but it's a free country.
 
Len Rum said:
The EU agreed to move the backstop once Johnson agreed to drop a UK red line on NI and accept an earlier offer made by the EU (that both May and Johnson had previously ruled out).
He did not get the EU to move, he was forced to accept an offer they made in Dec 2017 which at the time the UK rejected.
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Ancient Citizen said:
Keep trying to peddle your preferred interpretations, we've heard them, and ignored them, but it's a free country.
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You do realise it was the UK Government that insisted on the backstop and agreed it with the EU?
All this about Boris got the EU to remove the backstop simply feeds into the English persecution complex of the big bad EU forcing us to do something and then the plucky English fighting back and winning.
 
Bill said:
This is a national thing Scott,not just the Tories ,all opposition parties have peddled the same crap, blaming in other for its struggles.
Its not about politics or race its about the strain on the service.the same with schools,housing and prisons. We are simply bursting at the seams with people,we are a tiny island.
To compound the problem allowing migrants,of any status,from any country, without having paid in is criminal. Services are poor because they are stretched, standards drop, bound to.

The sooner we Brexit the better,deal or no deal.
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As I’ve said, EU nationals are using the NHS less than Brits, contribute more in tax and NI than the average Brit and make up a significant proportion of the NHS.

We are overpopulated and our infrastructure is struggling but stopping EU nationals living and working here is a very bad idea.

Most are in prime working age and are contributing, rather than draining.

Also, not just the NHS, but many other industries would fail without them.
 
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Ancient Citizen said:
Yes.
That government changed its leader.
The rest is the usual anti British tosh we're accustomed to.
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Of course it did Johnson saw a backstabbing opportunity and took it , he then took the deal he'd stopped May taking by saying no British Prime Mininister could ever allow it. Trust him at your peril but watch you back.
 
Bill said:
This is a national thing Scott,not just the Tories ,all opposition parties have peddled the same crap, blaming in other for its struggles.
Its not about politics or race its about the strain on the service.the same with schools,housing and prisons. We are simply bursting at the seams with people,we are a tiny island.
To compound the problem allowing migrants,of any status,from any country, without having paid in is criminal. Services are poor because they are stretched, standards drop, bound to.

The sooner we Brexit the better,deal or no deal.
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Bill, mate, you're blaming it on a 'Brexit' issue, which is another misleading lie.

What has migrants got to do with the lack of building of social housing? Of building schools with quality teachers?

"Services are poor because they are stretched, standards drop, bound to". Yes, this is, ironically, the first actual truthful position in your statement, but this is down to CUTS, my friend!!

All these things you mention are down to a strangulation of services in the bid to be 'conservative'. This is a PEOPLE'S government where people pay into a collective service to benefit ALL. Are we seeing that?

Why are billionaires not paying more back into a system they've profited heavily from? Why are big business getting free passes? Why are they outsourcing vital jobs to cheaper workforce in order to make money? Getting subsidised by our money and making billions afterwards? Why is the financial district of Square Mile getting away with small taxation? Your Amazons, your Facebooks, your Googles, your apples etc., all getaway with paying little to no taxes!! I mean WTF? All these monies could go towards building the social aspects that we say are missing in schools, hospitals, policing, housing and more!

And you want to blame 'migration'??

'Kin 'ell, Bill!!

It's all tied, yes, but you have to want to look in the right places, as much as you might hate it, not the source of convenience...
 
bluethrunthru said:
so every policy related to labour relations has to fit with where you work or it won't work for the country? Does everybody work flat out for every moment they are on site? Hours are "lost" in businesses all over the place day in day out - I have worked mostly from home since 1990 for multinational companies which employs people on different types of contracts across the globe - I wasn't aware of any productivity short comings between the productivity of home workers vs site based staff. In a business where that can be deployed as I say it benefits the worker - if you want to start work at 5am the do so, you don't have to wait for some building to be open - and it benefits the business which doesn't have to provide heat, light, power and space for a home worker so thats some of the benefits of homeworking where I probably have worked 30-32hrs a week for donkeys years.

Then, for site based staff, as I say you get a new order in that needs turning around quickly you can flood it with staff who want to work. Then there is a fallow period when companies you supply to shut down for holidays or because they don't need your product at that time - you can let people have time off - over a period its cost neutral - helps people to get some sort of work life balance but unlike a zero hours contract there is regular pay. A company doing this also gets a reputation as a flexible, reliable supplier of goods and services.

I am amazed that so many people don't have the vision or imagination to look beyond their own little bubble.
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The point in all of this is not the 32 hours, this isn't a productivity argument. The argument is the fact that Labour will force companies to pay people a 37 hour wage for 32 hours work.

That is a MASSIVE cost to businesses and will seriously damage the economy.

If I wanted to build a cheap road quickly, I wouldn't tell the workers to go home and pay them for the hours they are sat at home.
 
blueparrot said:
Of course it did Johnson saw a backstabbing opportunity and took it , he then took the deal he'd stopped May taking by saying no British Prime Mininister could ever allow it. Trust him at your peril but watch you back.
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The back he stabbed was about as popular as herpes, then when he got in, the EU all of a sudden started talking, something
that many on here, in parliament, in fact every remainer, said they would NEVER do.
Yet they did.
Now I know this will bring yet another flurry of it was this, that, or the other, that did it, but frankly, at this juncture, not many shits are
given, because it's all been done, and Johnson's deal passed passed in parliament.
 
Bill said:
This is a national thing Scott,not just the Tories ,all opposition parties have peddled the same crap, blaming in other for its struggles.
Its not about politics or race its about the strain on the service.the same with schools,housing and prisons. We are simply bursting at the seams with people,we are a tiny island.
To compound the problem allowing migrants,of any status,from any country, without having paid in is criminal. Services are poor because they are stretched, standards drop, bound to. The sooner we Brexit the better,deal or no deal.
Click to expand...
The strain on many communities of uncontrolled immigation is undeniable. It is an engine of social disintegration and intolerance. The ONS stats are alarming: "How much of UK population growth is due to immigration? It is estimated that, together, it accounted for 5.4 million - or 82% - of the total population increase of 6.6 million between 2001 and 2016. - that share of the increase is the equivalent of 10 cities the size of Manchester. In mid-2017, the UK population stood at a record level of just over 66 million - (ONS Study published in 2019).
 
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