COVID-19 — Coronavirus

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An interesting stat: More people died from this yesterday than have died from in in China in total.

Wow. Every single day from now on, that will continue to be the case and given the world is nowhere near the peak, I imagine it will be the case for months.

Interesting (and deeply saddening) but so what? Well if it only carries on like this for a couple of months, that would the death count outside of China is more than 60x that of China itself. Probably much more, depending on how high the world daily death rate gets.

And yet China accounts for 1/6th of the world's population. It only goes to show how the world has dropped the ball on this. A country with 1/6th of the world population is going to end up with less than 1/60th of the deaths. My guess is a much smaller fraction indeed - maybe 1/600th.

China showed us how best to respond with an immediate lockdown and severe travel restrictions in their own country. But we - not just here in the UK but pretty much everywhere else - waited too long and allowed people to freely move around whilst the virus was silently permeating the population. And we will get to see the results of that play out every day for the next few months.

I don't want to jump on this as it's been pointed out already and don't want it to feel like an ambush, your point would be correct IF China have told the truth, however everything is pointing in the direction that they haven't and still aren't, much like Iran and Russia I would imagine, both of which don't seem to mind getting rid of mass amounts of bodies when it suits them!
 
My mother 84 in law went shopping the last friday. She had already been told to isolate before the official ban. But old people being old people eh.
6 days later she is showing all the symptoms. We called 111 yesterday, as she starting to go down hill.
Their response was to monitor her, and only call back if she is struggling to breath.
So we don't know if she has it or something else. Either way she is not on the official figures.
Same happened to me so I'm not in the figures.
My thoughts and prayers for your family. It must be very worrying.
 
It’s ignored as the U.K. press covered the fifteen minute antibody test being available (3.5m of them) for front line staff within days.

Not sure what saving ten minutes makes and why you keep repeating yourself?
Virus test mate, not the antibody one.
 
Easier said than done that pal. Have you any idea how much of what you buy comes from China? Apart from what you eat, there is barely a thing that may not have been made there and it's often impossible to tell at the time of purchase, and sometimes even afterwards.
Exactly.... Even if something is assembled here or elsewhere the parts will have been manufactured in China
 
Judging by Cheltenham, Liverpool and the nationwide piss up a week last Friday I'd say it won't make too much difference.

People packing out the pubs last friday was the single most stupid thing thats happened throughout all this. My 20 year old nephew went to my local, bollocking wasnt the word!

It was party night, people hugging etc.
A dropped bollock by the government who underestimated the stupidity of the british public
 
What if we went into immediate lockdown as you say we should have.
Yes the spread of the disease would have been less.
Yes we would have had less deaths.
Intensive care beds lying empty.

Then slowly but surely, people would get restless and start breaking the lockdown. Mainly because they would have seen very few deaths and think this isn't that serious.
Before long, the death figures would start rising again.
Pleas to remain inside would be ignored. The reason for this is persons are smart but people are thick.
The government knows this.

We already have pubs doing lock ins.
People "exercising" in public parks. I don't think i've seen as many cyclists in my life.
Dog walkers stopping to have chats with people.
People have been BBQing on the moors in large groups.
Old people deciding that it is ok to go outside to shop/visit friends.
All this in less than one week of a lock down.

Now we have a situation with no controls. So the army is deployed onto the streets.
Like all the random riots we have had over the years. People would see the army as the enemy.
People would resist calls for isolation. Chaos would soon follow.
The virus takes over again and now there is nothing to stop or limit it.
The figures we have now would look great in comparison.

We have no way of stopping this. Only trying to slow it or manage it.
They have said from the start that they know they have "one" shot at total isolation/lockdown.
Mistakes have been and will be made. But i think we are doing ok.
Do not agree, and in fact the government does not now agree either.

Reflect on this: if we locked everyone in the UK up for 2 weeks, the virus would be gone, eliminated, no more. Everyone infected would be either recovered or dead. Either way, no more infections. The whole of the UK would be "clean".

Now of course we cannot do this, so we get "leakage". Some people continue to travel around and infect other people. And many of us have to go out and buy food and get infected by not being careful enough, not washing their hands enough or by just pure bad luck. And we have essential workers who also get infected, through no fault of their own.

So in reality it takes lo get than 2 weeks to get the infection rates right down and close to zero.
And of course the longer you took to start clamping down, the longer it takes to get things under control, More people are infected. The peak is bigger and it takes longer to suppress.

How long it takes depends on how careful we are and how draconian the measures are. People ignoring advice, weak lock down rules, light punishments and it will take longer, more people die, but we will still get there.

Once the numbers are really low, we go into phase 2 - the phase we should have been in, in the first place. That is test the shit out of everything that moves phase. Any suspected cases at all, lock them down immediately and trace all their contacts and lock them down as wel. For 2 weeks. And test/quarantine anyone re-emterjng the UK.

But the rest of the country can gradually go back to work, more or less as normal, but with heightened awareness and hopefully improved hygiene routines.

This works. This is what South Korea has been doing for weeks and it's seen to work. They have the same population as us. They had 5 deaths yesterday. We had 260.

Can you still buy Samsung phones, made in South Korea? Yes you can. They have their lives relatively back to normal and the virus under control.
 
Immediate Chinese lock down? Only if you're talking about locking down whistle blowers.
They waited longer than Boris did to lock their people down - and then did it in the most draconian way possible.
The first cases were known at the end of November. They locked down on January 23. That's two months of exponential spread in the crowded City of Wuhan.
Not true mate.
 
No mate.

There is a an antibody test, but this is a direct test for the virus. This is why I am indeed repeating myself because it doesn't seem to have registered with the media. if they work, and you must imagine they do if FDA approved, then that's very significant

Snippet below from a UK euivalent. US versions supposed to be quicker

http://www.ox.ac.uk/news/2020-03-18-oxford-scientists-develop-rapid-testing-technology-covid-19

5ULb2cj.png
 
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Boris is writing to us all to tell us to stay indoors,calling it a national emergency,saying things are going to get worse before they get better

He doesnt need to write to us we know BUT it's our employers who say we are open you have to work. My missus a diabetic, her solicitors office is still open, she will have to go in and is scared. My lad halfords is still open, he is scared he might bring it into the house. Me not sure at the moment as the lads were sent home last week, as we are local council we could be needed at any time I guess. Also scared I might bring it into our house. Boris needs to sort out the employers. What happens if the police start stopping people going to work by them saying your work isnt essential but your boss says it is ? Boris needs to be clearer.
 
Didn’t a lot of people go on a big bender a week last Friday, in the knowledge that the pubs were going to close down that night. They might unleash the peak of the virus so maybe cases would be expected to continue to rise sharply until the coming Friday, 3rd April.
Yeah cases will increase until at least next weekend, then deaths will probably increase for another 2+ weeks? (I don't really know the hospitalisation average time) but I do know its up to a 3 week period to be fully fit again with an out of hospital dose.
 
Do not agree, and in fact the government does not now agree either.

Reflect on this: if we locked everyone in the UK up for 2 weeks, the virus would be gone, eliminated, no more. Everyone infected would be either recovered or dead. Either way, no more infections. The whole of the UK would be "clean".

Now of course we cannot do this, so we get "leakage". Some people continue to travel around and infect other people. And many of us have to go out and buy food and get infected by not being careful enough, not washing their hands enough or by just pure bad luck. And we have essential workers who also get infected, through no fault of their own.

So in reality it takes lo get than 2 weeks to get the infection rates right down and close to zero.
And of course the longer you took to start clamping down, the longer it takes to get things under control, More people are infected. The peak is bigger and it takes longer to suppress.

How long it takes depends on how careful we are and how draconian the measures are. People ignoring advice, weak lock down rules, light punishments and it will take longer, more people die, but we will still get there.

Once the numbers are really low, we go into phase 2 - the phase we should have been in, in the first place. That is test the shit out of everything that moves phase. Any suspected cases at all, lock them down immediately and trace all their contacts and lock them down as wel. For 2 weeks. And test/quarantine anyone re-emterjng the UK.

But the rest of the country can gradually go back to work, more or less as normal, but with heightened awareness and hopefully improved hygiene routines.

This works. This is what South Korea has been doing for weeks and it's seen to work. They have the same population as us. They had 5 deaths yesterday. We had 260.

Can you still buy Samsung phones, made in South Korea? Yes you can. They have their lives relatively back to normal and the virus under control.

Only in an ideal world. (and there lies the problem)
First thing is people would need two weeks worth of food. Most poor people live day to day.
Panic buying started long before any lockdown was announced.
Medicine needs to be delivered. Who does that?
What about medical care? Some people need daily visits.
The old and infirm need care. Who does that?
What happens if somebodies heating system broke during the lockdown? Hard look?
Same if the electrics blew and they have electric cookers.
I could go on but i won't.

The real world doesn't live and work like it does in your argument.
 
Any one else in the same predicament?
My Mrs who works at the hospital is due to start helping out on the coronavirus wards from Tuesday
I'm kicking off like fuck saying fuck it off it ain't worth it for 17k a year live off my wage for 3 months
She won't have it tho wants to go and do her best and help out
People like her epitome what the nhs is about
I'm gutted and worried but so proud of her at the same time
Stay safe every one x

I doubt what ever you say mate will change her mind,its like the oath they take.plus all other staff working in the NHS.
Nightingale Pledge, nurse's.
The Hippocratic oath,doctors
They will be more proud
in this unprecedented times,its what they've trained for mate,(I no you & other spouses)will see it differently,I had my ex g who I still love dearly,is a sister, phoned me,she was telling me like others have said,horrendous things that will stay with her for life,
She's got 2 younger kids,which she thinking what if she catches it & The worst happens
Told her you can't think like,I said selfisotlate.NO it my duty she said,
Called ended emergency,
God bless everyone off them
 
Only in an ideal world. (and there lies the problem)
First thing is people would need two weeks worth of food. Most poor people live day to day.
Panic buying started long before any lockdown was announced.
Medicine needs to be delivered. Who does that?
What about medical care? Some people need daily visits.
The old and infirm need care. Who does that?
What happens if somebodies heating system broke during the lockdown? Hard look?
Same if the electrics blew and they have electric cookers.
I could go on but i won't.

The real world doesn't live and work like it does in your argument.

and even if we had absolute lock down and popped out in 4 weeks. The virus will still be here. Are we going to isolate ourselves from the world for how long?
 
I think that's very optimistic. We're on day 17 now in Spain and cases still rose yesterday after appearing to peak. And our lock down is a lot tighter and is getting even tighter now.

I think there's a least another 8/9 days of it growing in UK, 7 days of fluctuating around peak and then the numbers might start to fall. They're expecting numbers to start falling here around the 4/5th of April.
Agree Jay, the 4th / '5th prediction depends on compliance with measures taken which in our part of Spain is very good.

Still only a very few (4 or 5) cases in local hospital all from towns outside our area so optimistic as long as we geographically as well as personally isolate for the appropriate time ie stopping cars moving families moving to second homes etc..
 
I think that's very optimistic. We're on day 17 now in Spain and cases still rose yesterday after appearing to peak. And our lock down is a lot tighter and is getting even tighter now.

I think there's a least another 8/9 days of it growing in UK, 7 days of fluctuating around peak and then the numbers might start to fall. They're expecting numbers to start falling here around the 4/5th of April.
It seems officialish that London peak will be in 2/3 weeks but north west (and other low incidence places) to peak in May. I'm not sure how that works...
 
What if we went into immediate lockdown as you say we should have.
Yes the spread of the disease would have been less.
Yes we would have had less deaths.
Intensive care beds lying empty.

Then slowly but surely, people would get restless and start breaking the lockdown. Mainly because they would have seen very few deaths and think this isn't that serious.
Before long, the death figures would start rising again.
Pleas to remain inside would be ignored. The reason for this is persons are smart but people are thick.
The government knows this.

We already have pubs doing lock ins.
People "exercising" in public parks. I don't think i've seen as many cyclists in my life.
Dog walkers stopping to have chats with people.
People have been BBQing on the moors in large groups.
Old people deciding that it is ok to go outside to shop/visit friends.
All this in less than one week of a lock down.

Now we have a situation with no controls. So the army is deployed onto the streets.
Like all the random riots we have had over the years. People would see the army as the enemy.
People would resist calls for isolation. Chaos would soon follow.
The virus takes over again and now there is nothing to stop or limit it.
The figures we have now would look great in comparison.

We have no way of stopping this. Only trying to slow it or manage it.
They have said from the start that they know they have "one" shot at total isolation/lockdown.
Mistakes have been and will be made. But i think we are doing ok.

You're right about a full lock down not working in January. But there was no excuse for not doing it 8/9 days earlier when the true horrors of Italy and Madrid were panning out and most of Europe went into some kind of lock down. That time was crucial and the results will show in the next week. Considering the UK went into it with eyes wide open with the experiences of other country's experiences not locking down earlier was a big mistake.

And then when they went into lock down it was wishy washy with millions still working, using public transport and being allowed to go out to exercise. It was always going to be abused by the dickheads in society.

I can only imagine what would happen if here if people had lock ins or took the piss.
 
Only in an ideal world. (and there lies the problem)
First thing is people would need two weeks worth of food. Most poor people live day to day.
Panic buying started long before any lockdown was announced.
Medicine needs to be delivered. Who does that?
What about medical care? Some people need daily visits.
The old and infirm need care. Who does that?
What happens if somebodies heating system broke during the lockdown? Hard look?
Same if the electrics blew and they have electric cookers.
I could go on but i won't.

The real world doesn't live and work like it does in your argument.
Of course. Never suggested otherwise.
 
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