Another new Brexit thread

[Banned Tosspot]

It must be terrible living in your world full of negativity and pessimism. I really do feel sorry for people like you who can only see negatives in everything. I hope you can find a little bit of enjoyment over this long weekend.

I stupidly unignored him.

He's back now.

 

[Blue Hefner]

I can’t see many people building factories to build cars post pandemic, in the middle of the biggest recession in 300 years

 

[mcfc1632]

It must be terrible living in your world full of negativity and pessimism. I really do feel sorry for people like you who can only see negatives in everything. I hope you can find a little bit of enjoyment over this long weekend.

Yet more sensitivity and empathy from one of us Leavers

Being naturally positive people it means that we have such attributes to share

 

[west didsblue]

I can’t see many people building factories to build cars post pandemic, in the middle of the biggest recession in 300 years

There might be a few shutting down though with production concentrated in the biggest market.

 

[mcfc1632]

My post here is intended essentially for the Leavers and those Remainers who make the effort of objective thought and analysis - I consider @Saddleworth2, to be such and there must be other such Remainers I am sure.

I do not wish to be seen as shutting down debate - that is left to others - but I would genuinely suggest that the majority of Remainers do not bother with this post or following the links. Treat it with the contempt that I am told my posts deserve - and please simply ignore it.

Going back to the months after the referendum there was a narrative attempted on here by the Remainers that Leavers are 'little Englanders' (which itself demonstrates a lack of understanding) and that Leavers were xenophobes who just wished 'ill' on the EU and hoped for it to collapse.

In fact I think that I have seen further daft posts like that only recently - I see it as just part of the pettiness of some Remainers that have always sought to characterise the Leavers as thick, racists etc.

I have many times sought to explain that this is not the case - I have explained that when the EU implosion/collapse does commence and picks up pace - then the UK will be badly affected whether we are still a member or have already left.

The main point though is that I and many others have had no doubt that the collapse will happen and that it is inevitable and, relatively, not long off. Therefore, the sooner that we are away and the cleaner that break is, then the better the chance that the impact to the UK will be less and the greater the chances of our recovery.

I want us away asap and I really really hope that the EU implosion is delayed - which will help us - but, as it will happen, it is essential that the EU are not allowed any influence/control over our economic and fiscal policies.

Anyway, I have chosen to make another post on this as I stumbled across a couple of videos that I thought gave a good explanation of just one of the number of reasons that the collapse of the EU is inevitable and is just being delayed.

The first clip is worth a listen - 19mins - but you need to have the time to concentrate on it - the 2nd half of it is when the penny starts to drop...………….

The 2nd link for me explains it much better - but it is 27mins long

You could almost feel sorry for the Germans:





These presentations were given in 2018 and it is worth considering that since then...……….

• Macron has started to be much more bullish about seeking to secure/tie in Germany to obligations to provide ongoing/perpetual support.....
• Germany has started to be less enamoured with what their role has developed into.....
• Christine Largarde has taken on leadership of the ECB - FFS!!!!

And................

• Covid-19 has occurred – and the EU has committed to........

Take the recent judgement by the German constitutional court and then consider how that will mean nothing once the ECJ asserts the supremacy that Germany gave them when it signed the Lisbon Treaty.... So the EU powerhouse Germany will start to become unable to control events.

https://www.ft.com/content/d93008c5-2b3c-4b2e-9499-5eabaaa959db

Add 2 and 2 and it turns out to equal - that Germany could/will be fucked along with the rest of the EU construct. As I say, you could almost feel sorry for them.

Of course if some Remainers have ignored my request not to follow the links - then I can predict their response.............

"But it does not matter – the UK is not in the Eurozone" – which will of course just further demonstrate their lack of understanding

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

Because thats what people do on here - if someone doesn't agree with their point of view just attack them - make up a persona so that others pile in on it.

The point I was seeking to make is the Pandemic - we know that will seriously damage the economy - the Brexit - that was already set to do harm to the economy now we seek to leave and supposedly trade with the rest of the world who will be similarly reeling from the effects of the pandemic so don't just assume we will remain their biggest market.

Now - you could have responded with a cogent argument as to how thats not the case and how its going to be brilliant but no instead avoid answering the unanswerable question and attack the poster.

It wasn't an attack as such. I was just saying how I find you. You come across as quite a negative and pessimistic person. It helps people sometimes if they know how they appear to others. So use it to your advantage.

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

I stupidly unignored him.

He's back now.

He's quite defensive when it's simply pointed out that he comes across as very negative. Almost in denial.

 

[Vic]

Have I got this right? Thinking this will end badly for the UK is "negative" but 40 years of negative publicity (and lies) about the EU is "positive"?

 

[west didsblue]

Have I got this right? Thinking this will end badly for the UK is "negative" but 40 years of negative publicity (and lies) about the EU is "positive"?

It’s a Boris thing. All we need is vim and positive energy. Anyone who thinks otherwise is a doomster or gloomster. Never mind that we haven’t been told why things are going to be great. They just are and anyone that wants to know the detail is just being negative.

 

[Bovril]

My post here is intended essentially for the Leavers and those Remainers who make the effort of objective thought and analysis - I consider @Saddleworth2, to be such and there will be other such Remainers I am sure.

I do not wish to be seen as shutting down debate - that is left to others - but I would genuinely suggest that the majority of Remainers do not bother with this post or following the links. Treat it with the contempt that I am told my posts deserve - and please simply ignore it.

Going back to the months after the referendum there was a narrative attempted on here by the Remainers that Leavers are 'little Englanders' (which itself demonstrates a lack of understanding) and that Leavers were xenophobes who just wished 'ill' on the EU and hoped for it to collapse.

In fact I think that I have seen further daft posts like that only recently - I see it as just part of the pettiness of some Remainers that have always sought to characterise the Leavers as thick, racists etc.

I have many times sought to explain that this is not the case - I have explained that when the EU implosion/collapse does commence and picks up pace - then the UK will be badly affected whether we are still a member or have already left.

The main point though is that I and many others have had no doubt that the collapse will happen and that it is inevitable and, relatively, not long off. Therefore, the sooner that we are away and the cleaner that break is, then the better the chance that the impact to the UK will be less and the greater the chances of our recovery.

I want us away asap and I really really hope that the EU implosion is delayed - which will help us - but, as it will happen, it is essential that the EU are not allowed any influence/control over our economic and fiscal policies.

Anyway, I have chosen to make another post on this as I stumbled across a couple of videos that I thought gave a good explanation of just one of the number of reasons that the collapse of the EU is inevitable and is just being delayed.

The first clip is worth a listen - 19mins - but you need to have the time to concentrate on it - the 2nd half of it is when the penny starts to drop...………….

The 2nd link for me explains it much better - but it is 27mins long

You could almost feel sorry for the Germans:





These presentations were given in 2018 and it is worth considering that since then...……….

• Macron has started to be much more bullish about seeking to secure/tie in Germany to obligations to provide ongoing/perpetual support.....
• Germany has started to be less enamoured with what their role has developed into.....
• Christine Largarde has taken on leadership of the ECB - FFS!!!!

And................

• Covid-19 has occurred – and the EU has committed to........

Take the recent judgement by the German constitutional court and then consider how that will mean nothing once the ECJ asserts the supremacy that Germany gave them when it signed the Lisbon Treaty.... So the EU powerhouse Germany will start to become unable to control events.

https://www.ft.com/content/d93008c5-2b3c-4b2e-9499-5eabaaa959db

Add 2 and 2 and that equals that Germany could/will be fucked along with the rest of the EU construct. As I say, you could almost feel sorry for them.

Of course if some Remainers have ignored my request not to follow the links - then I can predict their response.............

"But it does not matter – the UK is not in the Eurozone" – which will of course just further demonstrate their lack of understanding

The silence is deafening.

 

[Saddleworth2]

The silence is deafening.

Fair play mate, give us time to watch it!

 

[mcfc1632]

The silence is deafening.

They will not like straight forward and undeniable facts....

Some will think.....

Others will not be able to be quiet - so will post no matter the embarrassment to themselves

TBF - most of them have never understood the real issues and have just been posting in some tribal manner.

I can think of only a couple of Remainers on here that have shown any basic grasp of the long-term strategic outcomes - and therefore can understand why the UK needs to get free ASAP.

Also, TBF, I am sure that a lot of Leave voters in 2016 did not understand them either.

It may be a political forum - but it is after all a football forum.

Myself and other Leavers have tried to help - but tribalism = ignorance is bliss it seems

 

[bluethrunthru]

whether we are still a member or have already left.

31/1/20

 

[mcfc1632]

31/1/20

I meant in reality rather than technically

Which = not being bound to the EUs perpetual control over our key policies.

TBF - you were one of the 4 or 5 Remainers that I had in mind when requesting /suggesting that you ignore my post.

Please do us both a favour and treat it with contempt and ignore it

That will save one of us irritation and the other embarrassment

 

[Bovril]

They will not like straight forward and undeniable facts....

Some will think.....

Others will not be able to be quiet - so will post no matter the embarrassment to themselves

TBF - most of them have never understood the real issues and have just been posting in some tribal manner.

I can think of only a couple of Remainers on here that have shown any basic grasp of the long-term strategic outcomes - and therefore can understand why the UK needs to get free ASAP.

Also, TBF, I am sure that a lot of Leave voters in 2016 did not understand them either.

It may be a political forum - but it is after all a football forum.

Myself and other Leavers have tried to help - but tribalism = ignorance is bliss it seems

A nice change on the political thread to actually debate without posters trying to de-rail (although its not just on the political thread). Anyway, I lived in Germany from 1985 until 2010 my ex wife is German and my daughter is still there. My ex father-in-law is an economist and very switched on we still chat frequently(it was a good divorce believe it or not). He first mentioned target 2 and the consequences to me just after we voted leave, although he still gets annoyed that we voted out as he thinks without the British influence the EU is doomed his words not mine. He is very worried about target 2, as he pointed out the same as the chap on the video how can Germany have all this money owed on paper when it will not and cannot ever be paid. Interesting times ahead looking forward to finding out how and where the commission are going to raise the 1.5 Trillion they have promised post CV-19.

 

[bluethrunthru]

I meant in reality

That is the reality - look it up - we ceased to be an EU member.

 

[mcfc1632]

That is the reality - look it up - we ceased to be an EU member.

I could respond with.....

OK then - I meant in 'practical' terms which means that the EU could no longer exercise control over the UK......

But, instead, if I reply......

Yes - sorry you are spot on and I feel so embarrassed that I was ever stupid enough to entangle myself with such an intellectual giant as yourself - please forgive me....

Would you then fuck off and leave me alone?

 

[west didsblue]

The silence is deafening.

Most people can't be arsed engaging with 1632. Check his last 2 responses if you want to know why. He wants an echo chamber and will sneer at anyone who counters anything he posts.

 

[bluethrunthru]

I could respond with.....

OK then - I meant in 'practical' terms which means that the EU could no longer exercise control over the UK......

But, instead, if I reply......

Yes - sorry you are spot on and I feel so embarrassed that I was ever stupid enough to entangle myself with such an intellectual giant as yourself - please forgive me....

Would you then fuck off and leave me alone?

sadly you have recognised the economic self harm Brexit will cause ( never mind the effect of the pandemic ) but can't admit it so to rationalise you have to believe that the EU - who we would heavily rely on for trade - will collapse. Thats because mutual assured destruction is better than admitting Brexit is fucked up.

Its quite pathetic really - its like a bloke splitting up from his Mrs and shitting bricks coz her new fella might be more handsome, have better prospects, a better job, a better car and make her happier than you ever did. The split only works if her future is no better than yours - if you are going to be miserable she cannot be happy.

 

[Bovril]

Most people can't be arsed engaging with 1632. Check his last 2 responses if you want to know why. He wants an echo chamber and will sneer at anyone who counters anything he posts.

Fair enough, I'm not on this thread enough to know, I just commented because as my post says I knew about target 2 which is not widely known about, those 2 videos are worth a watch for a better understanding, stay safe bud.