100% agree. Went to Berlin recent and the Holocaust museum there was enough.
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Auschwitz
- Thread starter inchy14
- Start date
100% agree. Went to Berlin recent and the Holocaust museum there was enough.
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Went to Sachsenhausen in Oranienburg when I was in Berlin. Smaller scale but just as eerie I suppose. Walking in via the gates with it’s common slogan. Going into the firing squad pit. The ruins of the gas chamber. Seeing the mortuary with it’s white tiled walls. A couple of accommodation blocks still standing.
BlueMoonRisin’
Well-Known Member
Went to Auschwitz 3 years ago and the most harrowing thing was being in the gas chamber where many poor souls met their fate: /
Vicious111
Well-Known Member
I visited Strachenhausen outside Berlin about 4 years ago and Auschwitz and Birkenau 2 years ago and found them both extremely harrowing in different ways.
Strachenhausen is about an hour and a half outside Berlin and sits at the back of a small village. Me and the Mrs went and were the only people in the grounds in a freezing February day. The strangest thing is walking through the gates and all sound seems to disappear altogether. No birds, no background noise - absolutely nothing. It's honestly like nature itself stays away as a mark of respect. That was one of the earlier camps set up and was heavily involved in a lot of the experiments on Jews, disabled children, twins...the morbid list went on. Reading some of that stuff is truly incomprehensible. The evil that was done in that 'hospital' and some of the stories stayed with me for a long time. As some have already said, no matter how hard you try you still can't believe it actually happened - it still felt surreal. I remember just sitting in what was left of the gas chamber area for over an hour with the Mrs in complete silence.
Auschwitz and Birkenau were very busy when I went, so it wasn't the same experience. What you see and hear there again, is just unspeakable. I will always remember walking through the building with all of the hair and belongings then seeing a tiny pair of yellow children's shoes. Honestly hit me harder than anything I had ever experienced and you feel such an intense rage at what the Nazi's done. Being inside the gas chamber and the stories of handing out soap as they walked in and fake shower heads was absolutely soul destroying. To stand in a place where hundreds of thousands of souls have perished is something that stays with you.
I think either of these places are an experience every single person on the planet should go and see. Not only does it provide a harrowing education into events of the past, but it highlights how strong a tool propaganda can be and what can happen when people don't stand up against prejudice. I'm sure there are others who have been who notice worrying events from the past that lead to this are still common place today. Without being overly political, things like the disdain of Syrian refugees, growing xenophobia in the face of Brexit and 'the elite' seemingly unbothered by austerity are all extremely worrying. The one thing that really get's me however, after such horrible past-time, is the rise of far-right Nazi's in places in Poland. A wonderful country that was decimated by the Nazi's, yet there they are promoting a regime that most likely killed their ancestors. Absolute mutants. I won't mention the lack of action regarding UEFA on that either...
Strachenhausen is about an hour and a half outside Berlin and sits at the back of a small village. Me and the Mrs went and were the only people in the grounds in a freezing February day. The strangest thing is walking through the gates and all sound seems to disappear altogether. No birds, no background noise - absolutely nothing. It's honestly like nature itself stays away as a mark of respect. That was one of the earlier camps set up and was heavily involved in a lot of the experiments on Jews, disabled children, twins...the morbid list went on. Reading some of that stuff is truly incomprehensible. The evil that was done in that 'hospital' and some of the stories stayed with me for a long time. As some have already said, no matter how hard you try you still can't believe it actually happened - it still felt surreal. I remember just sitting in what was left of the gas chamber area for over an hour with the Mrs in complete silence.
Auschwitz and Birkenau were very busy when I went, so it wasn't the same experience. What you see and hear there again, is just unspeakable. I will always remember walking through the building with all of the hair and belongings then seeing a tiny pair of yellow children's shoes. Honestly hit me harder than anything I had ever experienced and you feel such an intense rage at what the Nazi's done. Being inside the gas chamber and the stories of handing out soap as they walked in and fake shower heads was absolutely soul destroying. To stand in a place where hundreds of thousands of souls have perished is something that stays with you.
I think either of these places are an experience every single person on the planet should go and see. Not only does it provide a harrowing education into events of the past, but it highlights how strong a tool propaganda can be and what can happen when people don't stand up against prejudice. I'm sure there are others who have been who notice worrying events from the past that lead to this are still common place today. Without being overly political, things like the disdain of Syrian refugees, growing xenophobia in the face of Brexit and 'the elite' seemingly unbothered by austerity are all extremely worrying. The one thing that really get's me however, after such horrible past-time, is the rise of far-right Nazi's in places in Poland. A wonderful country that was decimated by the Nazi's, yet there they are promoting a regime that most likely killed their ancestors. Absolute mutants. I won't mention the lack of action regarding UEFA on that either...
You can almost get your head around a pogrom but this industrial mass murder was going on 24/7 for several years , I will never understand that.
The sustained rage and hate that made it possible.
There were quite a few plots to kill Hitler by Germans even before the war started , they were very unlucky.
The sustained rage and hate that made it possible.
There were quite a few plots to kill Hitler by Germans even before the war started , they were very unlucky.
marco
Well-Known Member
I visited Strachenhausen outside Berlin about 4 years ago and Auschwitz and Birkenau 2 years ago and found them both extremely harrowing in different ways.
Strachenhausen is about an hour and a half outside Berlin and sits at the back of a small village. Me and the Mrs went and were the only people in the grounds in a freezing February day. The strangest thing is walking through the gates and all sound seems to disappear altogether. No birds, no background noise - absolutely nothing. It's honestly like nature itself stays away as a mark of respect. That was one of the earlier camps set up and was heavily involved in a lot of the experiments on Jews, disabled children, twins...the morbid list went on. Reading some of that stuff is truly incomprehensible. The evil that was done in that 'hospital' and some of the stories stayed with me for a long time. As some have already said, no matter how hard you try you still can't believe it actually happened - it still felt surreal. I remember just sitting in what was left of the gas chamber area for over an hour with the Mrs in complete silence.
Auschwitz and Birkenau were very busy when I went, so it wasn't the same experience. What you see and hear there again, is just unspeakable. I will always remember walking through the building with all of the hair and belongings then seeing a tiny pair of yellow children's shoes. Honestly hit me harder than anything I had ever experienced and you feel such an intense rage at what the Nazi's done. Being inside the gas chamber and the stories of handing out soap as they walked in and fake shower heads was absolutely soul destroying. To stand in a place where hundreds of thousands of souls have perished is something that stays with you.
I think either of these places are an experience every single person on the planet should go and see. Not only does it provide a harrowing education into events of the past, but it highlights how strong a tool propaganda can be and what can happen when people don't stand up against prejudice. I'm sure there are others who have been who notice worrying events from the past that lead to this are still common place today. Without being overly political, things like the disdain of Syrian refugees, growing xenophobia in the face of Brexit and 'the elite' seemingly unbothered by austerity are all extremely worrying. The one thing that really get's me however, after such horrible past-time, is the rise of far-right Nazi's in places in Poland. A wonderful country that was decimated by the Nazi's, yet there they are promoting a regime that most likely killed their ancestors. Absolute mutants. I won't mention the lack of action regarding UEFA on that either...
good post that matey and it makes you think, me,i dont think it could ever happen again on that scale and how it was kept secret in those days is another thing but we dont know for sure what British inteligence knew in those days,these places were deep behind enemy lines but its on the cards we knew long before the Russians walked in but simply couldnt do anything about it,bombing raids went over the camps but i suspect photography was the main intention, what gets me a German officer would go home and sit around the table with his wife and kids after putting the same in the gas chambers earlyer in the day, it just hits you in the face
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crazyg
Well-Known Member
We went to a village named Oradour-sur-Glane in France, near Limoges, which is the site of a massacre by a company of Waffen SS soldiers in 1944.
642 men, women and children were murdered in reprisal for 3 or 4 Germans killed in a nearby village a few days before. The victims were mostly herded into the church, where they were machine gunned down and then set alight. the village was then destroyed. After the war, the village was turned into a Village Martyr by De Gaulle, and stands as a memorial to the dead as it was left, A new village, of the same name, was built next to the site.
A very eerie experience for us both, especially as we discovered that the day we went was the anniversary of the massacre, and we had just missed the memorial service. It didn't help that there were storm clouds in the area. with constant thunder all around.
2 years and 6 days later, my wife died about 50 miles away!
I would love to go and visit Auschwitz/Birkenau, but having seen the results of those atrocities on such a (relatively) small scale and been so affected by it, I'd be a gibbering wreck when I got there.
642 men, women and children were murdered in reprisal for 3 or 4 Germans killed in a nearby village a few days before. The victims were mostly herded into the church, where they were machine gunned down and then set alight. the village was then destroyed. After the war, the village was turned into a Village Martyr by De Gaulle, and stands as a memorial to the dead as it was left, A new village, of the same name, was built next to the site.
A very eerie experience for us both, especially as we discovered that the day we went was the anniversary of the massacre, and we had just missed the memorial service. It didn't help that there were storm clouds in the area. with constant thunder all around.
2 years and 6 days later, my wife died about 50 miles away!
I would love to go and visit Auschwitz/Birkenau, but having seen the results of those atrocities on such a (relatively) small scale and been so affected by it, I'd be a gibbering wreck when I got there.
Big Swifty
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And incredibly, there are still those who deny that it ever happened.
What's with these people?
What's with these people?
ninjamonkey
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Can only echo what many have said on here. As harrowing as it is, it’s somewhere I firmly believe everybody should visit.
We went on a bitterly cold November a few years back and with birkenau being a vast open space completely exposed to the elements, We got a very very small taste of the often overlooked extreme weather conditions they were subjected to and with nothing but rags to their name if they were lucky, it’s staggering how many survived both the freezing winters and the scorching summers whilst being literally worked to death. Heard stories of how survivors almost fought to huddle up to dead bodies during the night in a desperate bid to gain some warmth and survive.
Birkenau probably gives you the best sense of the scale of the place but of all the mounds of items on display in Auschwitz itself, I think it’s probably the shoes that hit the hardest for me. what they have on display is crazy but it gets more crazy when you realise that was only a small portion of what was recovered and then you learn that the vast majority of prisoners didn’t even have shoes.
As a side note, couldn’t agree more with the Kraków comments, an incredibly stunning city. Sadly, wasn’t there long enough to explore much beyond the standard tourist spots particularly with a whole day dedicated to Auschwitz but even the more expensive tourist areas were still comparatively cheap as chips. They were just setting up the Christmas markets the weekend we were there, would love to have gone a fortnight later to experience that on top of everything else.
We went on a bitterly cold November a few years back and with birkenau being a vast open space completely exposed to the elements, We got a very very small taste of the often overlooked extreme weather conditions they were subjected to and with nothing but rags to their name if they were lucky, it’s staggering how many survived both the freezing winters and the scorching summers whilst being literally worked to death. Heard stories of how survivors almost fought to huddle up to dead bodies during the night in a desperate bid to gain some warmth and survive.
Birkenau probably gives you the best sense of the scale of the place but of all the mounds of items on display in Auschwitz itself, I think it’s probably the shoes that hit the hardest for me. what they have on display is crazy but it gets more crazy when you realise that was only a small portion of what was recovered and then you learn that the vast majority of prisoners didn’t even have shoes.
As a side note, couldn’t agree more with the Kraków comments, an incredibly stunning city. Sadly, wasn’t there long enough to explore much beyond the standard tourist spots particularly with a whole day dedicated to Auschwitz but even the more expensive tourist areas were still comparatively cheap as chips. They were just setting up the Christmas markets the weekend we were there, would love to have gone a fortnight later to experience that on top of everything else.
Asa's Heart
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I was partly brought up by a lovely woman who survived Auschwitz. She was a political prisoner who opposed the National Socialist Party. I learned a lot about compassion and politics from her and her family.
When I visited Auschwitz I got lost in a world full of thoughts and sadness. It really affected me. We had a survivor with us and again, he was a model of compassion, kindness and wisdom. All children in Israel visit and when you see them walking in formation in total silence with their flag in front it is sobering.
What shocked me on occasion was the rather loud (often American) tourists who ignored the signs and requests not to photograph certain areas, and people taking selfies in really sensitive areas. It isn’t that often that I get really angry but to see this happen when there are families clearly mourning and praying was shocking.
there are lots of publications that are good and in recent years lots of stories that have become popular. Some mentioned on this thread. All are relevant to a degree but if anyone wants a real and detailed history of the various stages of the holocaust have a look at ‘The Holocaust’ by Martin Gilbert. People often think that they know what went on in terms of the holocaust but to see accounts of the creative way in which the Nazi’s, particularly the SS went about industrial scale murder is mind blowing. Reading accounts of SS officers taking bets on how many push ups people could do over a bayonet before they fell on it and died (for fun because they were bored), or how in order to save bullets they stood people in a line three or four deep and used one high powered bullet to see if it would kill more than two or three people is sickening. It shows a total lack of any feeling towards fellow humans.
One of the questions that I was asked almost thirty years ago at my university interview was “if you were stuck on a desert island and could only have one book what would it be”? I answered the Holocaust by Martin Gilbert. The panel all looked at me like I was mad and one asked why. My response was “because it would remind me why sometimes being on an island away from the human race was not a bad option”. It caused a lot of debate but I got on and completed my politics degree.
if anyone really looks at how the hatred and fear developed throughout the late 1920’s to the mid 1940’s they will be fearful of what is happening right here, right now. People are accepting lies from politicians, media and often their own classes. It is a dangerous And fragmented world and things are happening at a pace that should make people sit up and really take notice. We are sleepwalking into a real problem on a national and international stage.
When I visited Auschwitz I got lost in a world full of thoughts and sadness. It really affected me. We had a survivor with us and again, he was a model of compassion, kindness and wisdom. All children in Israel visit and when you see them walking in formation in total silence with their flag in front it is sobering.
What shocked me on occasion was the rather loud (often American) tourists who ignored the signs and requests not to photograph certain areas, and people taking selfies in really sensitive areas. It isn’t that often that I get really angry but to see this happen when there are families clearly mourning and praying was shocking.
there are lots of publications that are good and in recent years lots of stories that have become popular. Some mentioned on this thread. All are relevant to a degree but if anyone wants a real and detailed history of the various stages of the holocaust have a look at ‘The Holocaust’ by Martin Gilbert. People often think that they know what went on in terms of the holocaust but to see accounts of the creative way in which the Nazi’s, particularly the SS went about industrial scale murder is mind blowing. Reading accounts of SS officers taking bets on how many push ups people could do over a bayonet before they fell on it and died (for fun because they were bored), or how in order to save bullets they stood people in a line three or four deep and used one high powered bullet to see if it would kill more than two or three people is sickening. It shows a total lack of any feeling towards fellow humans.
One of the questions that I was asked almost thirty years ago at my university interview was “if you were stuck on a desert island and could only have one book what would it be”? I answered the Holocaust by Martin Gilbert. The panel all looked at me like I was mad and one asked why. My response was “because it would remind me why sometimes being on an island away from the human race was not a bad option”. It caused a lot of debate but I got on and completed my politics degree.
if anyone really looks at how the hatred and fear developed throughout the late 1920’s to the mid 1940’s they will be fearful of what is happening right here, right now. People are accepting lies from politicians, media and often their own classes. It is a dangerous And fragmented world and things are happening at a pace that should make people sit up and really take notice. We are sleepwalking into a real problem on a national and international stage.
dublinblue12
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Went about 15 years ago, harrowing experience but also a really well done museum.
Sad thing is it's still happening today in some form
Sad thing is it's still happening today in some form
Did you go in the room with all the pictures? I didn’t find it harrowing my feelings were of just dismay.Just been on the tour of Auschwitz and Birkenau and what a truly harrowing and haunting experience it was.
The horrors that went on here were unimaginable and were a stain on humanity.
I’d like to say never ever again but with the rise of the fat right across the world who knows.
RIP all those who died or suffered at the hands of their perpetrators.
sir baconface
Well-Known Member
Went to Dachau with my older son years ago. As others say, it’s a very sad and thought-provoking experience.
Why do people go? In part, I think it’s a small way to show respect to those who suffered. A bit like visiting the war cemeteries in Northern France. Both bring home the sheer scale of what went on.
Mankind doesn’t learn though.
Why do people go? In part, I think it’s a small way to show respect to those who suffered. A bit like visiting the war cemeteries in Northern France. Both bring home the sheer scale of what went on.
Mankind doesn’t learn though.
Fourinarow
Well-Known Member
I went to Auschwitz in December 6 years ago and the weather was pretty awful. An icy cold gale, so as you can imagine, that really set the scene for how hideous it must have been, especially when we were at Birkenau with that horrible wind howling across it. We were layered up to the eyeballs and still struggling, so to imagine what those poor people must have gone through, on top of the most horrific situations, really hit home.
I've been fascinated with the place ever since. Obviously I knew about it and remember some of it from school, but to then go and actually be part of it, stand where some of the most horrific things have happened, is a feeling you can't really explain, but for some strange, unexplainable reason, I'm drawn to experiencing these feelings again, and want to go back now that I've read up a lot more about it and watched more documentaries etc.
I'm currently reading 'Auschwitz: A Doctor's Eyewitness Account. "When the Nazis invaded Hungary in 1944, they sent virtually the entire Jewish population to Auschwitz. A Jew and a medical doctor, Dr. Miklos Nyiszli was spared from death for a grimmer fate: to perform “scientific research” on his fellow inmates under the supervision of the infamous “Angel of Death”: Dr. Josef Mengele. Nyiszli was named Mengele’s personal research pathologist. Miraculously, he survived to give this terrifying and sobering account."
Son of Saul is a pretty grim film to watch too.
https://www.standard.co.uk/go/londo...harrowing-look-inside-auschwitz-a3236651.html
And I absolutely agree that this is a place you should visit. No doubt about it.
I've been fascinated with the place ever since. Obviously I knew about it and remember some of it from school, but to then go and actually be part of it, stand where some of the most horrific things have happened, is a feeling you can't really explain, but for some strange, unexplainable reason, I'm drawn to experiencing these feelings again, and want to go back now that I've read up a lot more about it and watched more documentaries etc.
I'm currently reading 'Auschwitz: A Doctor's Eyewitness Account. "When the Nazis invaded Hungary in 1944, they sent virtually the entire Jewish population to Auschwitz. A Jew and a medical doctor, Dr. Miklos Nyiszli was spared from death for a grimmer fate: to perform “scientific research” on his fellow inmates under the supervision of the infamous “Angel of Death”: Dr. Josef Mengele. Nyiszli was named Mengele’s personal research pathologist. Miraculously, he survived to give this terrifying and sobering account."
Son of Saul is a pretty grim film to watch too.
https://www.standard.co.uk/go/londo...harrowing-look-inside-auschwitz-a3236651.html
And I absolutely agree that this is a place you should visit. No doubt about it.
Manchester_lalala
Well-Known Member
I really enjoy the history of WWII and I’ve always felt that a visit to Auschwitz will be the only place to experience the feeling of the that era. I’ve been to the killing fields in Phnom Penh so I can probably relate to the feeling people get when they go to Auschwitz. Hard to believe that the Nazi’s only committed these atrocities 75 years ago. Pol Pot carrying out the mass murder in the killing fields in the 70’s is even more unbelievable. I don’t often like the use of mobile phones and social media, but it’s one good thing that it has brought to the world is the exposure it gives. Not a chance anything like them two places could exist again.
m7mcfc
Well-Known Member
Amazingly at work a couple of weeks ago an Albanian lad said to me 'Auschwitz you know' I told him of course I did. He then explained to me that the two Romanian lads stood with him had no idea about it. He showed them pictures of Hitler on his phone and they were still clueless. We could not believe it.
Now I know Romania was part of the axis but for two lads from there not to know who Hitler is, is jaw dropping. I wonder has World war 2 been wiped from Romanian history.
Does anyone know what German children are taught on the subject?
Now I know Romania was part of the axis but for two lads from there not to know who Hitler is, is jaw dropping. I wonder has World war 2 been wiped from Romanian history.
Does anyone know what German children are taught on the subject?
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Probably more than we are about how we treated the First Nations when we went over to the Americas, Australasia, Africa...Amazingly at work a couple of weeks ago an Albanian lad said to me 'Auschwitz you know' I told him of course I did. He then explained to me that the two Romanian lads stood with him had no idea about it. He showed them pictures of Hitler on his phone and they were still clueless. We could not believe it.
Now I know Romania was part of the axis but for two lads from their not to know who Hitler is, is jaw dropping. I wonder has World war 2 been wiped from Romanian history.
Does anyone know what German children are taught on the subject?
We built concentration camps in Kenya less than a decade after WW2.
Since the killing fields, off the top of my head:Not a chance anything like them two places could exist again.
Yugoslavia
Rwanda
China
Isis
Chechnia
Syria
Libya
Nigeria
Mexico
sadly, plenty of places where one set of humans treats another set of humans as little more than pests
Sky Blue Thinking
Well-Known Member
Have looked at visiting Krakow as heard nothing but good reports and would visit even though it would be extremely difficult. The line in the song Green Fields of France seems apt;
"Man's blind indifference to his fellow man"
Shocking to think this is still in living memory for many and what has been learnt.
"Man's blind indifference to his fellow man"
Shocking to think this is still in living memory for many and what has been learnt.
The Preacher
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Went about 15 years ago, harrowing experience but also a really well done museum.
Sad thing is it's still happening today in some form
Visited Auschwitz about nine years ago. Had second thoughts about making the trip from Krakow but eventually felt it was something I ought to do. And I’m glad I did, despite it’s being, as you say, a very chilling and disturbing experience. Passing through the gate which bears the legend ‘ Arbeit Macht Frei’ (Work sets you free’), sent shivers down my spine - a cliche, I know - but true. Similarly, the sinister and malign sight of the railway track leading in through the main gates. Never before had words “Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it” (George Santayana) seemed more appropriate.