"But they didn't lose votes to a centrist party, people shifted from labour over the centre to the tories."@urban genie.
The election was not fought on left-right grounds.
In the blue corner:
We have faffed around for 3 years and it is damaging. So, time to 'get Brexit done' and move on.
In the red corner:
We will renegotiate brexit deal and have a second referendum. And here is a list of really nice socialist things we will do. It adds up a bit, but we'll find the money, honest.
In the North, the election was largely lost on the first part of that platform.
Basically Blair burnham milliband are the centrist types who can appeal to the centre ground and actually articulate policiesThe coronation of Long Bailey starts with Raynor as deputy.
Momentum and McCluskey firmly in charge still.
No lessons learned whatsoever.
The coronation of Long Bailey starts with Raynor as deputy.
Momentum and McCluskey firmly in charge still.
No lessons learned whatsoever.
Basically Blair burnham milliband are the centrist types who can appeal to the centre ground and actually articulate policies
But to these momentum fuckwits they are Tory’s
As such labour are doomed for another decade with the lunatics running the asylum
You are really a bit premature with this
Yes Raynor will win deputy but RLB becoming leader is way off being certain.
McCluskys reach amongst his union memebers isn't what it was and I know no member of the party who is also a member of momentum.
Maybe.Which is what I said the tories message about getting brexit done was a key factor, a centre ground labour would still have pushed a message opposite to this and still not had a message of how they would improve northern lives.
Labour were fucked no matter what in the end with hindsight.
Agreed. FWIW I said so the moment Labour lost the GE.I'm going to go all out and say I've got this spot on.
Corbyn, McDonnell, Momentum and McLuskey have all given her their blessings.
She is the new leader.
Maybe.
Of course Brexit was a huge factor in some traditionally Labour constituencies. But there's no evidence that the country has suddenly even greater pro-Brexit than the 51.9 - 48.1 referendum result. In fact the opposite: As recently as October this year, YouGov pulled together data from 300 surveys/polls and showed that by 2017 the Leave majority was gone and the country has been consistently pro-Remain ever since. 54-46 at the start of the year, narrowing to 53-47 pro Remain just before the GE.
And yet Labour attracted 32% of the GE vote, vs the Tories' 43%.
So blaming their crushing defeat on Brexit is them trying to bury the truth. People found them unelectable for all sorts of reasons. Corbyn being the main one, and his policies second. People do not like him, nor his lack of patriotism nor his policies. People (rightly) don't believe everyone can have a marvellous increase in the standards of public services which hardly anyone will have to pay a bean extra for.
Had they had a different leader with more moderate policies, I think they could have won easily. They were no exactly up against a brilliant and unblemished opponent, were they!
You are really a bit premature with this
Yes Raynor will win deputy but RLB becoming leader is way off being certain.
McCluskys reach amongst his union memebers isn't what it was and I know no member of the party who is also a member of momentum.
I'm going to go all out and say I've got this spot on.
Corbyn, McDonnell, Momentum and McLuskey have all given her their blessings.
She is the new leader.
I'm going to go all out and say I've got this spot on.
Corbyn, McDonnell, Momentum and McLuskey have all given her their blessings.
She is the new leader.
Momentum is probably the largest block vote but my understanding is that there are sub 50k paid up momentum members and Corbyn got 313k votes last time to Jones' circa 200k. So that is a big block but no where near enough to suggest they have control. They and the Unions can only endorse a candidate and JC did not have a clean sweep of Unions last time - some biggish unions backed Owen Smith.
What is likely to happen is that Momentum and the bigger unions will back RLB as the continuity Corbyn candidate but we have no idea of the extent to which the 400k+ membership is going to want continuity of a hard left approach. Brexit is a big unknown as the Corbynite narrative is that brexit lost the election and practically nothing else - the idea being that labour should shift to a more pro brexit stance and everything will be rosy. The membership are generally highly educated and anti brexit and that stance will not go down well with a massive chunk of the voters, only a small % genuinely believe that Corbyn and his lack of popularity was not a massive part of the problem. I think its all to play for.
Its become the narrative to blame the momentum vote for the swing to the left as this helps paper over the real cracks which are actually that the party as a whole were sick of the blairite 'centre' left. Rather than face this difficult discussion / rejection it's easier just to blame the momentum bogey man.Totally agree. Whilst Momentum tend to shout the loudest, doesn't mean they are the most - I think the crushing defeat this time will have woken up a lot of members, not to mention the fact that Long-Bailey has long been touted as the Corbyn continuity candidate, and its abundantly clear to most that he was the biggest factor in the loss.
Yep, if those two Corbynist fuckers get in it will show Labour just don’t listen. They need a leader who sounds and is intelligent, is dignified and universally liked and respected. Those two are just Corbyn’s version of the two ugly sisters, pair of uninspiring politicians.The coronation of Long Bailey starts with Raynor as deputy.
Momentum and McCluskey firmly in charge still.
No lessons learned whatsoever.
The general public liked Tony Blair, there’s a lesson to be learned, contested 3 elections, won 3, he was a proper statesman who had the pragmatism to realise left wing politics will not work in the UK. If Labour go back to a less radical leadership they may have a chance of regaining power. It certainly won’t happen with any of the three female contenders putting their names forward along with Starmer, none of them have charisma and respect required to lead this country. It would be like putting Tony Pulis in charge of CityIts become the narrative to blame the momentum vote for the swing to the left as this helps paper over the real cracks which are actually that the party as a whole were sick of the blairite 'centre' left. Rather than face this difficult discussion / rejection it's easier just to blame the momentum bogey man.
Its become the narrative to blame the momentum vote for the swing to the left as this helps paper over the real cracks which are actually that the party as a whole were sick of the blairite 'centre' left. Rather than face this difficult discussion / rejection it's easier just to blame the momentum bogey man.
The coronation of Long Bailey starts with Raynor as deputy.
Momentum and McCluskey firmly in charge still.
No lessons learned whatsoever.
Which basically means Johnson can do what the f*** he wants; including going full Trump batshit crazy, safe in the knowledge there isn't an electable opposition.The coronation of Long Bailey starts with Raynor as deputy.
Momentum and McCluskey firmly in charge still.
No lessons learned whatsoever.
The general public liked Tony Blair, there’s a lesson to be learned, contested 3 elections, won 3, he was a proper statesman who had the pragmatism to realise left wing politics will not work in the UK. If Labour go back to a less radical leadership they may have a chance of regaining power. It certainly won’t happen with any of the three female contenders putting their names forward along with Starmer, none of them have charisma and respect required to lead this country. It would be like putting Tony Pulis in charge of City