2020 US Elections

[kaz7]

This thread is unreadable with the trump apologist in full flow

 

[Bigga]

If he mis spoke a bunch of one brain called rednecks took it as a call to arms and he doesn’t seem to be rushing to say he did.

'One brain called rednecks' are 'One brain called rednecks' and they're not gonna need much to get them to crawl out out of their shit pits.

It was dumb and I'm sure he'll try and reverse his gaffe/ stupidity.

 

[pudge]

#45 did exactly what he set out to do, like it or not.

It was HIGHLY predictable and anyone who thought there was going to be a 'debate' doesn't understand the stakes at play, full stop.

So, by that metric #45 did well.

Sorry but that's simply not true, by no metric did Trump do well.

His base will love his rambling and demeanour but his base is not enough to win. He needs to win over independent voters like in '16 and he didn't do that last night.

At the absolute best for him, he kept the needle stood still for both sides. Which is bad for him.

If a basketball team is losing by 8 points then proceed to shit all over the court and scoot over it like a dog, they haven't scored any points and are still losing by 8. That's what Trump did.

 

[The perfect fumble]

Well, let's get it straight; I DID support someone other than the president.

I did not support a party that voted in sync with its opposition favouring corporations over the citizen and I've been pretty consistent with that POV.

You will find the Dem party have also voted in many of the GOP picks for judges as they did for tax bailouts and COVID relief funds.

Even Biden doesn't oppose the choice for Supreme Court, he's clear as day saying it. His issue is to 'let the people decide' and that's not his choice to make.

The US is where it is with their own unwritten rules of 'honour and decency' and the Dems keep handing over their lunch money every day.

The Dems, you could argue, created and handed the keys over to #45.

They were happy a mad man gave them tax cuts for themselves and their donors.

They're a shit party and complicit in the demise of the US.

Demise of what? What exactly have the Democrats been complicit in killing? I'd like to know. What golden age are you referring to when you use the word demise? The Eisenhower years? The New Deal?

Surely from your perspective there's nothing to demise, it's same as it ever was, only with a more ghastly villain.

 

[Bigga]

It's a complex subject and I only have time to skim read these articles but the chart alone in your linked article appears to suggest that incarceration increased dramatically between 1975 and 1996 and then levelled off around then so there was a significant challenge to the governments in the late eighties and early nineties you would imagine. Your article points out the parts of the bill that have since been lauded and got support from people like Bernie Sanders to allow the bill to pass. These politicians are also, in part guilty, if it is such a bad set of laws, they could have stopped it then could they not.

Unfortunately I don't know enough about the context and etymology of the word predators and super-predators and its relevance to racism from 1994 up to the current day. It's not a word I instantly relate to racism myself but of course in the US it sounds as if it's a much different issue. I am sure it never originally meant to be a derogatory term towards non-white people but at some point it has gained that status and like a lot of things continues to gain new meaning.

I'm not going to address the first part of your post as there are sections I agree with and disagree with and I don't want to get tangled in the weeds of it, but there are reasons why Sanders voted in line with it.

As for the second paragraph, the Dem 'leadership' used those terms 'predators' and 'super predators' in a language similar to 'The Southern Strategy' in swapping certain words out to talk about a section of people.

In 1981, Republican strategist and supporter of Reagan, Lee Atwater said this cited from wikipedia:

You start out in 1954 by saying, "******, ******, ******." By 1968 you can't say "******"—that hurts you. Backfires. So you say stuff like forced busing, states' rights and all that stuff. You're getting so abstract now [that] you're talking about cutting taxes, and all these things you're talking about are totally economic things and a byproduct of them is [that] blacks get hurt worse than whites. And subconsciously maybe that is part of it.

The Dems in the following period acted very similarly in using coded words to say what they needed to say as they couldn't use a demographic as a whole. If you viewed Black media, in the main, this is understood.

And I understand why this is sidestepped in the MSM as I can't recall anyone asking what Clinton and Biden meant by those terms as a direct question.

 

[Bigga]

Sorry but that's simply not true, by no metric did Trump do well.

His base will love his rambling and demeanour but his base is not enough to win. He needs to win over independent voters like in '16 and he didn't do that last night.

At the absolute best for him, he kept the needle stood still for both sides. Which is bad for him.

If a basketball team is losing by 8 points then proceed to shit all over the court and scoot over it like a dog, they haven't scored any points and are still losing by 8. That's what Trump did.

Sure, he didn't score any more points using your analogy, so what he did was try and injure the opponent enough to try and get into their head for the next game in the series.

 

[Bigga]

Demise of what? What exactly have the Democrats been complicit in killing? I'd like to know. What golden age are you referring to when you use the word demise? The Eisenhower years? The New Deal?

Surely from your perspective there's nothing to demise, it's same as it ever was, only with a more ghastly villain.

You know what, that's a fair point.

It's a bit like saying 'Make America Great Again' and asking 'but when was it great before?'.

 

[mat]

https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2020/09/pelosi-makes-plans-for-house-election-of-president.html

 

[Phil1]

Trump supporters no longer care what he says or does. They treat every fuck up he makes when opening his mouth as a badge of honor. We are way way past them engaging their brains, showing common sense and civility.
Alls we can hope for is enough voters turn out who haven't been brainwashed by the lying, racist **** and see his power grab fail.
If he wins, everybody whose not in his pocket or a complete tosser, loses. Its madness that its been allowed to come to this.

 

[SWP's back]

You're fucking insane.

What your saying is "Yeah, sure the Republicans and Trump are ransacking the country, killing people and fucking everything up, but the Democrats didn't break longstanding rules to stop them, so really it's all the same".

No! It's not the fucking same!

You live in this fantasy where there's a 3rd powerful party that'll fix everything and throw out both real parties. That party doesn't exist, and sitting around pretending both parties are as bad as each other is literally something the Republicans have spent billions trying to convince people in order to disenfranchise them.

He’s Cambridge Analytica’s wet dream.

 

[pudge]

Sure, he didn't score any more points using your analogy, so what he did was try and injure the opponent enough to try and get into their head for the next game in the series.

I can't agree with that, I don't think he landed a single punch.

 

[SWP's back]

The fact that you take the effort to find the bit where you think he might have misspoken in the sea of vitriolic diarrhoea that comes out of his mouth explains what you're all about. And it's nothing to do with being objective.

Can you imagine Bigga defending Trump on that if it was Bernie, not Biden, stood ten feet away? Can you hell as like.

 

[TheRemainsOfTheDave]

I'm not going to address the first part of your post as there are sections I agree with and disagree with and I don't want to get tangled in the weeds of it, but there are reasons why Sanders voted in line with it.

As for the second paragraph, the Dem 'leadership' used those terms 'predators' and 'super predators' in a language similar to 'The Southern Strategy' in swapping certain words out to talk about a section of people.

In 1981, Republican strategist and supporter of Reagan, Lee Atwater said this cited from wikipedia:


The Dems in the following period acted very similarly in using coded words to say what they needed to say as they couldn't use a demographic as a whole. If you viewed Black media, in the main, this is understood.

And I understand why this is sidestepped in the MSM as I can't recall anyone asking what Clinton and Biden meant by those terms as a direct question.

I'd need to see evidence of this but again the meaning of words changes over time, especially in politics as new awareness and political correctness (both welcome) take hold. If you're taking analysis from someone else's writings because you weren't around at the time then I'd be very wary of this because frankly, anyone can write about anything with a new angle.

Going back to the debate, I don't think Trump has anything to gain from it anyway. If he wants to delve into people's cupboards for skeletons then I hope he goes ahead because he's got poor form on that. Most people realise that 2020 is not 1994 when it comes to political decisions. Now crime, that's different.

 

[The perfect fumble]

You know what, that's a fair point.

It's a bit like saying 'Make America Great Again' and asking 'but when was it great before?'.

I posted a while back that there will be those who see this as neoliberalism collapsing in on itself, under the weight of its own contradictions, and nothing should be done to disrupt this process, because it's only out of the ashes that a new world order will emerge.

"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake"

 

[FogBlueInSanFran]

Can you imagine Bigga defending Trump on that if it was Bernie, not Biden, stood ten feet away? Can you hell as like.

Of course you can't. If that was Bernie up there he'd have been giving us blow-by-blow descriptions of every Trump sentence and there'd be blood in every post.

 

[DrBlueBob]

'One brain called rednecks' are 'One brain called rednecks' and they're not gonna need much to get them to crawl out out of their shit pits.

It was dumb and I'm sure he'll try and reverse his gaffe/ stupidity.

I don't share your optimism but very happy to be proven wrong.

 

[DrBlueBob]

I'm not going to address the first part of your post as there are sections I agree with and disagree with and I don't want to get tangled in the weeds of it, but there are reasons why Sanders voted in line with it.

As for the second paragraph, the Dem 'leadership' used those terms 'predators' and 'super predators' in a language similar to 'The Southern Strategy' in swapping certain words out to talk about a section of people.

In 1981, Republican strategist and supporter of Reagan, Lee Atwater said this cited from wikipedia:


The Dems in the following period acted very similarly in using coded words to say what they needed to say as they couldn't use a demographic as a whole. If you viewed Black media, in the main, this is understood.

And I understand why this is sidestepped in the MSM as I can't recall anyone asking what Clinton and Biden meant by those terms as a direct question.

Agreed. Would you say that the Republicans are innocent of using the same coded language?

 

[cjn]

Had a good laugh over my coffee this morning reading the usual suspects bend over backwards to defend Trump's commentary on his fascist paramilitary friends. Pathetic stuff.

 

[FogBlueInSanFran]

Had a good laugh over my coffee this morning reading the usual suspects bend over backwards to defend Trump's commentary on his fascist paramilitary friends. Pathetic stuff.

Yes I am WILLING to agree with you . . .

FFS.

 

[inbetween]

Sorry but that's simply not true, by no metric did Trump do well.

His base will love his rambling and demeanour but his base is not enough to win. He needs to win over independent voters like in '16 and he didn't do that last night.

At the absolute best for him, he kept the needle stood still for both sides. Which is bad for him.

If a basketball team is losing by 8 points then proceed to shit all over the court and scoot over it like a dog, they haven't scored any points and are still losing by 8. That's what Trump did.

Trump was a shameful liar, particularly when attacking Biden's son yet rather unbelievably he came out of that debate relatively unscathed.

The most interesting thing is 70% of those polled found the debate to be annoying whilst only 17% found it informative but information should of been Bidens bread and butter.

If I was Biden I'd be rethinking my strategy on approaching the debates because the only way he can win the election is by evaluating what he brings to the table rather than what Trump doesn't.

If only 17% think that they got anything out of the debate then he has completely failed.