COVID-19 — Coronavirus

Status
Not open for further replies.
St.Pauli support said:
Another thing that will change initiated by corona,
German pharma industry and gov will discuss how to get back essential medical production to Germany
in order to be less dependent.

It goes for many economical sectors and many other countries will have similar thoughts right now.
Click to expand...

The question then is ‘what essential medical production’? In this outbreak we need ventilators but that might not be the case in other outbreaks. So do you bring all essential medical production in house? This will then drive up cost during the years/decades when there are no outbreaks because the reason medical production is outsourced to China etc is because it is more cost effective to do so.

It’s a tricky one. I read one Swiss firm read the warning signs in China early on and stockpiled 6 months worth of components so perhaps judicious stockpiling to smooth out disruptions in supplies is a better route.
 
Tricky_Trev said:
The most chilling thing from that is us having 4000 ICU beds in the country, 3200 of which are already occupied even before the virus hits big time. Next week only 600 will be free and the week after we’ll be short by 200. The week after that we’ll be short by 4200, more than our actual number of beds in total. Even a doubling of our capacity only gives us an extra 5 or 6 days of being able to care for the dying.

So in just 2 weeks we have to decide whose grandparent to leave for dead and whose to try to save. 2 weeks.

And one of my nans still wants to go out shopping. I’ll chain her to the table if I have to! So stubborn. If you need some bread and milk, let me get it ffs! I’ll leave it on the doorstep, ring the bell and do a runner so I don’t risk spreading the virus.
Click to expand...

And my dad, who is 80 and has underlying health problems - COPD and asbestosis to name but two - still wants to go to the pub tomorrow night for his traditional Sunday evening drink with his mates ffs!
 
Tricky_Trev said:
The most chilling thing from that is us having 4000 ICU beds in the country, 3200 of which are already occupied even before the virus hits big time. Next week only 600 will be free and the week after we’ll be short by 200. The week after that we’ll be short by 4200, more than our actual number of beds in total. Even a doubling of our capacity only gives us an extra 5 or 6 days of being able to care for the dying.

So in just 2 weeks we have to decide whose grandparent to leave for dead and whose to try to save. 2 weeks.

And one of my nans still wants to go out shopping. I’ll chain her to the table if I have to! So stubborn. If you need some bread and milk, let me get it ffs! I’ll leave it on the doorstep, ring the bell and do a runner so I don’t risk spreading the virus.
Click to expand...

Got inlays due back from Madeira monday night, if they survive that we,all be having similar conversations.

Wife sister agreed last night to get shopping for them as needed (20 miles away from us) and then discussed with the mrs taking their mother to a bloody health spa for mothers day, mrs not happy when I pointed out it could be anything but healthy :-)
 
BobKowalski said:
The question then is ‘what essential medical production’? In this outbreak we need ventilators but that might not be the case in other outbreaks. So do you bring all essential medical production in house? This will then drive up cost during the years/decades when there are no outbreaks because the reason medical production is outsourced to China etc is because it is more cost effective to do so.

It’s a tricky one. I read one Swiss firm read the warning signs in China early on and stockpiled 6 months worth of components so perhaps judicious stockpiling to smooth out disruptions in supplies is a better route.
Click to expand...

Yeah, good question.
But we have to discuss the overhaul of our whole industry and lifestyle anyway in order to become carbon neutral by 2050.
I hope we don't forget all the things corona has taught us when we discuss all those topics
on the road to a responsible and sustainable lifestyle - on a global background, not national.
 
All the best to you and yours hope everything works out

Lancet Fluke said:
Yep. Within 2 or 3 weeks anyone very old or with underlying issues will be left to die and someone who has a better chance of surviving will get the bed. An understandable if somewhat depressing policy. My son has a very serious congenital heart problem. We started isolating at the beginning of the week and will do so for as long as necessary to give him the best chance of survival at the point he does get it. We are in a fairly unique position to be able to do this. His mum and me both work from home 100% of the time anyway, we live rurally, we were in a financial position to start building up supplies when we saw this coming a couple of months ago and his mum is an ex teacher so can do some home educating. I didn't think it would move this quickly or that we would be isolating so early but we felt it was odds on that it was coming sooner or later. When we made the decision on Monday, I was massively doubting myself and felt like I was being an idiot and overreacting. Within about 24 hours, I was only worried that we might have been too late and we could already have it as a few cases were confirmed in the local community. It's moved scarily fast, it makes rational decision making tough. I do need to add. Obviously if we didn't have a son with those underlying issues then we wouldn't have taken such drastic measures although we would have taken some sensible/reasonable measures I'm sure. On a related note. My son is on a drug called Lisinopril which is an ACE inhibitor. There are now some compelling theories that ACE inhibitors might make a person more vulnerable to catching the virus in the first place and make the effects of the virus more acute. Genuinely frightening.
Click to expand...
 
Lancet Fluke said:
Yep. Within 2 or 3 weeks anyone very old or with underlying issues will be left to die and someone who has a better chance of surviving will get the bed. An understandable if somewhat depressing policy. My son has a very serious congenital heart problem. We started isolating at the beginning of the week and will do so for as long as necessary to give him the best chance of survival at the point he does get it. We are in a fairly unique position to be able to do this. His mum and me both work from home 100% of the time anyway, we live rurally, we were in a financial position to start building up supplies when we saw this coming a couple of months ago and his mum is an ex teacher so can do some home educating. I didn't think it would move this quickly or that we would be isolating so early but we felt it was odds on that it was coming sooner or later. When we made the decision on Monday, I was massively doubting myself and felt like I was being an idiot and overreacting. Within about 24 hours, I was only worried that we might have been too late and we could already have it as a few cases were confirmed in the local community. It's moved scarily fast, it makes rational decision making tough. I do need to add. Obviously if we didn't have a son with those underlying issues then we wouldn't have taken such drastic measures although we would have taken some sensible/reasonable measures I'm sure. On a related note. My son is on a drug called Lisinopril which is an ACE inhibitor. There are now some compelling theories that ACE inhibitors might make a person more vulnerable to catching the virus in the first place and make the effects of the virus more acute. Genuinely frightening.
Click to expand...

I’m sure your actions have already given him a great fighting chance of coming through this unscathed, the battle starts on the home front and radiates to the community, the region and beyond.nobody should be forced to participate in an untried unilateral theoretical medical policy....all the best with your situation
 
Two Gun Bob said:
In Crumpsall A and E non Corrolla related waiting for the daughter to be admitted. A few cases just arrived like death warmed up and we are all playing musical chairs to keep safe distance. Ambulance crew just handed out us some face masks whilst we wait. Quite an eerie atmos and bringing home the seriousness of the situation.
Click to expand...
Nice use of "Crumpsall" there. None of this North Manchester General nonsense.
 
mcfc1632 said:
I understand that there are arguments for and against 'lock-down'

Only time will tell which approach is/was actually correct in the long-term

Once China comes out of isolation will that not mean that there will be many millions of people having no immunity to the virus and then it will just surge again?

If that is not a risk then the lock-down strategy seems the correct one - if it is a risk then it isn't

Only time will tell I guess - I hope that our medical and scientific experts are getting this right - surely it is them rather than politicians making the big decisions.

My own strategy had been to take the family to Cyprus next week for a month of isolation - they close their borders to non-Cypriots tonight so that is buggered
Click to expand...

The problem is ideally any strategy needs to be implemented globally for it to have the best chance to succeed. For that to happen, it needs a body that can implement it though and the WHO haven’t got the power to do it.
 
Claytop said:
Sorry to pick you up again but yes they have it under control currently because no one is allowed to go out of their house. We need to wait until their lockdown is over to see if it’s been a success.

It starts again then what, another lockdown for them? Repeat until a vaccine is available? Maybe another 12 months?

Ok that may be sustainable over there, still doubtful but no chance of any European countries being able to follow that.

At this stage there is no right or wrong way of doing it, unfortunately.
Click to expand...
The right way is the one that works. China's system works.

The one big difference and huge advantage they had was that their infection was largely concentrated in one City. That made it easier but within weeks it had spread throughout China. All the historic data province by province is available on the WHO web-site in their situation reports. Those provinces are now almost entirely free of virus and there is no lockdown in those provinces.

I think you are right, it could bounce back in time. At which point they will be vigilant, will have immune staff and will be expert. There's no question in mind that China will be largely clear now until they release a vaccine which is the end game.
 
BobKowalski said:
The question then is ‘what essential medical production’? In this outbreak we need ventilators but that might not be the case in other outbreaks. So do you bring all essential medical production in house? This will then drive up cost during the years/decades when there are no outbreaks because the reason medical production is outsourced to China etc is because it is more cost effective to do so.

It’s a tricky one. I read one Swiss firm read the warning signs in China early on and stockpiled 6 months worth of components so perhaps judicious stockpiling to smooth out disruptions in supplies is a better route.
Click to expand...
Yeah it’s a good point. The real work that needs to be done is piling pressure on China to improve their food hygiene and to stop fingering bats or whatever it is they do.
 
Didsbury Dave said:
well done for acting decisively mate. I really hope you keep your son safe.
Click to expand...
You’d be surprised how many negative reactions we received. Or maybe you wouldn’t bearing in mind how utterly mad society has become over recent years. Doesn’t really bother me too much but really bothered my wife. Every fucker had an opinion and most of the opinions were that we were cunts. Shows how quickly it’s moving though, within a couple of days the penny dropped with most of them. Thanks everyone for the kind words btw.
 
Tricky_Trev said:
Yeah it’s a good point. The real work that needs to be done is piling pressure on China to improve their food hygiene and to stop fingering bats or whatever it is they do.
Click to expand...

Yep. Stopping outbreaks like this from occurring at all must be the first priority.

Also props for the ‘fingering bats’ line...
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Unread Posts

Don't have an account? Register now and see fewer ads!

SIGN UP
Back
Top