UEFA FFP investigation - CAS decision to be announced Monday, 13th July 9.30am BST

[BringBackSwales]

Exactly, what barca, bayern, rags, madrid, united want they will get. The changes will be designed around their needs.

Add dippers to that list

 

[BringBackSwales]

There’s a few people on here with more knowledge than me but I think - it’s reasonable to predict that there will be no live football before September. I think the behind closed doors scenario is a figment of the footballing authorities imagination. A behind closed door event is still going to involve probably two hundred people in the ground and it’ll be impossible to stop people assembling outside. By July the emergency and essential services will be on their knees - I don’t think supporting even behind closed door games is something that’ll be contemplated.

There are probably a few different financial models in play across the PL just now but The Rags and Spurs probably have the most to worry about. Both have huge debts that they will need to keep repaying regardless of their income loss - their lenders will be very twitchy just now. Some of their debts may be secured against future income like season ticket sales - I wonder how the banks are going to react to this? Securing more borrowing- which has been United's modus operandi under the Glazier’s is probably not an option. More worrying for United is that the crumbling Glazier Shopping Mall business probably has debts secured against United. United and Spurs both think they are safe because they have scale but whether you owe $1,000 or $1,000,000,0000,00000 if you can’t pay you can’t pay and the whole lot comes tumbling down. PL clubs will almost certainly have minimal income until September, even United merchandising empire will collapse, the network of sponsors will fall away as companies cost cut, Sky and BT will probably use this pandemic to their advantage to lengthen their contract and renegotiate their payments down. It all points to a significant reduction in revenue for all clubs but some clubs that are heavily leveraged won’t be able to cope with the loss in income. United’s monthly outgoings on transfer fees (players signed in the last 3 or 4 years with payments spread), their huge wage bill (the highest in PL history), interest payments, staff costs (United have more non playing staff than anyone else) and of course all other events like concerts cancelled... will need to be added to the headache of few people renewing season tickets until they know what’s going on. I honestly think a few of our rivals might financially unravel in the coming months. Buckle up blues - it could be fun.

In the words of Alan Partridge to the Geordie in the hotel, “WHAT???”

 

[tweety]

There’s a few people on here with more knowledge than me but I think - it’s reasonable to predict that there will be no live football before September. I think the behind closed doors scenario is a figment of the footballing authorities imagination. A behind closed door event is still going to involve probably two hundred people in the ground and it’ll be impossible to stop people assembling outside. By July the emergency and essential services will be on their knees - I don’t think supporting even behind closed door games is something that’ll be contemplated.

There are probably a few different financial models in play across the PL just now but The Rags and Spurs probably have the most to worry about. Both have huge debts that they will need to keep repaying regardless of their income loss - their lenders will be very twitchy just now. Some of their debts may be secured against future income like season ticket sales - I wonder how the banks are going to react to this? Securing more borrowing- which has been United's modus operandi under the Glazier’s is probably not an option. More worrying for United is that the crumbling Glazier Shopping Mall business probably has debts secured against United. United and Spurs both think they are safe because they have scale but whether you owe $1,000 or $1,000,000,0000,00000 if you can’t pay you can’t pay and the whole lot comes tumbling down. PL clubs will almost certainly have minimal income until September, even United merchandising empire will collapse, the network of sponsors will fall away as companies cost cut, Sky and BT will probably use this pandemic to their advantage to lengthen their contract and renegotiate their payments down. It all points to a significant reduction in revenue for all clubs but some clubs that are heavily leveraged won’t be able to cope with the loss in income. United’s monthly outgoings on transfer fees (players signed in the last 3 or 4 years with payments spread), their huge wage bill (the highest in PL history), interest payments, staff costs (United have more non playing staff than anyone else) and of course all other events like concerts cancelled... will need to be added to the headache of few people renewing season tickets until they know what’s going on. I honestly think a few of our rivals might financially unravel in the coming months. Buckle up blues - it could be fun.

 

[tweety]

Ffp is just background noise, clubs will live or die by their balance sheets. For those in debt when the banks come calling it is they who will determine the outcome.

 

[Colin Bells Boots]

"Relaxing the rules" is another in a long list of half baked soundbites from an organisation without a clue when it comes to anything other than lining their own pockets. Why would you relax rules which have been such unmitigated benefit to football as Woody Woodpecker claims? No doubt they'll relax them on a case by case basis to make sure only the very worthy benefit.

I only hope that it's the threat of continuous and sustained legal action from City that has thrown UEFA into complete panic.

And end ultimately in them being fucked up by the judiciary and nullified.

 

[Fred_Quimby]

Did I read somewhere that to help clubs with cash flow that the TV companies are going to pay clubs for the games already televised? No?
Oh.

 

[BluessinceHydeRoad]

There’s a few people on here with more knowledge than me but I think - it’s reasonable to predict that there will be no live football before September. I think the behind closed doors scenario is a figment of the footballing authorities imagination. A behind closed door event is still going to involve probably two hundred people in the ground and it’ll be impossible to stop people assembling outside. By July the emergency and essential services will be on their knees - I don’t think supporting even behind closed door games is something that’ll be contemplated.






I think September is more than a tad on the optimistic side, especially as we're being told already that the fear is of a resurgence of the virus in autumn. And when you look at your accurate "model" of a "behind closed doors" match it has to be asked what part of the present restrictions is NOT broken? Unnecessary travel? Size of grouping? Gatherings all from the same household? And so on. It's hard to see the government making a "sporting exception" to bail out a game which has come in for nothing but lectures on finance from Ministers and whose players have been called on to make sacrifices. And football authorities who seem determined to spit in the fans' eyes. It's also worth pointing out that money in the game has been a sore point with government at least since the days of Margaret Thatcher and I can't see football getting any favours from the present day bunch - especially with a European governing body determined to stop owners and shareholders dipping into their pockets.

 

[blueju]

There’s a few people on here with more knowledge than me but I think - it’s reasonable to predict that there will be no live football before September. I think the behind closed doors scenario is a figment of the footballing authorities imagination. A behind closed door event is still going to involve probably two hundred people in the ground and it’ll be impossible to stop people assembling outside. By July the emergency and essential services will be on their knees - I don’t think supporting even behind closed door games is something that’ll be contemplated.

There are probably a few different financial models in play across the PL just now but The Rags and Spurs probably have the most to worry about. Both have huge debts that they will need to keep repaying regardless of their income loss - their lenders will be very twitchy just now. Some of their debts may be secured against future income like season ticket sales - I wonder how the banks are going to react to this? Securing more borrowing- which has been United's modus operandi under the Glazier’s is probably not an option. More worrying for United is that the crumbling Glazier Shopping Mall business probably has debts secured against United. United and Spurs both think they are safe because they have scale but whether you owe $1,000 or $1,000,000,0000,00000 if you can’t pay you can’t pay and the whole lot comes tumbling down. PL clubs will almost certainly have minimal income until September, even United merchandising empire will collapse, the network of sponsors will fall away as companies cost cut, Sky and BT will probably use this pandemic to their advantage to lengthen their contract and renegotiate their payments down. It all points to a significant reduction in revenue for all clubs but some clubs that are heavily leveraged won’t be able to cope with the loss in income. United’s monthly outgoings on transfer fees (players signed in the last 3 or 4 years with payments spread), their huge wage bill (the highest in PL history), interest payments, staff costs (United have more non playing staff than anyone else) and of course all other events like concerts cancelled... will need to be added to the headache of few people renewing season tickets until they know what’s going on. I honestly think a few of our rivals might financially unravel in the coming months. Buckle up blues - it could be fun.

I think you’re barking up the wrong street, over the past few weeks they’ve been strongly linked to about 2bn worth of players all desperate to pull un that famous red shirt so there must be no issue with their finances

 

[Tim of the Oak]

There’s a few people on here with more knowledge than me but I think - it’s reasonable to predict that there will be no live football before September. I think the behind closed doors scenario is a figment of the footballing authorities imagination. A behind closed door event is still going to involve probably two hundred people in the ground and it’ll be impossible to stop people assembling outside. By July the emergency and essential services will be on their knees - I don’t think supporting even behind closed door games is something that’ll be contemplated.

There are probably a few different financial models in play across the PL just now but The Rags and Spurs probably have the most to worry about. Both have huge debts that they will need to keep repaying regardless of their income loss - their lenders will be very twitchy just now. Some of their debts may be secured against future income like season ticket sales - I wonder how the banks are going to react to this? Securing more borrowing- which has been United's modus operandi under the Glazier’s is probably not an option. More worrying for United is that the crumbling Glazier Shopping Mall business probably has debts secured against United. United and Spurs both think they are safe because they have scale but whether you owe $1,000 or $1,000,000,0000,00000 if you can’t pay you can’t pay and the whole lot comes tumbling down. PL clubs will almost certainly have minimal income until September, even United merchandising empire will collapse, the network of sponsors will fall away as companies cost cut, Sky and BT will probably use this pandemic to their advantage to lengthen their contract and renegotiate their payments down. It all points to a significant reduction in revenue for all clubs but some clubs that are heavily leveraged won’t be able to cope with the loss in income. United’s monthly outgoings on transfer fees (players signed in the last 3 or 4 years with payments spread), their huge wage bill (the highest in PL history), interest payments, staff costs (United have more non playing staff than anyone else) and of course all other events like concerts cancelled... will need to be added to the headache of few people renewing season tickets until they know what’s going on. I honestly think a few of our rivals might financially unravel in the coming months. Buckle up blues - it could be fun.

United think this crisis will be relatively good for them and they will be able to snap up top players at reduced transfer fees. Time will tell and debt levels could count against them and Spurs. However, if Utd were to really struggle there would probably be a queue of multi-billionaires willing to buy them, especially with a World Cup coming up in the Middle East in 2022 when the mega rich can show flaunt their assets.

Match day staff are being paid until the end of the season and Utd's season ticket and memorabilia sales are likely to hold up better than most Clubs because of the strength of their brand. If Utd's income really suffers then the likelihood is that everyone other Club's including our own will. Even Real Madrid and Barcelona are tightening their belts. I am not sure we can expect Sheikh Mansour to write blank cheques and football will need to return next season unless its impossible to do so on safety grounds.

 

[BluessinceHydeRoad]

West Ham shareholders putting £30 million into the club and deferring players'wages. Naughty boys (and girls?).

 

[Mancini Manus Domini]

United think this crisis will be relatively good for them and they will be able to snap up top players at reduced transfer fees. Time will tell and debt levels could count against them and Spurs. However, if Utd were to really struggle there would probably be a queue of multi-billionaires willing to buy them, especially with a World Cup coming up in the Middle East in 2022 when the mega rich can show flaunt their assets.

Match day staff are being paid until the end of the season and Utd's season ticket and memorabilia sales are likely to hold up better than most Clubs because of the strength of their brand. If Utd's income really suffers then the likelihood is that everyone other Club's including our own will. Even Real Madrid and Barcelona are tightening their belts. I am not sure we can expect Sheikh Mansour to write blank cheques and football will need to return next season unless its impossible to do so on safety grounds.

If this season is cancelled won't they suffer from reduced sponsorship with another season outside the Champions League?

 

[Tim of the Oak]

If this season is cancelled won't they suffer from reduced sponsorship with another season outside the Champions League?

They could well do unless the clause is covered by exceptional circumstances. However, if the League was cancelled (and not null and void) then they might only need a top 5 finish and they are fifth (with us currently banned from the Champs League for the next 2 years).

There are some Blues on this forum thinking we will do better out of this crisis than Utd whilst saying they won't renew season cards etc. are ignoring Utd's popularity across the globe and are taking Sheikh Mansour's investment for granted.

 

[waspish]

They could well do unless the clause is covered by exceptional circumstances. However, if the League was cancelled (and not null and void) then they might only need a top 5 finish and they are fifth (with us currently banned from the Champs League for the next 2 years).

There are some Blues on this forum thinking we will do better out of this crisis than Utd whilst saying they won't renew season cards etc. are ignoring Utd's popularity across the globe and are taking Sheikh Mansour's investment for granted.

One thing I think is for certain Mansour will won’t his football team to stay one the best in the world so I expect he will invest again after not putting a penny in the team/club for around four seasons.

 

[Mancini Manus Domini]

They could well do unless the clause is covered by exceptional circumstances. However, if the League was cancelled (and not null and void) then they might only need a top 5 finish and they are fifth (with us currently banned from the Champs League for the next 2 years).

There are some Blues on this forum thinking we will do better out of this crisis than Utd whilst saying they won't renew season cards etc. are ignoring Utd's popularity across the globe and are taking Sheikh Mansour's investment for granted.

If the season was cancelled it is much more likely to be declared null and void rather than the current positions being validated. How can Aston Villa be relegated when they had a game in hand.

I also believe that UEFA will have to allow us in next season's Champions League if we have not yet had our CAS hearing. The subsequent damages we could potentially claim would be a nightmare for them. If we were actually barred pending the appeal then a null and void season would see Arsenal get a Champions League spot, having finished 5th the previous season.

 

[Newman Noggs]

If we were actually barred pending the appeal then a null and void season would see Arsenal get a Champions League spot, having finished 5th the previous season.

Amazing coincidence that, whatever happens to this season, either united or arsenal would benefit from City being banned.

 

[Rochdale Blue]

Amazing coincidence that, whatever happens to this season, either united or arsenal would benefit from City being banned.

I think it was David Ornstein who claimed City have put aside £200 million to buy all the best young players in the world so we would dominate for the next decade. Assuming any policy decisions are made via webcast and Ornstein's claim was remotely true, are we being hacked again

 

[KS55]

I think it was David Ornstein who claimed City have put aside £200 million to buy all the best young players in the world so we would dominate for the next decade. Assuming any policy decisions are made via webcast and Ornstein's claim was remotely true, are we being hacked again

Probably bullshit.

 

[BluessinceHydeRoad]

Some football clubs will not survive the corona virus pandemic. The longer it goes on the greater the number of clubs which will not survive it and more and more the talk is not of "getting back to normal" but of having to come to terms with "a new normal". No-one knows what the consequences of this "new normal will be for our way of life and for a sport which depends on thousands of people coming together in a stadium we can't begin to imagine. Club revenues may take a very long time indeed to reach pre-pandemic levels, if they ever do. Clubs at every level are going to require owners and shareholders to put money into their club not only to maintain their status but simply to survive. UEFA's attempt to control the finances of clubs the length and breadth of Europe will stop being simply ridiculous and ignorant and will be ignorant and a dangerous existential threat, especially if it is applied inconsistently to suit the interests of a few clubs. In an extreme case, the cartel will not be threatening to break away, UEFA will be trying to persuade every other club to stay. The decision of West Ham's shareholders to put £30 million into the club is the first sign that some club owners will do what is necessary to support their club without waiting for vague details of UEFA's "relaxation of the rules" and if UEFA tries to do anything about it half the league at least will join us in court to stuff them.

 

[Rochdale Blue]

Probably bullshit.

Of course it is, but people like Ornstein are still regurgitating this nonsense. The other journo he was talking to stated ffp was good for the game, but not during the present situation, so he was actually defending clubs still millions in debt but who did nothing to insure or prepare for unseen disasters.

 

[Tim of the Oak]

One thing I think is for certain Mansour will won’t his football team to stay one the best in the world so I expect he will invest again after not putting a penny in the team/club for around four seasons.

Our Abu Dhabi sponsors put in at least tens of millions every year. This might not be the Sheikh’s money but they are his and Khaldoon’s contacts.

Sheikh Mansour will want us to be at the top but if our fans try to be too shrewd (eg not committing a penny towards season tickets until the last case of Coronavirus has gone) he might find somewhere else to invest.